Forum - View topicPuella Magi Madoka Magica (TV + movies).
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TarsTarkas
 Posts: 5824 Location: Virginia, United States |
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Rebellion doesn't have a solid conclusion. The movie ends with Homura suppressing the memories of all her former friends and keeping them imprisoned on her unstable world. As shown at the end of the movie, she is having trouble keeping Madoka under control, and one would think that would be true of Sayaka also. There are witch minions running around all over the place, which also enhances the unreality of this new world. Despite having the shadow of Madoka under her control and continually torturing all the Khubeys, Homura doesn't appear very happy or sane. Nor do I think the other magical girls are very happy on the inside. |
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Diemia
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*Spoilers ahead, I repeat, Spoilers ahead, read at your own risk*
*Before any further reading, I will stress that this is my opinion, and I hope that you will respect it.* spoiler[ PMMM Rebellion has been a controversial topic since it came out. It's been criticized (by the majority of watchers) that the ending especially was unnecessary. Homura, becoming the ultimate evil and bringing down Madoka from the heavens has become the core of its infamous reputation, and this is why I'm here to (hopefully) bring you a different perspective to the true nature of the ending, and why it's so painfully lovable. My arguments will be supported by two key elements in the movie and series. #1 Akemi Homura: The self-destructing figure which attempts to save her only friend. It should go without a second mention, that Homura would do anything to save Madoka, right? Her wish, after all, was composed for Madoka alone. Even the way her power works revolves around her wish more than you might know. She can only control time after she's rewound once. Her rewinds are always one-month increments, and also have a cooldown of one month. During this month, she's able to control time, however after this period has passed, and the checkpoint from which she rewound time tolls, she can no longer stop time, and her shield will only function as an endless storage for her weapon arsenal. The true nature of her power was designed to assure total control of circumstance for Madoka's safety. Even her power means sacrifice. This is more than enough evidence that Homura would do anything for Madoka, despite not being stressed during the series (it's something that Gen Urobuchi intentionally did for the watcher to find out on their own, I believe.). With the first argument down, let's get to the next.] spoiler[ #2 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJ4V3N3w6WE That fragment of the movie is the fuel which drives Homura to do what she did in the end. She decided to give Madoka her normal life when she heard her honest, objective feelings, unveiled by the responsibilities of Madoka's wish when she said that she'd never ever leave her loved ones behind (2:30 in the video) because she wouldn't be able to do something that would make someone as strong as Homura cry. Homura reconfirms this by asking her whether it'd be something that she wouldn't be able to bear, and Madoka reaffirms. This was the trigger to Homura's decision. With those two things in mind, I may now explain why she became "cruel" in the end. She took Madoka's burden of being a goddess, by splitting her soul gem in half. One half represented Madoka as a human, and the other her aspect as a goddess. She stole the latter, and returned the former to Madoka's human body. I don't think her cruelty was genuine. She did the same thing as Mami did, holding up an evil bravado, in order to protect Madoka and her friends, because she knows, better than anyone, that ignorance is bliss.] |
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TarsTarkas
Posts: 5824 Location: Virginia, United States |
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There are two camps on your side of the field. One is that Homura was always a weak character, one that was unhinged since the TV series. They see the act of Homura trying to save her friend and honor her wishes, repeatedly over the timelines as insanity. The other camp is a little bit of the first, but that Homura was broken by the Kyubeys in the Rebellion movie.
