Forum - View topic
ANNCast - Macek Training


Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10  Next

Note: this is the discussion thread for this article

Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Renaisance Otaku



Joined: 15 Jan 2004
Posts: 467
Location: Modesto, CA

PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 5:15 am Reply with quote
penguintruth wrote:
There are plenty of leitmotifs in Macross, Macek has no effing clue what he's talking about.


Yeah, I remember always feeling that Macross' music just fit the mood a lot better at times. Take the firing of the Grand Cannon. In Macross, there's a triumphant piece playing when it goes off, and you can almost feel the bridge crews' relief. Contrast to Robotech, and I can't even remember there being music in the scene. It's so low key, it like, "oh look, it fired...' Not to mention the song replacement removed a lot of little nuances like Minmay sing "My Beautiful Place" on both major shots of the Earth. I suppose the unified score did help the flow of the show, and it has some memorable pieces, but it's not any real improvement.

The speed adjustments though greatly explain why it was rescored though. I never knew that and always just heard it was to unify the three shows. Thanks for that.

Quote:
"Derp, cartoons are all dubbed anyway, why have subtitles?" Because it's foreign film, you splooge stain.


That argument's never held much water with me either. The actors may not be onscreen, but a lot goes into selecting how things should sound. He paints this himself vividly with his story of the work that went into Roujin Z's foley. Knowing this firsthand makes it sort of ironic his pension for "fixing" or "improving" other peoples' work and being aghast at fans not happy about it. It makes him seem very "father knows best". Anime smile I agree that some things are less professional or detailed as others, given his examples, and at the core there's always the business end of things - what sells, and presenting the best product possible with the resources at hand, but there's still an art to the product before hand to be considered, fallible or not. A cartoon is much more than its animation alone. The actors and sound involve can change so much of the feel of the visuals. I know of people that consider dubbed versions of shows entirely different entities, not just show X in English, because of it.

It also ignores the concept that some anime fans enjoy it because it not localized for them. We have cartoons and TV dramas and so on catering to our tastes. Why should our anime have the same type of humor or drama just because it's more accessible? There in lays the problem with mass marketing of a nitch product. You have to go for the bigger piece of the pie. Sure, it makes it more marketable, but it removes a lot of the flavor that made the product desirable in the first place.

The argument that people had the fansubs doesn't really work either, as there's no real comparison between a 1st gen professional release, and an nth gen copy. Not like today where you can get HD broadcasts on things only on DVD here (usually crammed on too few discs). A lot of fans may have already seen a fansub, but the legitimate release was probably the first time they could really SEE it, with or without words in the way. Add in all the liberties generally taken (dialog added and other Americanizations), and it's pretty easy to understand why dubs without a subbed alternative peeved so many. So few fans today know of this firsthand.

I also remember reading how he was a lot more discerning of other companies efforts. There's a period letter floating online were he basically puts down Animeigo for even offering subs, and then goes on about how much better his dubs are when they finally starting releasing them "the right way". Granted, Animeigo's dubs were pretty amateur, but I kind of hope that letter wasn't real given it's unprofessional air.

Quote:

If you think ADV dubs were any worse than Streamline ones, you have a short memory.


Streamlines dubs are certainly not my cup of tea in the accuracy department, though I'll admit that some of them have a lot more personality than some modern dubs. Dirty Pair the Movie in particular having a lot of fun going for despite the liberties taken. Whereas Silent Mobius has a lot of nonsense in the writing (particularly Yuki), and he absolutely destroys the meaning of the song by having Katsumi cry out for her mother (whom she'd just reconciled over) instead of remembering words long forgotten.

Older dubs do have this mystique to them, and they can be interesting just on a "so bad, it's good" level. I don't even go so far as to say newer one's are really all that better. More accurate usually, but they still have the same pratfalls of time, budget and casting constraints. Every generation has their awful, mediocre and stellar dubs. There's just a larger pool now (or at least there was).

Quote:

He really seems to think that Robotech is superior to Macross because it sold a lot. Macek, nostalgia is a powerful thing. That's all I have to say about that.


Indeed. Though it's mostly HG not wanting to let go of their sole link to this community. I actually like how Mecek points out Voltron's role is getting this started. HG makes it seem like Robotech singlehandedly started American interest in anime, ignoring Voltron, Starblazers, Astroboy, Gigantor, and so on. It did play a big part, but it was a long time coming. It never fails to surprise me too just how many people are unaware of it's mismatched pedigree too.

