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EDITED: and US broadcasts


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Shiroi Hane
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Joined: 25 Oct 2003
Posts: 6045
Location: Wales

PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 8:07 pm Reply with quote
The EDITED: modifier in episode lists has been in heavy use for a long time simply for listing US broadcast dates, regardless of the show being edited, and sometimes just because the official release uses slightly different translations.

Submission rules currently state "If a heavily localized version of the series airs in the U.S. with episodes missing and/or out of order, you may indicate the order of the episodes by using the "EDITED:" tag. Please note that EDITED should not be used for series where all the episodes aired in the normal order with minimal editing. Air dates, titles and remarks may also be added for an edited episode, but it is important to remember that the "epnum" and "segment" at the beginning is always the number of the episode within the full unedited series."

I've been leaving it be since there's always a lot more important work to do but I'm wondering if the way forward should be:

a) continue to let it slide
b) vape them on sight
c) suggests a modification of the rules, as happened along with evolving use of precisions.
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dormcat
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Joined: 08 Dec 2003
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Location: New Taipei City, Taiwan, ROC

PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 10:47 pm Reply with quote
I'd say slightly rephrasing, but not modifying, the rules, to emphasis the use of this tag is allowed only absolutely necessary i.e. the plot and/or the broadcast sequence has been significantly altered.

In recent days of internet simulcast the tag is almost obsolete. Once a newer version of rules is in place then we can start discouraging using the tag for new titles.



Emotionally speaking, however, I don't give it a d*mn for what Harmony Gold or 4Kids have done. Rolling Eyes If a series has been altered too heavily then it might receive an independent entry, like Robotech or Voltron (heck I should start working on the latter).
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doc-watson42
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Joined: 10 Feb 2003
Posts: 1608

PostPosted: Sat May 19, 2012 8:33 am Reply with quote
b) vape them on sight; and

dormcat's suggestion. IMNSHO.
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Shiroi Hane
Encyclopedia Editor


Joined: 25 Oct 2003
Posts: 6045
Location: Wales

PostPosted: Thu May 24, 2012 12:20 pm Reply with quote
Does anyone know if the wording of the submission page changed at any point? I'm setting some improper "EDITED:" names/dates to false to clear some error reports made on them, but if the wording was less clear in the past then it would be more proper to redeem submissions made prior (except to prevent re-entry).
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bglassbrook



Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 1133
Location: Gaithersburg, MD

PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2012 5:37 am Reply with quote
Glad I saw this ahead of time, as it was how I planned to submit the chapters for Black Jack. Considering how episodic the stories are, there is very little reliance on one for another. Based on the above, would using the edited tag to distinguish between original serialization and US publishing order:

1 - Still be correct usage
2 - Not be the best way to show this
3 - Be irrelevant anyway, as the tag doesn't work for manga

Thanks.
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doc-watson42
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2012 6:41 am Reply with quote
I would instead (IMHO) use the REM: tag to give the U.S. publishing order.
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Dan42
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Joined: 02 Jan 2002
Posts: 3252
Location: Montreal

PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2012 4:15 pm Reply with quote
Resurrecting this thread because I've been thinking about loosening the "EDITED" rules lately. For example I added edited episode numbers here because the episodes on Hulu were numbered differently, resulting in the wrong image/link next to each episode (only people in the US can see this Confused).

As Shiroi Hane said, the EDITED modifier has been in heavy use for a long time simply for listing US broadcast dates. It has become a de facto standard so I don't think it makes sense to fight against the current.

I am tentatively suggesting that the EDITED tag may be used for any of:
- heavily edited series
- U.S. broadcast
- different episode order/numbering
- licensee's episode titles are completely different from translation (not sure about this)

I'd like your opinion on whether that's a good idea and how it should be explained on the submission page. Remember that your opinions are important; I gave up on this because of the feedback.

If we go forward with loosened rules, I would make it so that adding or removing the EDITED tag in a submission would be part of minor edits that any editor can do.
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dormcat
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Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 9560
Location: New Taipei City, Taiwan, ROC

PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2012 5:29 pm Reply with quote
Dan42 wrote:
I am tentatively suggesting that the EDITED tag may be used for any of:
- heavily edited series
- U.S. broadcast
- different episode order/numbering
- licensee's episode titles are completely different from translation (not sure about this)

I'm fine with all four.
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Shiroi Hane
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Joined: 25 Oct 2003
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Location: Wales

PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2012 10:16 am Reply with quote
The latter is still the tricky one; we already have a load of duplicated episode lists with minor variations in title translation because someone has added TAN streaming dates under EDITED for example.
Of course, it is the only way for regular submitter to contribute official episode titles without creating a tonne of error reports. It's not all that easy for me, especially when the airdate, Japanese and English titles are all in one entry - I can't then add the official English title without also re-entering the Japanese data, which probably means finding a source....
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Dan42
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Joined: 02 Jan 2002
Posts: 3252
Location: Montreal

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:27 pm Reply with quote
I've changed the input validation for episode titles so that users will no longer be able to enter everything on one line. So at least future data will be compliant. Now, how to deal with past data...
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Dan42
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Joined: 02 Jan 2002
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 10:04 pm Reply with quote
Ok, I just added a "re-add" link on the status page. So if you need to fix one part of an episode where the different parts are crammed into one entry, you can first use that link to re-submit the parts as separate entries (possibly minus the wrong part), then mark the original as False with the comment "This info has been split". The re-added entries will be credited to the original submitter.
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Shiroi Hane
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 11:24 am Reply with quote
That will help tremendously, thanks.
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bglassbrook



Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 1133
Location: Gaithersburg, MD

PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2012 7:54 am Reply with quote
Has this gone from tentative to official yet?

On a related note, as it appears someone started putting in chapter titles for the first four US volumes of Black Jack, do I need to flag each line (English/romanji/Japanese) with the error or just first?
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Shiroi Hane
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Joined: 25 Oct 2003
Posts: 6045
Location: Wales

PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2012 10:09 am Reply with quote
What is the error?
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bglassbrook



Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Posts: 1133
Location: Gaithersburg, MD

PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2012 11:13 am Reply with quote
They are numbering based on the US release, which would make everything other than the first chapter wrong for the original publication order. As an example, the second chapter "The First Storm of Spring" should be chapter #168.

A few chapters reprinted only in the hardcovers are also missing from those listed, so the edited numbers are potenitally off beginning with the second volume.
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