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Episode Review: Sword Art Online II


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SilverTalon01



Joined: 02 Apr 2012
Posts: 2401
PostPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2014 3:07 pm Reply with quote
I think you guys are missing the point on Asuna's comment. Yes, she was fighting desperately early on in SAO. That wasn't because of her family. Her reason at the time was that she refused to sit around and wait in the starting area which isn't really much of a reason. So her saying now that she didn't really know why she was fighting so hard is absolutely consistent.

Basically, she is admiring that Agil has a reason he not only wanted to fight, but survive and escape. Asuna didn't have that so she recklessly went out not caring if she died or not (and very nearly did). Then she is saying how Kirito basically saved her from her own recklessness by showing her it wasn't so bad in SAO starting really from that cream on floor 1.

And I'm shocked that you have avoided spoilers since the biggest one anyone could possibly have said about this arc was posted unmarked in an article earlier this year. Though it was about some SAO merchandise I think, so maybe not as many people care enough to click.
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jr240483



Joined: 24 Dec 2005
Posts: 4369
Location: New York City,New York,USA
PostPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2014 5:17 pm Reply with quote
Key wrote:
While I have sometimes disagreed heavily with Nick's take on SAO episodes, I do almost completely agree with him on episode 18. I also took a pause at Asuna's comments about her reason for fighting in Aincard and also thought that the episode seemed to be struggling to avoid just being a "talking heads" episode. And I am also concerned with the intimations about Asuna's family having a significant role here, and for the same reasons Nick mentioned.

Still, I'm fine with having the occasional "the gang just hangs out" episode and am especially pleased that Asuna is finally getting featured screen time again. I also thought the images in the closer - which seemed to show Asuna wearing a shoulder-mounted camera - were intriguing. Have no idea where this story arc might go (I have somehow managed to avoid spoilers on it so far), but as long as Asuna is in the driver's seat, I'm on board.


which is why SOME fans love the mother's rosario arc and despises the fairy dance arc. People outside the otaku community would have been ok if it was Shinon that had the romance with kirito since she's a likable character , but detest of a pairing with lefa(suguha) even though i would be all for that idea as them being a couple.

though there is a reason why this arc is the most favorite of the series. hopefully this series is faithful towards the manga otherwise there are gonna be some serious griping at the end.
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Purpadude



Joined: 09 Nov 2014
Posts: 14
PostPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2014 10:59 pm Reply with quote
ChibiKangaroo wrote:
I guess Nick didn't pick up on the same cues I did, spoiler[since he kept referring to the new character as "swordsman.]" Smile


I don't think those were subtle enough to be called cues. They were really bashing the audience over the head with gender neutral pronouns, and SAO has not gotten through a season without introducing A New Girl.

That said, this arc is going against the grain by revisiting an old one.
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XerBlade
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Joined: 11 Jul 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 09, 2014 11:08 pm Reply with quote
Purpadude wrote:
ChibiKangaroo wrote:
I guess Nick didn't pick up on the same cues I did, spoiler[since he kept referring to the new character as "swordsman.]" Smile


I don't think those were subtle enough to be called cues. They were really bashing the audience over the head with gender neutral pronouns, and SAO has not gotten through a season without introducing A New Girl.

That said, this arc is going against the grain by revisiting an old one.

Problems with localization, I assure you. Avoiding using gender-specific terms is far easier in Japanese than it is in English (but still far easier in English than it is in the Romance languages: I can only imagine how incredibly unsubtle and odd the Spanish subtitles read, I'm almost curious to go check now that I've thought about it). Actually, if anything was unsubtle to the max on that point no matter the language, it was the ending visuals that were transitioned straight into from all that stuff that serve to completely and obviously give away even Zekken's appearance before that "twist" can come up next episode (although not her name, not that there's real big significance in that).

By the way, to Nick (and the poster who was agreeing with him on the family-related point), you'll be pleased to learn that the Asuna's family thing is a minor subplot in this arc and definitely not the focus (the focus is squarely on Zekken... Anime cry ), as well as that the whole "arranged marriage" thing is not even that, something that isn't even a thing really.
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Kigosh



Joined: 26 Sep 2014
Posts: 18
PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2014 2:08 pm Reply with quote
Key wrote:
I also took a pause at Asuna's comments about her reason for fighting in Aincard




I think Mother`s Rosario is the first Arc where Asuna gets some fair amout of character development. Nick is right that Asunas remark on her reason to fight in Aincrad seems to be contrary to her initial character portrait. But one of the problems I had with Asunas character in the Aincrad Arc was that we never knew the reason why she fought. Yes, she pushed the frontlines and was trying to escape from SAO like a maniac, but the show never told us why or if she had particular reasons for it. For Kirito on the other hand, it was first about survival. His first priority was never to clear the game, for that he would have had to join a guild and collaborate with others. He wanted to become strong in order to survive. Only then came clearing the game. But the show gave in his case some hints about his family and that he wanted to return to it (them?). Take the episode with Silica for example where he tells her that she reminded him of his little sister.