You know, I can really say I hate Mecek much anymore. I've calmed over the years concerning things like this, and mostly see him and his work as a product of his time. I'll give him some respect for working under the tight schedule he had for Robotech, and it's not really his fault that HG continues to try to mythologize it and not just let it die like it probably should given the uncut releases now available. I definitely disagree on his stance on dubbing, but so do I with Richard Epcar, and I still enjoy his voice work. The industry is in such a rut that dubs are largely becoming irrelevant, so I suppose it's no use getting in a tizzy over.

Interestingly, he going to be at AOD this month, and assuming I can make it, I have no clue just what I'd have to say to him anymore. I'll probably just have him sign a few tapes and leave it at that. He's definitely an individual that was involved at a very interesting point in this fandom's life, so it's interesting to hear his point of view on things, even if you don't agree on a philosophical level.


Last edited by Renaisance Otaku on Fri Jan 15, 2010 12:50 pm; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger My Anime My Manga
jsevakis
ANN Director of New Media


Joined: 28 Jul 2003
Posts: 1518
Location: Los Angeles, CA

PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 5:17 am Reply with quote
I just want to point out the pure hatred from Penguintruth, and how it has completely obscured both sanity and reason, to the point where he is openly hating for hatred sake. Note that every opportunity, no matter how nonsensical, to insult the man is taken, as if insulting the man were the measure of one's manhood.

The open-minded and common sense-endowed will find a lot of intelligent things in what Carl has to say, even if they don't agree 100% with his aesthetic sense.

The people who have been taken in by the fan aesthetic, and consume it as if it were the only reality, ignorant of other people's divergent opinions, will continue to scorn this alternate point of view, for it is different from their own. They are idealogues, surely, and their point of view is so immobile and obvious that they are neither worth listening to nor arguing with, nor are their tired ideas worth entertaining. They are merely regurgitating the same venom they've spilt for years, and lo, how their thoughtless words spew caustic.

That is all.

edit: Anyone who can honestly say that they prefer the ADV dub of Dirty Pair: Affair on Nolandia over the Streamline dub is clearly suffering from a serious medical condition affecting both their hearing and mental faculties, and should probably seek medical attention immediately.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
Renaisance Otaku



Joined: 15 Jan 2004
Posts: 467
Location: Modesto, CA

PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 5:28 am Reply with quote
Agreed. Whether you agree or not, he certainly has some interesting things to say. Knowing him allows one to better grasp why these dubs came to be the way they are. That said, I can certainly understand the bile he tends to produce in passionate oldtimers like PenguinTruth and even myself. Hate for hate's sake is never a good thing, but it can be hard to "see with eyes unclouded by hate" to borrow a line from Princess Mononoke.

You know, I've never heard the ADV dubs of any Dirty Pair, nor do I care to, but I know it was probably someone on this site that influence my thoughts on what's usually called "Project Eden".
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger My Anime My Manga
Nanoob



Joined: 07 Dec 2009
Posts: 23

PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 5:56 am Reply with quote
This was a good interview, thanks.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Space Butler XIII



Joined: 04 Feb 2008
Posts: 65

PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 5:59 am Reply with quote
Justin, Zac and Carl were all wondering what happened to Captain Harlock. Carl's version of the show may be forever lost to us, but the original Japanese version is being streamed on Funimation's web site.

http://www4.funimation.com/​video/​?​page=​show&​b=​278

I always see dollar-store DVD's with the good Captain's face on the cover, though I can never bring myself to buy one and see just what the hell is on it. Is there anyone here who can confirm or deny just what those DVD's are?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
GATSU



Joined: 03 Jan 2002
Posts: 12378

PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 6:11 am Reply with quote
Macek sounds a bit like R. Crumb on the audio. Laughing

Justin: "[Cobra OVA=] If someone tried to remake Mad Max into a DTV movie."

I imagine that's what we'll get w/ part 4. Wink

"[Go Nagai] has never been able to sell here successfully."

Cutie Honey does alright, but no one tries to build on it.

"not releasing subtitled VHS"

There were subs of Akira, actually. And some subbed tapes of Robotech.

"[A.D. Police] was such a terrible show"

It's alright for what it is. It's Parasite Dolls which blows.

As for Nolandia, I got it, but I didn't know it was re-dubbed desu.
;-;

Zac: "I liked the [Streamline] Akira dub."

Yeah, me too. Cam Clarke and Bob Bergen 4-ever. Oh, and that dude who plays Golgo.

