Forum - View topicAre Japanese High Schools really that bad?
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chrisb
 Subscriber Posts: 617 Location: USA |
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In anime, J-dramas and manga, it seems like once you get on the wrong person's bad side, your high school life is doomed to intense bullying, rape, and suicide. I've heard from Japanese friends that the high school "scene" in Japan is pretty hard to be a part of and that bullying and teasing are worse over there than here (I've heard it's really bad in Korea and China.)
I've been fortunate enough that through my course through high school I was never bullied or teased on, and I'll admit I parcipitated in some but it was something I regret and will apologize for if I ever get the chance, and it was never as bad as what I see in Japanese media. Also, is it true that Japanese high school students have a bad issue with suicide and cutting? In reports I've read it's a big issue among Japanese girls where cutting is as normal as brushing their teeth. I've never seen INTENSE bullying anywhere except in Japanese dramas and anime/manga so I was wondering if it was really that bad in Asia, and is it at times like that in America too? Last edited by chrisb on Mon Jul 09, 2007 2:35 am; edited 1 time in total |
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KyuuA4
 Posts: 1361 Location: America, where anime and manga can be made |
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It's simple. Drama sells stories.
Look at it this way. Do you think Americans are how they are depicted on TV and movies? I don't think so. |
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dormcat
Encyclopedia Editor
 Posts: 9902 Location: New Taipei City, Taiwan, ROC |
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Em, you meant "except," right?
And you didn't see American education officials kneel in front of parents of bullied students who committed suicide, did you? Do you know how many Japanese students asked for help because they are being bullied at school? Over 27K cases per week! |
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chrisb
Subscriber Posts: 617 Location: USA |
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Thanks for pointing that out. And thanks for pointing out it's not just a "way to get more sales" thing, like I've said, Asian friends of mine have said that it is a pretty bad issue over there (I didn't realize it was 27,000 per week bad though. )I've noticed that in the Japanese media, the teachers really choose to believe that no bullying goes on in their classroom, same goes for here in America in real life, seems like teachers are ignoring the bullying more and more. |
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Amasa
 Posts: 340 Location: Japan |
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You obviously know a lot on the subject so would you mind expanding for us? Just giving a statistic when you could provide a more in depth answer to the question doesn't help the OP. I can only speak from personal experience, attending a Japanese high school, but I don't think you can trust what I see a great deal because I don't fully understand what goes on in the class with the language barrier and everything. So far I've been fairly overwhelmed with the lack of bullying at my scool, or more specifically in my class, especially since I had heard so much about how terrible it is in Japan. I've seen small teasing here and there but it was all very forgivable and in all of those cases I saw someone (a girl most of the time) stand up for the victim. The only teenage anime drama that I've seen is Peach Girl and I can safely say that I don't think you'll find any Sae's walking around Japan... I don't think you could get anybody that evil in reality. Actually, I've just been reading up about the whole kogal subculture in Japan which is very evident where I'm living and I'm honestly surprised that with such a focus on aesthetics among teenagers (girls especially but boys as well) there's not more bullying or bitching at least. But if the statistics say it's true then I suppose I can see why some students would need some help. |
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dormcat
Encyclopedia Editor
Posts: 9902 Location: New Taipei City, Taiwan, ROC |
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Because if a teacher blows the whistle, the entire faculty -- from chancellor to rookie teachers-in-training -- would be marked permanently in their career records and would seriously hamper their way to "climb the ladder."
What exactly do you want to know? The numbers were taken from Yomiuri Shimbun on Nov. 14, 2006. To be honest, I don't feel very comfortable talking about this very subject. Unless one wants to discuss the issue of ijime in anime and in anime ONLY I see no need to continue this thread. |
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hentai4me
 Posts: 1313 Location: England. Robin is so Cute! |
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Which is one major reason why such things don't get resolved. |
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chrisb
Subscriber Posts: 617 Location: USA |
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I am actually more interested in the subject in real life than in anime. What is iijime?
Amasa: I've known some Sae's in high school before, and they would go out of their way to make people's lives THAT bad, so just pointing out that it is a possibility haha. And I sorta agree with hentai4me, talking about subjects like this are ways to educate people and maybe give them insight into something they suffer from or something they or someone close will suffer from. I think it's important to bring this to the attention of anime fans, especially those who think Japan is some paradise for anime otaku and those who only hear about it's low crime rate and low poverty rate. Last edited by chrisb on Mon Jul 09, 2007 3:20 am; edited 1 time in total |
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dormcat
Encyclopedia Editor
Posts: 9902 Location: New Taipei City, Taiwan, ROC |
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Because I don't feel there's a need to post my past on an anime forum.
Ijime = bullying in Japanese
Well, yeah, that would be a better reason, but I still don't feel it's the best thing to discuss every good, bad, and ugly face of Japan on an anime forum. There are better places for that. |
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Amasa
Posts: 340 Location: Japan |
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ijime means bully or abuse. I've heard of more stories about primary school bullying where the parents get involved. I heard of stories in Tokyo where a child's mother would murder the bully that was hurting her child, it's very sick and sad. The more time I spend here the more I realize that Japan has some very difficult issues that need to be resolved and school bullying is only a small part of it. edit: I should add that those stories were published in the news and are so uncommon, but it still left an impression on me. Yes, you're right chrisb. The enormous literacy rate and employment in Japan might seem attractive to many people but as I said before it's a society based on aesthetics where it's unlikely that things like this will be discussed. One thing I'm grateful about my education in Australia was the "critical thinking" was taught from fairly young to the year I ended high school. There's pretty much no critical thinking taught in Japanese high schools and it's quite disturbing. I'll admit I actually feel a bit uncomfortable talking about that because I don't know when I'll cross the line from observing to offending. |
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chrisb
Subscriber Posts: 617 Location: USA |
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Seems like this whole iijime issue has a lot to do with how the culture works, which is a very sad a scary thing. Teachers fearful of helping a student? People not wanting to discuss an important issue? That's just crazy.