I never saw Homura as a weak character in the TV series, nor did her actions in trying to honor her promise to Madoka as going too far. She may have suffered depression and despair, but I never saw her as mentally unhinged. The writers had to break Homura as a character if they wanted her to be evil, and while the Kyubey thing could have achieved that, they failed in portraying that. The Homura in the middle arc of the movie, would not have done the betrayal at the end of the movie. In order to get evil Homura, you have had to believe that Homura has been insane since the TV series. The writers had to break and twist Homura's character to get the "gang's all here" story line ending that they wanted. They failed in my eyes. Personally, if they wanted to bring the group all together they could have simply do it like Dragonball Z does. The characters in the afterlife are always coming back down to the living in that show. Nobody important really dies in Dragonball Z. The girls were all there in that desolate wasteland together, in human and personification form. But I guess once an idea takes form, it is hard to change course latter. |
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FenixFiesta
Posts: 2581 |
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The text book definition of insanity is "repeating the same action and expecting different results" so technically Homura was insane already, to get on the topic the ending of Rebellion has undoubtedly been divisive among the fandom, some following a "of COURSE Homura would do that" against a "that is COMPLETELY against her character" as the two major camps in comments (at least upon the release). A more "mundane" story telling of events occurs in the PSP game where (in a non canon ending) Homura manages to ally with Mami, Sayaka, and Kyoko to make sure Madoka doesn't make a contract and defeat Walpurgisnacht, this sounds nice and tidy but when we consider the ramifications it means Homura's victory has resulted in a status quo for Kyubey's system. The morality of Homura's actions is based upon where the audience is siding, hell it can still be viewed that Homura is acted overtly selfish at the end of Rebellion but not necessarily "evil" as wanting to be with Madoka again on HER terms had become more important than "playing super hero". I have said before in one form or another, for myself I have sided with the nature that the ending of Rebellion was IN CHARACTER for Homura, now her being truly "turned evil" or simply a title she labels herself because she has committed an ultimate sin against the person she loves that will have to honestly wait until the supposed "future material" comes into creation. |
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TarsTarkas
Posts: 5824 Location: Virginia, United States |
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I don't know how Homura's actions could not be considered evil.
- She has betrayed her friends, who were coming to welcome her to Heaven. - She kidnapped all her friends and trapped them in this ghost world against their will. - She has mind wiped Madoka and Sayaka beyond a shadow of a doubt, probably a fair guess the same was done to Kyoko and Mami. If the CIA came to your house in the dead of night, kidnapped you and transported you to a black ops site in the desert and spent a month brainwashing you so you forgot who you were after you started high school, who you were married to, and the children you raised, wouldn't you consider that an evil act committed by evil people. Homura has created a fake world filled with fake characters. Considerable time has passed in the real world, since Madoka's ascension and the final scene of Homura fighting the Wraiths at the end of the TV series. Who knows how much time has passed between then and the start of Rebellion. So it is a good bet that the Magical Girls' friends and family if not already dead are quite aged. Homura has basically erased or rather suppressed years of the girls memories and experiences to revert them to middle school type of existence. If this was done to your family members or friends I don't think you would be this forgiving about it. Homura's actions in the witch's egg, showed to me that she wasn't mentally broken. There is no way 'that' Homura would ever think what the 'ending' Homura did was a good idea or something Madoka would want. This is like something out of a bad sci-fi or spy movie. |
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FenixFiesta
Posts: 2581 |
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The thing of it is, Madoka ALREADY did a similar event canonically in the original series, she remakes reality to fulfill her wish and then she forces the new worlds version of Homura all of the old world memories.
Madoka may believe she was doing "something good" by giving the new worlds Homura all her old memories, but at the same time she made the new Homura a psychological mess who was (mentally) still stuck in her endless cycle and continues on her latent obsession with Madoka. The real crux of the issue is if the viewer looks at the situation as "black and white" versus say characters acting on personal motivations with significant consequences, Madoka did not become a "Great Good" she simply was acting on her belief she was helping as many people as possible with the aid of a "little magic", with that there Homura did not become the "embodiment of evil" even if she did rewrite reality she simply was behaving in a manner that was telegraphed from even the original series and being stuck in a "closed room" will mess with your psyche. If Homura was truly vile, she would have done something to mess with Mami in the new reality, but instead the only beings to suffer her wrath was the Kyuubey race as punishment for contemplating hurting or enslaving Madoka, something I am sure even people that think new Homura as "evil" were somewhat thinking it was a due punishment. In the end, it seems to be about the audience experience in regards to the reaction, a the vocal base still divided on the Rebellion Homura "acted as expected" vs "that was completely out of character" (there camps in the middle that could still enjoy/dislike the movie for some other reason, but as mentioned earlier the biggest camps were based on if Rebellion Homura was acting within character or not). |
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DuskyPredator
 Posts: 15462 Location: Brisbane, Australia |
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I think that you are not fully understanding Homura's character if you think that it was out of nowhere. You look at earlier actions like how she is for friends and like and call that good Homura, and see how she is like the end in usurping power and imprisoning friends and call that evil, like the two are not connected. The truth is not a good or bad version of Homura, it is essentially the same character, with the same thing in the centre as always: Madoka. Homura bent time and space, went through possibly indescribable pain, and saw many die just so she could save Madoka. But it is when she is transforming into a witch where her emotions are flooding out and seeing that regardless of god like state she will never be safe from things like the Incubators, that she awakens the desire to take that god like power and protect Madoka her own way. Because protecting Madoka was her wish, it was everything she had, it was something born of her love, and truth is that it is and or may have always been a possessive love, something dark, and do many people even have a right to criticise it with everything Homura did?