Carl: "25 mins to my store in Orange"

For recent Cali residents who don't appreciate how fast that is, by today's standards, Harmony Gold is based in Hollywood.

"amateurs who didn't know what they were doing"

Not fond of Clash of the Bionoids, are we? Rolling Eyes

"I liked Lily C.A.T."

Me, too. And I did see it, dude. It's like "They Were 11" without the boring drama.

And yeah, I wanted to know about Robot Carnival, too. Someone played the R2 DVD of that @ AX, and I didn't really notice any significant difference in the sequence changes. It's an anthology, anyway, so there's no real reason it needs to be in a particular orer.

wal: They definitely knew Akira and Wicked City were Japanese. Cool

penguin:
Quote:
but Macek and Harmony Gold has been a hinderance to a lot of Macross fans for years.


Um, they're the reason you were able to see Macross subbed and uncut. Any other problems are to be blamed on the Tatsunoko/Nue dispute and the record companies shaking down insane fees for M7.

Quote:
You do have to admire some of the marketing creativity, though. But that's the only creativity he has.


Did you actually listen to the whole thing? The guy's got experience in film editing and soundtracks, for eff's sakes!

Quote:
John K. is a douchebag. He's so snooty, putting down all cartoons that aren't traditional "wacky antics" shows.


John K. is awesome, and a lot deeper than he's given credit for on the subject of animation.

Quote:
I'm glad that since Ren and Stimpy, his career has been an utter failure.


Um, he's had work outside of Ren and Stimpy. Plus, he'll finally get some residuals for his work on the Bakshi Mighty Mouse, now that it's on dvd.

Quote:
Billy West was an even better Ren than you ever were. Eff off.


Yeah, John will really be sad to know that the guy who booted him from his character is stuck doing straight-to-video movie spin-offs of a low-rated cartoon series. Rolling Eyes

Quote:
Those Lupin III dubs from Streamline were godawful. Context be damned, bad is bad. Point me to the halfwits who appreciate those.


You'd be surprised how many Lupin ML fans alone like those dubs.

Quote:
What made ADV think hiring Carl Macek, already a revilled figure in the anime community, was a good idea? ADV dubs were already mediocre at best, but bringing in Macek?


Bull. If Macek weren't working there, we wouldn't get the subbed Dirty Pair specials and Neo Tokyo.

Quote:
He really seems to think that Robotech is superior to Macross because it sold a lot.


Actually, his whole point was that ADV re-dubbed Macross for nothing, because the fanbase for it already bought the sub from Animeigo, and didn't care about an "authentic" dub.

Space Butler: I've seen some tapes, and the audio is out of sync with the lip-flaps. But I'm told that wasn't a Macek dub, but a dub from a different company, so I'm confused on that one. Shocked
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Captain Crotchspike



Joined: 23 Mar 2005
Posts: 355
Location: Phoenix, AZ

PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 7:12 am Reply with quote
Thanks for doing this interview, it was as entertaining as it was enlightening. It was seriously worth the two hours.

I got Lily C.A.T. a few months ago (new, factory sealed!) and I was surprised by it. I suppose this was more or less due to me expecting something much worse, and it owes a lot to other movies...but hell, it's fun, good looking, and not too long. Its particular take on the sci-fi concepts at hand just plain work well. The dub is great stuff too: Bob Bergen's delivery of a certain line towards the end - spoiler["So for me, the only answer is to kill ourselves...okay?"] - is now one of my favorite dub moments.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
silver_deeds



Joined: 08 Jan 2010
Posts: 60

PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 7:38 am Reply with quote
Renaisance Otaku wrote:
The argument that people had the fansubs doesn't really work either, as there's no real comparison between a 1st gen professional release, and an nth gen copy. Not like today where you can get HD broadcasts on things only on DVD here (usually crammed on too few discs). A lot of fans may have already seen a fansub, but the legitimate release was probably the first time they could really SEE it, with or without words in the way. Add in all the liberties generally taken (dialog added and other Americanizations), and it's pretty easy to understand why dubs without a subbed alternative peeved so many. So few fans today know of this firsthand.


I don't think that's true. People just don't CARE anymore. If they can find it free online, then they're happy. If they're already happy why pay for something that might or might not be better? You're not going to get any money out of these people. That's what online streaming is trying to fix. I'm just saying, that's what Macek's view was based on. No one at the time knew what anime was, so if you were bringing it to North America and expect to sell it, you'll have to re-dub it and localize it so the people with like it. I guess Macek couldn't really add a sub track when he had to change everything. Releasing a whole new set doesn't make sense when you're trying to appeal to a completely different market all together. Let's face it, that's what the people were really peeved about.

