Forum - View topicNEWS: Kodomo no Jikan Second Term Anime's Promo Streamed
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| abunai Encyclopedia Editor  Posts: 4770 Location: 露命 |
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| I've removed a number of the most recent posts from this thread, on the grounds that they contained personal attacks of a defamatory nature.
Mohawk52, you are explicitly warned not to make such remarks about other users. I don't care how personally provoked you may feel by a topic, there is no excuse for that kind of thing. Do not do it again. - abunai |
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Mohawk52 Posts: 3862 Location: Celebrating Lindsey Hawker murder suspect arrest, in Basingstoke, UK. |
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| I don't understand why you would think I was attacking anyone in anyway to respond in that manner. 2DOtaku asked a question and I tried to answer it, nothing more. You must have saw more than what was intended, but you are a Mod, and I am not, so there I'll leave it. The question was asked "what harm is it? I'll ask, what harm isn't it? Apologies to anyone remotely offended, that was not my intention. Last edited by Mohawk52 on Wed Jan 07, 2009 8:40 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Case Posts: 990 Location: Iowa City |
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This is actually wandering off-topic from KnJ a bit, but I wonder if you happened to read this article last month during all the CBLDF discussions? http://journal.neilgaiman.com/ Gaiman is also from Hamphire as it turns out, if that is of any significance to you. |
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| 2DOtaku Posts: 93 |
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What on Earth kind of question is that? Evidence proves things that are, not things that aren't. That's why I'm agnostic; while I don't personally believe there is a god/are gods, neither I nor anyone else can prove that there isn't/aren't. The default logical answer to any question of positive existence, pending proof beyond reasonable doubt, is 'no'. What you're asking is akin to a person making a case in their defense before there's any evidence of them having ever committed a crime. EDIT: Thanks for the article, Case. I particularly like the following: - "Because if you don't stand up for the stuff you don't like, when they come for the stuff you do like, you've already lost." EDIT 2: And no offense taken, Mohawk52. Last edited by 2DOtaku on Wed Jan 07, 2009 8:49 am; edited 2 times in total |
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| magatsu17 Posts: 5 |
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| From what i've watch a few episodes of Kodomo no Jikan, and from what i've seen it's just a fanservice anime not that different from any other, except that maybe the girls are a little younger. But i've definately seen other show with girls almost as young and some just as young. But those had only one girl maybe that young while this one most are that young. | ||||||||||
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| Mohawk52 Posts: 3862 Location: Celebrating Lindsey Hawker murder suspect arrest, in Basingstoke, UK. |
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| Its existance offends me, therfore I am harmed by its offence. I have faith that God exists, You have faith that God doesn't exist, but we both have a faith we can not physically prove, but what is faith after all? Kodomo no Jikan physically offends me. Is that proof enough? | ||||||||||
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| 2DOtaku Posts: 93 |
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No, no it isn't. Simply being offended by something does not prove that it is harmful. There are very few forms of entertainment that won't offend someone somehow, but that doesn't make them harmful. I was watching an episode of West Wing the other day in which C.J. made a derogatory remark about Buckingham Palace. Offensive? To some, definitely. Harmful? No. If you don't like it, don't partake of it; it's as simple as that. No-one's forcing you to. |
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| Mohawk52 Posts: 3862 Location: Celebrating Lindsey Hawker murder suspect arrest, in Basingstoke, UK. |
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| 2DOtaku Posts: 93 |
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Though irrelevant I see your point. I was just giving an example of the point I'm making: simply being offended by something does not prove that it is harmful; otherwise, we wouldn't still have anime, first-person shooters or even the Internet, among a great many other things. |
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| Mohawk52 Posts: 3862 Location: Celebrating Lindsey Hawker murder suspect arrest, in Basingstoke, UK. |
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| Touching on that, have a look at this . Click on the I-Player top right. It could shed some light on what harm, which seems to be growing here in the UK, and pay particular notice to what the people affected by it are seeing as the possible cause. Kids behaving badly. |
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| 2DOtaku Posts: 93 |
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Well, I've watched the video, and disturbing as it is, I don't see how it's at all related to this discussion. It doesn't mention anywhere that lolicon is to blame for anything. Music, TV, porn and magazines, yes, but not lolicon. Oh, and parents. It mentions that too. |
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pparker Subscriber Posts: 1055 Location: Florida |
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It's been awhile, so I'm hazy on specific timelines. Early on we see that Reiji has issues. Yes, he does stand up and take responsibility, though one could say that he has taken advantage of circumstances in developing a romantic relationship with Rin's mother. But good grief, he's a person capable of even entertaining the thought of raising and then marrying Rin. So what vibe is being transmitted to this impressionable young girl? Once you realize his intentions, his behavior in hindsight is creepy and could certainly influence her sexual precociousness. Wherever she picked up those behaviors (I doubt from her mother. It was probably TV), consciously or not a sexual predator such as Reiji would reinforce such behavior. You may disagree with calling him that, but unless checked by external factors, that's where he's going. Reiji refuses parent consultations with teachers. Maybe he feels uncomfortable, being so young. Yes, it could be his lack of experience or just over-protectiveness, but I felt something wrong, which is of course that he has something to hide--his jealousy and his sexual intentions. Rin has suffered major negative life experiences. She is a strong individual, but all her issues are not just happily resolved by living with Reiji and having friends. She is still an infant who has lost her parents and is entirely dependent on an emotionally flawed teenager. While Rin is portrayed as thinking she is worldly enough for adult relationships, that's proven not the case later. The inappropriateness of Rin's behavior pales in comparison to Reiji's, which is an interesting theme in itself. I don't feel the author was intending to portray Reiji as unredeemable, but giving him a complete pass is unacceptable to me.