Thats why I thought it was odd when it was Asuna who proposed to take vacation from the front lines in order to spend some time with Kirito. And it was her who was reluctant to go back to the fight. She was it, who wanted to stay in that cabin forever and even thought about settling down. Again, we never knew why, besides that she wanted to spend some time with her boyfriend, which she could have done in RL, too, after clearing the game. It is only now that we get a hint on her motivation. She never wanted to go back because of her family; she simply wanted to escape the cruel death game.

The problem is that Asuna never got any kind of characterization in the first season whatsoever. That’s why now, when the show actually tries to characterize her a little bit, we get confused because we spot contradictions to her actions of the first season, whose motivation we never really knew to begin with. But I agree that this is sloppy writing, because Asuna should have used a few more lines to explain her motivation for fighting in the beginning. With only one sentence it is understandable that it will seem like a contradiction to her previous characterization.


But I agree with the rest of the review completely. The exposition dragged on for too long without anything happening. But I am hopeful to see how the show handles Asunas character (for the first time) in this Arc.
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jojothepunisher



Joined: 04 Sep 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 8:33 pm Reply with quote
HELL YA! Its about time this show gets good review. SAO will only get better and better from this point onwards.
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XerBlade
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 8:59 pm Reply with quote
Asuna's mother isn't the main antagonist of this arc. I'm just saying (actually, questions about believable antagonists kinda go out the window with this arc's main antagonist, because it doesn't get much more real and grounded than this antagonist). And, to cut off any further confusion, the arc name is not referring to Asuna's mother either.
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HaruhiToy



Joined: 15 Apr 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 10:11 pm Reply with quote
XerBlade wrote:
Asuna's mother isn't the main antagonist of this arc.

The episode 19 review summed it up quite nicely.

Asuna seems to spend a lot of her time in a cage one way or another. Am I the only one hoping that she and her mother can reconcile somehow? In spite of the cold bitchiness (arrive 5 minutes early girl) of it I got the feeling that Asuna's mother does actually care for her.
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Gina Szanboti



Joined: 03 Aug 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 11:18 pm Reply with quote
XerBlade wrote:
you'll be pleased to learn that the Asuna's family thing is a minor subplot in this arc and definitely not the focus (the focus is squarely on Zekken... Anime cry ), as well as that the whole "arranged marriage" thing is not even that, something that isn't even a thing really.

XerBlade wrote:
Asuna's mother isn't the main antagonist of this arc. ... And, to cut off any further confusion, the arc name is not referring to Asuna's mother either.

I would be pleased to learn these things when the anime decides to make them clear. What I am not pleased about is you showing off your knowledge of the source material in this anime discussion and "setting us straight" about what we may speculate on or not. You enjoyed the pleasure of discovery as you read the LN, so why are you so determined to deny us anime-only viewers the same pleasure?

As to the episode, it was gratifying to see Asuna stand up for herself, although her mom really is a brick wall when Asuna hits too close to home. Smile
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mops515



Joined: 16 Nov 2014
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Location: Canada
PostPosted: Sun Nov 16, 2014 1:33 am Reply with quote
jojothepunisher wrote:
HELL YA! Its about time this show gets good review. SAO will only get better and better from this point onwards.


I wouldn't be so sure about that. If people are bemoaning bad writing in a show, a good review is likely more due to luck than the show getting better.

But who knows? Maybe the show will start picking it up from here on out.
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Fate_Tsukihime



Joined: 29 Nov 2009
Posts: 7
PostPosted: Sun Nov 16, 2014 3:42 am Reply with quote
>Kicked out the hacked shithead Kirito and his stupid harem
>Replace the OP with Yuuki and Asuna aweasome sword dance
>Sword Art Online redeem itself with a brand new story.

Okay. I'll give some hope to the new Arc. Hopefully, no more shitty male character.
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SilverTalon01



Joined: 02 Apr 2012
Posts: 2401
PostPosted: Sun Nov 16, 2014 4:21 am Reply with quote
Kigosh wrote:
Nick is right that Asunas remark on her reason to fight in Aincrad seems to be contrary to her initial character portrait. But one of the problems I had with Asunas character in the Aincrad Arc was that we never knew the reason why she fought.

That’s why now, when the show actually tries to characterize her a little bit, we get confused because we spot contradictions to her actions of the first season, whose motivation we never really knew to begin with.


But he isn't because they aren't. What she said was that she knew there was no guarantee of eternal safety in the starting town and refused to do nothing while death came to her.

There is no contradiction to spot. We were never told more than that originally, and what we were told in this arc actually confirms there was nothing more to it.

The only thing these lines could be contrary to are assumptions made by the audience about her reasons for fighting in SAO.

And that scene you're talking about, you're missing part of it. She was actually torn between wanting to fight and not wanting to fight. As she tells Kirito the next episode when they do go back and find out what is going on with that floor boss, she also knows that they will eventually die in the real world if they are stuck in the game for too long. She didn't want to risk losing what she had at the moment and is torn between that and her initial reason to fight that she doesn't like the idea of sitting there and doing nothing as death comes for her.
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_Cyphon_



Joined: 16 Nov 2014
Posts: 996
PostPosted: Sun Nov 16, 2014 1:36 pm Reply with quote
Fate_Tsukihime wrote:
>Kicked out the hacked shithead Kirito and his stupid harem
>Replace the OP with Yuuki and Asuna aweasome sword dance
>Sword Art Online redeem itself with a brand new story.