You said so yourself, what you hear completely changes how you see a show. How am I supposed to know how to feel about it if I can't understand what's being said? So much is captured in a moment that subtitles can't make up for. Granted, if you think the voice acting sucks the moment is lost anyway, so you might as well just watch subs. But I think something like Emma, for example, has a lot to bring to an English-speaking audience. But now we've got sub-only releases so that big piece of the pie is gone.

edit: As for the interview in general, I really learned a lot. I knew the History of Anime in general, but I never understood how the English side to it got started until now. I'm part of that second generation of fans that KidsWB and Cartoon Network brought in. Yes, Escaflowne was hacked up, Cardcaptors was mutilated and Cowboy Bebop was censored. I didn't know that at the time. Now I'm a big anime freak. We might not agree 100% with Macek, but after hearing this, no one can say he didn't (for the most part) know what he was doing. The anime industry could learn a lot from its own history. It wasn't Macek's fault things didn't work out.


Last edited by silver_deeds on Fri Jan 15, 2010 8:16 am; edited 9 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
ABetterTimeandPlace



Joined: 21 Jan 2007
Posts: 101

PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 7:44 am Reply with quote
GATSU wrote:
Um, they're the reason you were able to see Macross subbed and uncut.


Not Macek. The Streamline Pictures' subbed release of Macross ended in the middle, so it was unfinished. Also, the subtitles from Streamline Pictures were notoriously inaccurate.

Quote:
Any other problems are to be blamed on the Tatsunoko/Nue dispute and the record companies shaking down insane fees for M7.


The Studio Nue/Tatsunoko dispute in 2000 was precipitated by Harmony Gold's demands in 1999 that it owned everything with the name Macross on it outside Japan. Those demands happened before the lawsuits.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
neocloud9



Joined: 06 Oct 2008
Posts: 1175
Location: Atlanta, GA

PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 8:34 am Reply with quote
GATSU wrote:
Quote:
Billy West was an even better Ren than you ever were. Eff off.


Yeah, John will really be sad to know that the guy who booted him from his character is stuck doing straight-to-video movie spin-offs of a low-rated cartoon series. Rolling Eyes


Quiet, you. Futurama is wonderful and so is Billy West. You don't need to insult them just to defend John Kricfalusi.

Most (read: all) of Macek's stuff was way before my time, so I don't have any real opinion on what changes he did or didn't make when localizing anime releases... But I was absolutely blown away by the effort he had to put in to do so. This is clearly a very hardworking man. I mean, watching three unrelated shows on mute and having to come up with a story to connect them all? That's crazy! And he must've done something right, because nearly all the older friends I have speak very fondly of Robotech. Great interview, you guys.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
GATSU



Joined: 03 Jan 2002
Posts: 12378

PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 8:50 am Reply with quote
ABTAP: My point is that, if HG and Macek didn't get Macross then and there, it's possible it could have suffered the same licensing hell fate as DYRL. Not to mention that a smaller company like Animeigo wouldn't be able to afford the rights, while a larger company might have refused to bring it out here, because of its age. And the Tatsunoko/Nue tension's been around long before HG asserted its copyright. As for Streamline subs for Akira, they pretty much match Geneon's subs. There was a print of Cagliostro in which they changed the names of the characters, but that had to do with the Leblanc thing. And I heard the Megazone R1 DVD from IMAGE worked out ok.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Charred Knight



Joined: 29 Sep 2008
Posts: 3018

PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 9:35 am Reply with quote
neocloud9 wrote:
GATSU wrote:
Quote:
Billy West was an even better Ren than you ever were. Eff off.


Yeah, John will really be sad to know that the guy who booted him from his character is stuck doing straight-to-video movie spin-offs of a low-rated cartoon series. Rolling Eyes


Quiet, you. Futurama is wonderful and so is Billy West. You don't need to insult them just to defend John Kricfalusi.

Most (read: all) of Macek's stuff was way before my time, so I don't have any real opinion on what changes he did or didn't make when localizing anime releases... But I was absolutely blown away by the effort he had to put in to do so. This is clearly a very hardworking man. I mean, watching three unrelated shows on mute and having to come up with a story to connect them all? That's crazy! And he must've done something right, because nearly all the older friends I have speak very fondly of Robotech. Great interview, you guys.