This type of comment is what I don't understand. I've acknowledged at least twice that the show is targeted at otaku. As is most of anime, and certainly all the ecchi shows. And "arousing their appetites" is just a loaded phrase. The inappropriateness of it is heightened by the ages of the girls, though again, there are similar examples. This isn't suddenly grossly extreme. I've said I'm more uncomfortable with the ecchi in Strike Witches, though I haven't finished the show. At best I expect it's a decent team battle show, but with all the 14 year olds in their underwear, which is constantly shoved in your face. There isn't even an attempt to try to justify it storywise. At least all of Rin's behavior in KnJ is organic to the story, regardless of it being pandering as well. Kyou no Go no Ni is another show with ecchi overtones and grade schoolers, but probably because there are no adults involved, it doesn't get the same reaction. One of the primary themes is the approach of puberty and the nascent sexual awareness. If it ever could happen that Kodomo no Jikan could be broadcast in the U.S., it would take about two days for the news to pick up that link of yours, and the company would be burned down. It's a purely cultural difference, which I previously described. My point is, that despite that, there is an actual story here. The focus on the ecchiness goes into the background as it develops. Completely discounting the series, even attacking it, because you perceive the ecchiness as entirely inappropriate is your choice. But that does not invalidate whatever objective literary value may be there and be perceived by others.
I can't view this from my location, but I imagine it's no different from every other kids behaving badly story I've seen. Some kids have always behaved badly. News companies exist to sell news. Without considerable context, I am skeptical of any social feature news. How long is this video, a minute? What vetted facts are included? What data supports a generalization from it? In any case, if it starts looking like Clockwork Orange over there, then you know the society has a major issue to address. Until then, it's just as likely sensationalism. EDIT: Had forgotten to mention Kyou no Go no Ni. Last edited by pparker on Wed Jan 07, 2009 1:40 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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| Mohawk52 Posts: 3862 Location: Celebrating Lindsey Hawker murder suspect arrest, in Basingstoke, UK. |
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The Xenos Posts: 1102 Location: Boston |
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| Wow. It hasn't been locked yet! Congrats on a civil KnJ thread!
Every time I hear news about this show and manga, I'm torn. I personally am not a fan. Even though I'm usually for humor that pushes buttons and offends, I've not real interested in this. It seems too much for my tastes. Yet, in theory, I'm all for it being one of those free speech nuts. As long as it's fiction, I don't thin it should ever be stopped from being published or banned. I see this directly related to comments about video game or comic book / manga violence. Stuff like Berserk or Grand Theft Auto has stuff to arouse our thanatos, our destructive nature. Why should erotic material, no matter what it depicts, be any different. If it's all fictional I do not have a problem. For examples. If I read a comic and it depicts an underage girl in sexual situations, I may find myself aroused. Same goes for reading about some gangster or the Punisher taking out the crime bosses that wiped out his family. That arouses emotions in me too, violent ones. Upon reading these fiction works I am asking question about myself in a safe manner. I can explore myself and my emotions by viewing fictional situations. The only place these crimes happen is in my mind. You can't arrest someone for a thought crime. (Though maybe I haven't read the Patriot Act enough.) Plus I always like to add that in tracking down fictional stuff like lolicon, you're wasting time and resources that should track down actual child pornography that hurts actual children. That is the true crime. Stop wasting time on lines on a page and find those f---s and string them up by their balls.
Actually, I'd say that is perfectly on topic. |
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RobbieKun Posts: 8 Location: Houston, TX |
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All I gotta say is for all the nay-sayers of Kodomo no Jikan, watch episode 6. That episode had me crying so hard at the end. (the flashbacks afterwards didn't help either)  |
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