I stand by that what happened with Homura really was the natural progression of her character and the series. Seeing the twisted side to what was shown as ultimately good earlier. |
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TarsTarkas
Posts: 5824 Location: Virginia, United States |
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That is a whole new subject right there. There is no way that Homura is as powerful as the Goddess Madoka. We all know how Madoka got so powerful, and nothing comparable happened to Homura to make her that powerful. I think Homura created a pocket universe, within the real universe and took the gang all there. Homura’s world is already falling apart at the seams.
Except that is not what happened. Madoka’s action in the past, changed the future. Reality changed like a wave moving ashore. Homura’s mind was not tampered with. In fact, she is only one of the few that still remembered Madoka. As to the end of the TV series, I must disagree with you. I don’t see a Homura that had mental issues and was primed to go off in Rebellion. Homura’s conversation with herself and Khubey at the end of the TV series showed a more mature Homura, one who was willing to make the best of things, and to work to make Madoka’s world a better place. I’d even say the scene with Madoka’s little brother and mother, further cements that. One of the biggest problems with the premise that Homura was still pining for the old days, is time. The end of the TV series and the beginning of Rebellion didn’t happen overnight. I’d say years, maybe decades of time passed. The final, final, scene in the TV series probably even happened years after Homura’s talk with Khubey. That Homura was more like a veteran, and Madoka still would talk to her. I don’t think Homura was pining for the old days, I think her time on the Earth was done, and she was looking forward to joining Madoka in heaven. That is really, the crux of the matter. At the end of the day, I am wrong, because the writers say I am wrong. The Rebellion movie might have easily retconned that. The writers wanted to turn a character, and they did just that. My contention is that the Homura at the end of the TV series, is not the same Homura in the final arc of Rebellion. It is nice we can still discuss this friendly like. I hope there is a fourth movie, that at least wraps up this story line, and while I absolutely detest “love conquers all, including mass murder and genocide”, I hope they do it for Homura, because she was given a bum deal. |
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FenixFiesta
Posts: 2581 |
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Something that I can say was changed from the original series ending vs Rebellion is that the narrative message was changed.
The end of the series is that Homura for better or worst learns to "keep her faith", that even in a world that literally no longer remembers Madoka that Homura will even in her final moments. Another part is the "shades of grey" in heroic efforts, Madoka saves a group of people from being mind controlled by a witch that were about to commit mass suicide but "no good deed goes unpunished" and first is almost attacked by the mob and THEN she is trapped by the Witch. Madoka also contemplates screwing over Kyubey (with her Wish) until Kyubey reasonably assures her that removing there historical interaction would put humanity back into the stone age. The more blatant examples are of course Sayaka and Kyoko, Sayaka eventually becomes a "fallen hero" of sorts attacking punks on a train on the twilight of becoming a Witch herself, Kyoko is initially represented as a "greedy selfish bitch" when in truth she has been acting pragmatic and even Madoka was able to spark an interest in "achieving a miracle" in confronting Sayaka's Witch form. Rebellion corrupts the concept, not the character, and effectively "sets up a new stage" which until new official content is produced is like being given act 1 of a play without any follow up. The other part is of course making things "Madoka's world vs Homura's world" only the audience and Homura were completely privy by the end of the film that the world HAD changed, Kyubey was too mind crushed to really count. I hope as a viewer we haven't been left with an inconclusive work (though this would hardly be the first time), but just as well Rebellion's arc was leading into Homura "taking the dark path" that it would have been bizarre for her not to become a fallen hero by the end of the film. Something else to point out is that "Madoka would sacrifice herself for the world" and "Homura would sacrifice the world for Madoka", that was true in the original series and likely is still true in whatever story continuity that will persist. |
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