Manga has all of Robotech online at youtube.

http://www.youtube.com/​show?​p=​6VWyXFZ6aFI&​pl=​2BF924DAD8584FB0

Watching it I am amazed that anyone could think Macek hates anime. The guy did what he had to do to get Macross to America, and he did it sucessfully. The main theme of the series the show of culture clash between the Zentradi and humans is left completely untouched.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ABetterTimeandPlace



Joined: 21 Jan 2007
Posts: 101

PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 9:57 am Reply with quote
Charred Knight wrote:
Watching it I am amazed that anyone could think Macek hates anime.


Macek certainly doesn't hate anime, but he does no favors for himself when he said in the past that he believes his dubs are better than the original anime in Japanese. It's no accident that he used to refer to Macross, Southern Cross, and Mospeada as merely "found footage" for over two decades.


Quote:
The guy did what he had to do to get Macross to America, and he did it sucessfully. The main theme of the series the show of culture clash between the Zentradi and humans is left completely untouched.


It's there, but not completely untouched. Especially towards the end of the Macross episodes, dialogue and storylines about culture clash were rewritten to refer to Protoculture as a energy source. Robotech completely changed the main motivation of the enemy, among many other changes.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Anime World Order



Joined: 05 May 2006
Posts: 349
Location: Florida

PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 10:25 am Reply with quote
The initial download of the show has Carl mumbling a lot at a low volume, which felt thematically appropriate given the output of some of the more notorious Streamline Pictures dubs. The version currently up for download has alleviated the low volume part, at least.

I did have to do a double-take at Carl's statement that at Streamline Pictures, they didn't believe in complete re-purposing of storylines and asked themselves "what would the original creators do if they were the ones releasing this in English?" Some of the most re-purposed, inaccurate dubs ever are things like Windaria and Fist of the North Star. The best I can say about them is "well, they didn't change ALL the names." Still, Carl is fascinating to listen to; finally I can hear the story about the infamously maligned "should've worn an asbestos suit!" line from his Castle of Cagliostro dub, the given rationale for which embodies why so many people hated (and continue to hate) Streamline and Macek in particular. Prior to this, the closest to first-hand information about Carl I had was this transcript of an interview I did four years ago with Christine Auten, who worked on Lady Death and Aura Battler Dunbine, both of which Carl had some involvement in. Disclaimer: I suck at interviewing people I don't already know.

I think Zac is a little off regarding why the Streamline dubs went from "utterly reviled" to "appreciated gems" over the years. It's not so much "because that's what got me into anime" (though that's certainly a factor) as it is "because now it's no longer the one and only option you have for watching the thing." The hatred for the Streamline dubs and Macek's goal of reaching as broad a market as possible was brought on by the fact that these things directly impeded people from seeing "the real deal."

The Akira dub was brought up, and I did indeed forget that Carl didn't do that one. I never bought Akira on VHS until I could get the "special subtitled edition" (which like the few other Streamline subtitled releases isn't very well done), but only now that the Pioneer/Geneon/Bandai edition is available do I find myself thinking "you know, I sure would like a copy of that Streamline dub" for completion's sake. If that same "men, we're going to the Olympics" Streamline dub were the only way to watch the film in 2010, I'd still have the pitchforks out against it. Nowadays I can appreciate the cast of actors they used, but I still don't care for their general lack of accuracy. But I still want all of them on my DVDs and Blu-Rays.

PS: as a big fan of the 2001 Cyborg 009 TV series and the new Space Adventure Cobra (I think there's about...20 of us), I shall fire back with the notion that you know you're turning into/are a hipster when a reason you give for not liking something is "it's not ironic enough." Razz I for one was unaware that the style of anime which Space Adventure Cobra embodies has been beaten into the ground over the years in anime, as any similar examples I can mention have been either out of print for years or (far more often) were never released here to begin with.

EDIT: I think Carl is onto something with his subconscious pronounciation of "Kyou Kara Maoh" as "Kaioh Kara Maoh." Hokuto no Ken 2 has it shortcomings, but Kyou Kara Maoh would have been a far, FAR better show if Raoh's evil identical twin brother were in it.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website My Anime My Manga
Renaisance Otaku



Joined: 15 Jan 2004
Posts: 467
Location: Modesto, CA

PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2010 11:21 am Reply with quote
silver_deeds wrote:

I don't think that's true. People just don't CARE anymore. If they can find it free online, then they're happy. If they're already happy why pay for something that might or might not be better? You're not going to get any money out of these people. That's what online streaming is trying to fix. I'm just saying, that's what Macek's view was based on. No one at the time knew what anime was, so if you were bringing it to North America and expect to sell it, you'll have to re-dub it and localize it so the people with like it. I guess Macek couldn't really add a sub track when he had to change everything. Releasing a whole new set doesn't make sense when you're trying to appeal to a completely different market all together. Let's face it, that's what the people were really peeved about.


