Forum - View topicFruits Basket (see 2nd post for thread info)
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suna_suna
 Posts: 550 Location: Ohio |
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for the first part of your post i think spoiler[that scene was one of Takaya's filler sketches, possibly in volume 17 when they show Akito's birth. it is clear that Kureno still admires Shigure (and the other Mabudachi) because he addresses him as Shigure-ni, refering to an almost brotherly like affection. Unfortunatly, that is (and perhaps has always been) completely one-sided.] My next point on Shigure is about his very casual demenor even when the situation is very serious. spoiler[He doesn't show his true self to anyone. he will continue to make snide jokes when he wants to, because he is hiding his true thoughts. he is very cowardly that that regard. he is never direct about what he means except when he told Tohru about Kyo's fate in volume 19 and when he told Kureno that he hates him.] and fianlly (don't forget to say if the spoilers are in future volumes there Aya)spoiler[even though it is clear that Shigure doesn't care what happens along the way, he does seem to have some sense of feeling for Tohru. yes, he first asked Akito if she pushed Tohru off the cliff, but we don't know what he might have done if she had. Also, the advice he gives to Tohru occasionally doesn't seem to point towards his goals, although that may just be another escape he takes to hide them] |
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fighterholic
Posts: 9193 |
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For spoiler[the pain and the rift that Kureno has seemed to cause between Akito and Shigure, he still looks up to Shigure, even though he has wronged him. Thus is proven when their phone conversation happened, and also an indication when that sketch did appear. ]Takaya's sketches, though they might be filler, to me also provide some insight on characters and the story at times to make better sense of things and how they were.
I just wish we could get an artbook from somewhere! |
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aya_honda
 Posts: 920 Location: Around here |
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Fixed. Thanks for reminding me. I keep forgeting that. 
On the other hand I agree with you about Shigure's demeanour in spoiler[acting strangely detached from the others and in situations that affect the others. I think it was Hatori who apologized for him to Tohru, words that only later she grasped their meaning after the incident with Shigure.] Still there are so very few moments between Akito and Shigure that are quite very sweet. The first one is the already mentioned episode with the spoiler[paper flower when Shigure remembers and tells her what he told her the first time when he gave her a flower. ] My girly alter ego was something like "OOOO, that's so sweet!" That was a very nice scene which I enjoyed a lot. The second one is in the final volume and therefore *HUGE SPOILER FROM THE FINAL VOLUME* (I'm not forgeting this time suna_suna  ) when spoiler[Akito reveals to the younger zodiac members that she is a girl and apologizes to them. After that episode we get to see the intensity of Akito's passion towards Shigure. ] It was most wonderful and again and again I find myself amazed that so few little scenes and words can create such an intensity of the feeling.
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fighterholic
Posts: 9193 |
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Last volumes spoilers: Doesn't it seem spoiler[that once Akito became herself, that the tensions between the two seemed to relax? Although when the curse first broke it wasn't exactly that way. When Akito revealed herself, Shigure said he was departing. But, he was only saying goodbye to the Akito he had known, and he was going to be saying hello to the Akito he had longed for.]
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aya_honda
Posts: 920 Location: Around here |
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On this note, I will have to add that I think that Shigure was always looking to spoiler[love the Akito that showed her beauty lthan the one that was disguised as a man. I think that he hated that part of her and he reproaches her many times that she likes to be treated as a man but she always only too eager to use her charm as a woman. I think that I can understand Shigure's point of view. I think that what he wanted was to love Akito not just for the woman that she might be but also in plain view, in the eyes of the others he must be Akito's master in point of love. ] He badly wanted to be seen as also the man that spoiler[was terribly loved by Akito. ] |
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fighterholic
Posts: 9193 |
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I think if possible Akito spoiler[being treated as a man helped her to gain the confidence and the power that she felt when she would talk down on others. For her to have what she wanted was just about as plain as one could see, because she would use both worlds. As a man she was the head of the Sohma clan, and as a woman she craved the male Zodiac members.] |
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aya_honda
Posts: 920 Location: Around here |
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You know, when spoiler[the revealing was made ] I had a friend who read the manga and said something like "Now, that explains everything!"  Even now I wonder what she meant to say!!! 
Yes, she definetly had the upper advantage with this. spoiler[She could be obeyed as a man of the house though the older ones knew all about it but of course it was forbiden to say anything and many of the zodiacs didn't see that coming. And on the other hand she could use her female charm and let's a say a certain sensible side of hers. Many times she has a certain weakness that may be associated with femininity. And I think that also being a woman explains in a way her hatred towards women. ] |
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fighterholic
Posts: 9193 |
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I think it's interesting to find that Shigure spoiler[wasn't present at the revealing, but perhaps that's because when she said that they were all free, he knew that he himself would be devoted to her, and he was not free from her, because he didn't want to be. I'm still sure nobody saw it coming where she would reveal herself unto the Zodiac.]