Okay. I'll give some hope to the new Arc. Hopefully, no more shitty male character.


I seriously don't understand why people hate Kirito so much. Sure, he was very op and pretty much dominated everyone in SAO, but that's no reason to hate him. It seems to me that PKers in Aincrad would level up slower than grinders who explore and battle, no? The red players who attacked him probably grinded very little and instead focused on PKing others. I personally enjoyed his character very much in SAO I because of his "lone wolf" attitude that he expresses when he proclaimed himself the "Beater" of the game. He wasn't afraid to work alone. He was cool, strong, and dependable. The second half had problems (mostly the attempted sexual assault and stuff), but I could tolerate it. Some people say its incest, but Sugu and Kirito aren't really related. At least she looked different while in ALO. I liked that SAO focused a bit more on the relationships rather than the overall plot, conflicts, or fight scenes. I've already had enough of the shounen "Big Three".

The second season, however, was less thrilling. This was mainly because of Kirito, our main lead. He went from this overpowered awesome badass player who would kill without hesitance to protect others.... to this feminized version that was less cool and more ridiculous. I think his reaction to Death Gun being a former SAO player was a bit over. And every time he got close to Sinon I just wanted to yell in his face, "YOU ALREADY HAVE ASUNA!!!!!!!! WHAT ARE YOU DOING?????!!!!!!" *sigh*

Caliber compensated for the first half of SAO II a little bit. It brought back the Kirito we once knew in the first season and had a new character in the team. Overall it was good. I'm a tad bit nervous with Mother's Rosario because the opening leads me to believe that Kirito will not be in it, but it's redempting quality is that Asuna is going to be lead (I think). Overall I am still excited for more episodes and will continue to be a loyal SAO fan. I just hope no more sexual assault or forced marriage thing happens. I'm speaking for all the Kirito x Asuna fans out there. Those three kids in episode 19 who were at the party were really creepy.

"It's tough being a rich girl, isn't it?" - Liz
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SilverTalon01



Joined: 02 Apr 2012
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 22, 2014 10:30 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
There frankly isn't that much to say about this episode - it proceeded at a reasonable clip, introduced a fairly low-stakes but nonetheless entertaining conflict, and progressed the narrative without any real highlights or stumbles. Episodes like this make me think mild, nonthreatening vignettes were actually what Sword Art Online always should have been.

The central conflict of this arc is about as light as they come - though various bits of ominous framing in the introductory scene made it clear that this boss fight means a great deal to Yuuki, there aren't any lives hanging in the balance or anything this time.


Sounds like you are greatly underestimating this arc and putting it on the level of the Excalibur episodes. Unlike Excal, this arc is a full light novel. Pretty sure you're actually missing what is being introduced and what the central conflict of the arc is which is fine because it is still being built up, but you should probably wait before sticking those key labels like 'central conflict' on stuff. And really this is only episode 20 so I'm not sure why you are suggesting it would be the central conflict.

Quote:
Sword Art Online rarely feels particularly real as a videogame (even within this episode, the idea that Yuuki's players would be used as scouts by raiding guilds is a pretty ridiculous twist), so any realistic details like this are a welcome change.


Uh, I'm pretty sure this isn't the first time you have said something like that about real games and been wrong. Sitting back with a group while your guild gets people together to attempt a non-instanced raid boss, watching another guild go in to fail, and then using what you see to make your strat certainly did happen. There really wasn't a way to stop that either... though its not like you had to res them if they got killed from an AE either which would usually mean a brutal corpse run.

Actually that isn't even relevant just to raid bosses. Even a group encounter you might wait and watch another group pull, and go in after they wipe.

Sounds like you're just stuck on comparing SAO's mechanics to more recent games and are forgetting that SAO predates them.
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maxlance



Joined: 30 Jan 2011
Posts: 50
PostPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2014 4:07 pm Reply with quote
Seasons Greetings

Mother's Rosary is a welcome change and brings in a little humanity into the series and gives a little down-to-earth jab at our heroes VR adventures. In the light novel "Girls Op", Liz mentions to a new VR player that SAO gamers who returned to VRMMO games after all they endured in SAO just have to be more than a little bit odd and strange, which is a welcome admission and brings a bit of understanding to Asuna's mom's feelings.

Avoiding a fringe Mother’s Rosary Spoiler Ahead!!!

I'll be very vague here... I read Rosary and I can’t prove this and it’s only a wild guess and hope (so don't flame me on just surmising please) but I think there’s a future story escape hatch at the very end that exploits a very interesting (and unrequired) tie-in with Kayaba technology (at least in the light novel). Kawahara didn't have to include this mention but that he bothered to is interesting to me.

MaxL
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