Oh i agree that most modern fans don't seem to care about how they get their stuff (maybe old fans too), hence why speed subs reign supreme and low quality streams are so popular (we're just now getting to a point where streams actually look decent). Convenience will always trump quality as far as Joe Sixpack is concerned, media history has taught us that. It's a lot easier now too. I can get virtually anything I want with a few keystrokes, be it disc, torrent or stream. Before, I'd have to know about a group, contact them, send them tapes, and then wait, and it usually looked awful, or I could hope a company got it.

I'm mostly replying to the statement he made on not understanding why companies would even bother to release subs when the people that would buy them already had fansubs. It was convenience (no having to send out tapes) AND quality (no multi-gen copy), I'm sure. Macek had no interest in releasing subs at all from what I've heard (haven't listened to the whole interview, so pardon if he says otherwise here). He didn't see the need for it. I fully understand why dubs have long reigned supreme due to mass appeal. The average viewer doesn't want to read their visual entertainment, no matter how good or bad it is. The mass market was Mecek's concern, not the niche otakus that Animeigo and ADV went after with sub tapes. It's understandable

I agree with AWO on this too that a lot of these niche fans hated it because it was blocking the release of a subbed version. A lot saw a dubbed tape as the removal of hope for a "proper" release. It just wasn't a given.

Quote:
You said so yourself, what you hear completely changes how you see a show. How am I supposed to know how to feel about it if I can't understand what's being said? So much is captured in a moment that subtitles can't make up for. Granted, if you think the voice acting sucks the moment is lost anyway, so you might as well just watch subs. But I think something like Emma, for example, has a lot to bring to an English-speaking audience. But now we've got sub-only releases so that big piece of the pie is gone.


I'm not going to really open that can of worms, but I've never been able to understand how some people can't reconcile what's being read with the acting they're hearing. When I have subs up, I "hear" what I'm reading in my head. The thought that a foreign language is impossible to grasp emotion from is greatly exaggerated, especially if one is immersed in it on a constant basis. A lot if not all of shows exaggerate the emotions to begin with, and except for maybe the tiniest nuances, I've never once felt like I wasn't connecting to a scene just because of the language being spoken. Usually it's because the scene is just bad to begin with. Even RAWs I can at least grasp the base emotion and feel of things, if not what's actually going on. But I suppose that's a subjective thing. I agree about the acting though. It's long been argued that we're not able to tell just how good or bad the Japanese actually is, but one can't argue that we're unable to tell how bad the English may be. Wink[/i]
Quote:


It's there, but not completely untouched. Especially towards the end of the Macross episodes, dialogue and storylines about culture clash were rewritten to refer to Protoculture as a energy source. Robotech completely changed the main motivation of the enemy, among many other changes.


True. The very message in the show about how war brings nothing but destruction was pretty much written out since the "wars" had to continue. The most poignant for me being Global's talk with Misa on the importance of colonization as the only means to ensure humanities survival changed into one about hitting them before they hit us. Inspiring optimism changed to bitter revenge.

Robotech still gets praise today, but I think a lot of it also has to do with the quality of the shows involved. Most Robotech fans prefer The Macross Saga and New Generation, and SDF Macross and Mospeada have long been considered great shows. Most Robotech fans who have seen both versions acknowledge this, and RT tends to lead people to the uncut versions eventually (aside from those strangely unaware). Alternatively, there are plenty that prefer RT simply for the added generational aspect, and that's fine.

To say fans not caring for an authentic dub, there's a grain of truth in it. Though there were plenty of Macross fans following the dub as a new way to experience the show. Mari's involvement certainly helped. The inferior Japanese audio on the release and cheaper Animeigo set sold at the time certainly didn't. Not to mention how no one but Mari pronounced the name of the ship correctly. Cool

As for Cobra, I've only seen the recent OAVs, but as a huge fan of the original, they're fun to visit. Watching a little of the new series, my only real problem is Cobra's new voice. It's nice to see a distinct change in art style from the usual norm now and then.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger My Anime My Manga
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10  Next
Page 2 of 10

 


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group