AMASA: Even if you might offend, I think it would be better for students to hear about their lack of critical thinking, it may help, even a little, in their way of viewing their society, and they in turn could educate their peers, maybe even help with the serious bullying problem. I understand how you want to be careful about the whole thing especially considering how the Japanese culture takes to being offensive. I didn't mean to offend or bring up a touchy subject when creating this thread, if a mod feels it should be deleted because it's too touchy or brings up bad memories for some, go ahead and lock the thread. |
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selenta
 Subscriber Posts: 1774 Location: Seattle, WA |
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Personally, I don't know much of anything aside from talking to a few Japanese students and teachers who grew up there (which, naturally, has little to no authority). I don't mean to single you out dormcat or try to force your hand if you don't want to talk about it, but I'll agree with those who want to talk about it and how it is a potentially relevant issue to foreign anime viewers. School systems in America and Japan are very different, and I freely admit almost complete ignorance on the subject (how am I really supposed to know?). The truth is, the culture here and there is very different, and many viewers don't know (rightfully so in my mind) where to draw the line between subjects that are 1.) designed entirely for drama 2.) exaggerations of real life situations or 3.) completely realistic.
I would never have believed that Japanese teachers were allowed to physically manhandle/abuse their students (though, in retrospect, that sort of thing was allowed here in the US 50-60 years ago so it shouldn't have surprised me) until I heard several accounts from Japanese foreign exchange students and faculty at my school. When our professor told us about the time that her best friend in high school had had a perm when she came to school one day, and how the professor had dragged her by the hair into the women's bathroom and stuck her head in the toilet and flushed until the perm came out, that was when I knew it wasn't complete BS. It is impossible and unrealistic to expect someone to know where to draw the line in another culture, so I think any discussion on the subject is potentially very worthwhile |
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darksideoftheanime
 Posts: 155 |
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This is something that I definitely want to learn more about. I’ve heard so many stories about the Japanese school system that their superiority in math and science seams meaningless. And I’m not just talking about bulling or teachers, but also about them altering history books so that they don’t include Japanese war crimes during WWII like the Rape of Naking. It just seams to the eyes of a foreigner that their school are just as bad as the one depicted The Wall (if you have ever seen the movie you know what I mean).
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abunai
Old Regular
 Posts: 5463 Location: 露命 |
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Actually, there are many different ways to measure scholastic levels, and Japan doesn't necessarily lead the field, not even in math. Look at this story for an indication of where the real frontrunners are from: China.
Well, this is not a practice restricted to Japan. All nations (yes, that includes "free world" nations from the US to the UK to Denmark) do this. As an historian, I naturally think that it's a reprehensible practice, but historical revisionism is a common method of state-sponsored indoctrination, all over the world. That's how states maintain a loyal populace. In the United States, children are fed the "official version" of events, which bears as little relation to the truth as the Japanese "official version" or the French "official version", or whatever. It's all propaganda. Not all history books for Japanese schoolchildren deny the events in Nanking, by the way -- but they are sugar-coated to various degrees. US schoolchildren aren't usually taught about the close relations between US industrialists and government leaders and the German Nazi party, before and during the early stages of World War II. Danish schoolchildren are seldom taught about Danish profiteering and collaboration during World War II. My own family was in the resistance, but the way the resistance is painted in the history books is so exaggerated (and the collaborators' rôle so downplayed) that it borders on apologistic fantasy. I could go on, but the fact is: the history books that children use in schools across the world are always tainted by some form of government propaganda. That's just the way things work.
No, I don't think so. And, in fact, I remind you that The Wall also depicted an unrealistic, exaggerated and spiteful version of the worst excesses of the British school system. I've been in the old-fashioned British school system (yes, including corporeal punishment, which is a totally abhorrent practice), and I must say that it was never that bad. Though I am sure that you can always find examples of terrible circumstances in any school system. - abunai |
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Da Games Elite
 Posts: 124 |
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Japanese schools are far more stressful environments from what I've read. I have no experience there, no first hand knowledge, but I think that, like American schools, things vary. For example, not all schools have alot of bullying in America, and I'm sure that is true for anywhere. And then they are American schools were there are lots of violent people who beat the crap out of each other daily. I'm sure that works out in Japan also. But, let's face it, the media always exaggerates things to make a good story, so we can't trust manga and anime to supply a detailed portrait of real Japanese schooling.
That being said, there was a very disturbing story I read somewhere about a Japanese suicide in a school, where a twelve year old hung herself in a classroom and wrote notes in cute bunny envelops to all the people who couldn't help her, ESPECIALLY the teacher. I also read in the article that Japanese teachers don't usually involve themselves in situations, often forcing students to deal with it, more or less. After the girl commited suicide, a rapid chain of suicides began to increase dramatically. So you have to come to your own conclusions there. |
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