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aya_honda
Posts: 920 Location: Around here |
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True. I think that they ended up spoiler[being the prisoner to each other, which I find interesting. It's true that he wanted to be her prisoner but at the same time I think that he wanted to possess her just like she wanted the same thing. It is an interesting type of relationship: to be so much possessif when you already know that your loved one has been with someone that you didn't expect or the fact that she/ he has been with someone. Period. ]
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fighterholic
Posts: 9193 |
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I have to say that relationship was definetly one of the most interesting ones where spoiler[two people were expressing their love for each other. ]Very interesting ways of going about it
 It's pretty much Friday at various parts of the world, I wonder what's going to be the subject of next week's discussion!
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aya_honda
Posts: 920 Location: Around here |
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Here's already Friday! But I don't want to pressure murph! So I will wait for the rest of you.
As for Akito and Shigure, I think that spoiler[it's the most mature relationship betwen two people along with the one between Rin and Haru. There's a whole new level between these pairs. ] |
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LydiaDianne
 Posts: 5633 Location: Southern California |
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The relationship between Akito and Shigure is spoiler[mature? Not hardly. They're too busy trying to punish each other and get even with each and showing that they "don't care" about each other to have a mature relationship at this point in time. No, not a mature relationship at all.] Twisted, yes. |
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murph76
 Posts: 3291 Location: Akron, OH |
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Well, it's a little early but I'm going to introduce the next topic.
This week we're moving on to Tohru and Momiji. For these two, spoiler[what started at an older sister-kid brother relationship took a more serious turn when Momiji fell in love with Tohru. To make matters worse, Momiji knows Tohru's heart belongs to Kyo, and that nothing is likely to happen as a result of his love. In the latest volume, Momiji hints at the fact his youthful appearance may have kept Tohru from seeing him as a romantic interest. Tohru did think he was an elementary school kid when they first met, and Momiji only "grew up" physically in vol. 19. (Though he has always been arguably the most mature member of the cast.) Even removing Kyo from the equation, I'm not sure Tohru would see Momiji as anything but a younger brother. Tohru loves most members of the Juunishi like family. Because Kyo encouraged Tohru to complain, to give voice to her sadness, bitterness and frustrations and tell him what was really on her mind, I think Tohru opened her heart to him in a special way, different from the others. I haven't seen Momiji do the same for Tohru, so I doubt he will ever have Tohru's love, romantically, even without Kyo.] Well, I've probably gone on too much. I look forward to everyone's posts. -Murph |
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aya_honda
Posts: 920 Location: Around here |
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I was strictly referring to the fact that spoiler[they were the only ones shown after they made love (thus the implied "maturity" of their relationship). And Haru and Rin are the other couple. ] And I'm saying this especially because Fruits Basket spoiler[is very poor in kissing scenes, not to mention implying the love scenes. ] And I definetly agree with what you said about the level of maturity of their relationship in point of their behaviour.
About Momiji and Tohru.... I think that spoiler[Tohru would never cease to see Momiji as her little brother especially because she met him in a difficult time. Momiji is one of the unlucky zodiacs who was rejected by her mother. Tohru has assumed the role of the mother and the bigger sister for Momiji and therefore it would be difficult to see herself in relation with Momiji in a different manner other than the ones mentioned above. ] Unfortunately for Momiji spoiler[who would like to be seen in a different way. But nevertheless I don't think that Momiji has really thought of the possibility of being with Tohru, even when he warned Kyo about what might happened if he gave up. There's a different relationship between Kyo and Tohru as murph already mentioned. The opening up has been done in both ways (Kyo and Tohru have confided in each other their worst fears and dreams) whereas with Momiji it has always been Tohru listening to him. Too many times we get to see Momiji as a child and not as a young man. His maturization in volume 19 doesn't clear the image of the child, at least in mind. ] However I find Momiji to be one of the bravest zodiacs, especially because he is one of the first to be seen in spoiler[confronting Akito, in volume 11 (I think) at the seaside when Akito comes there and spoils the fun of everybody. I love Momiji's courage in telling Akito that he will not let her hurt anybody and especially Tohru. While all the others were looking from the windows Momiji was fighting and even though he went to call for the mature zodiacs I still find this episode quite reavealing for Momiji's mature self. ] |
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fighterholic
Posts: 9193 |
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All this is said and true, and it only makes more sense to see that we would want to see Momiji happy. As mentioned though he was caught in a series of unfortunate events or things that had the tables set where he was at a disadvantage. For one, he spoiler[was basically rejected by his mother (not uncommon in Zodiac families), and he was unable to see his sister and all. Tohru came in and to a degree helped to heal that wound.]
All the same, Momiji spoiler[still didn't stand a chance. The circumstances that he fell into was that Tohru would only see him, like mentioned, as a little brother. And that's how some relationships work out. But you still end up caring for that person, but you have to careful of the relationship that you impart. Tohru pretty much respected everyone, but Kyo's situation obviously made her feel different.] |
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