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Hey, Answerman! [2009-01-23]


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Greed1914



Joined: 28 Oct 2007
Posts: 1463

PostPosted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 12:27 am Reply with quote
I'd like to point out that the Answerfan question for next week didn't seem to make it. It's just blank where the question would normally be.
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blind_assassin



Joined: 07 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 12:47 am Reply with quote
Animal Collective are weird but they're pretty good.
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Oriana3k



Joined: 24 May 2005
Posts: 91

PostPosted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 12:52 am Reply with quote
RE: the butterfly question.

http://tvtropes.org/​pmwiki/​pmwiki.​php/​Main/​ButterflyOfDeathAndR​ebirth
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GATSU



Joined: 03 Jan 2002
Posts: 12680

PostPosted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 12:56 am Reply with quote
Quote:
Anime has largely returned to being, from a financial point of view, a by-Japanese-for-Japanese medium. Just like it was way back when.”

Essentially, if you're wondering why all the relatively big series in Japan are the usual Moe and Giant Robot-centric shows that are mostly impenetrable to mainstream US audiences, there's your answer. It's not quite “they really just don't care about us anymore,” but it's close.


It's more like a "by-Akihabara otaku-for-Akihabara otaku" at this point, which means that they don't even care about regular Japanese viewers, either.
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Greed1914



Joined: 28 Oct 2007
Posts: 1463

PostPosted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 1:00 am Reply with quote
GATSU wrote:
Quote:
Anime has largely returned to being, from a financial point of view, a by-Japanese-for-Japanese medium. Just like it was way back when.”

Essentially, if you're wondering why all the relatively big series in Japan are the usual Moe and Giant Robot-centric shows that are mostly impenetrable to mainstream US audiences, there's your answer. It's not quite “they really just don't care about us anymore,” but it's close.


It's more like a "by-Akihabara otaku-for-Akihabara otaku" at this point, which means that they don't even care about regular Japanese viewers, either.


It makes it quite a bit harder for new people to start watching when there is less that appeals to them. Having some more Western appealing shows has always been good for that purpose if nothing else. Combine that with a lack of anime on TV and it becomes rather tough.
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Necrontry



Joined: 04 Apr 2006
Posts: 94

PostPosted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 1:03 am Reply with quote
blind_assassin wrote:
Animal Collective are weird but they're pretty good.


agreed, I'm glad to know other people actually listen to them, thought I was alone in that respect.
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penguintruth



Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Posts: 6098
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 1:46 am Reply with quote
The music question just makes me remember how much I hate L'Arc's FMA OP. Why is it that L'Arc sounds so uninterested in nearly everything they sing? It's like they're bored during their song. Show some enthusiasm!

It's weird, introducing people to anime through Cowboy Bebop, because even though I have been able to get people who otherwise don't care about anime to watch it, and they always enjoy it, they then find themselves disliking everything else because, "it isn't as good as Cowboy Bebop." I mean, what can measure up to it? It's not like Cowboy Bebop is your run-of-the-mill anime.

In the fandom there are three types of fans. Me, the people who agree with me, and people without any taste. Of course.


Last edited by penguintruth on Fri Jan 23, 2009 2:01 am; edited 2 times in total
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The_Libertarian_Otaku



Joined: 11 Sep 2008
Posts: 189

PostPosted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 1:54 am Reply with quote
Non-Japanese music in anime: If RZA's music can get in Afro Samurai, Radiohead in Ergo Proxy, Duran Duran in Speed Grapher, and Franz Ferdinand in Paradise Kiss, I'd say anything's possible.

Anime fandom--different factions or a sense of community: Maybe 10-20 years ago it might've been really unified, all centered around a common interest: We love Japanese cartoons. These days, it seems to be splintered. Same common interest, but splintered nonetheless, having to like the "right" cartoons, or know the latest Internet memes. The splintering can even happen with fans of the same GENRE, i.e., mecha shows (Mostly Gundam, with all its timelines and such). On a good day, you'll have someone mistaking a guy cosplaying as Char Aznable for Zechs Marquise. On a bad day, you'll have Universal Century and Cosmic Era fans bashing each other, only for Anno Domini fanboys to gang up on them. In one corner, there's After War fanboys watching Zeta Gundam and Double Zeta Gundam fans annoying each other (Surprising, given that they're also in UC if I'm not mistaken), and there's Future Century fans yelling "SHINING FINGER!" and "THE SCHOOL OF THE UNDEFEATED OF THE EAST!" These are all joined by fans of Gunbuster and Gurren Lagann (The manliest anime EVER) fanboys, all known for hotbloodedness.

But there's more splintering yet. The oldest fight in the fandom--subs vs. dubs. There's fansubbers vs. R1 fans, with fansubbers calling people who buy DVDs or watch dubs "noobs" or "fags" or whatever the hell they want to call them (Common in /a/), when in reality the fansubbers are the AIDS and cancer that's killing anime. The Wapanese teenagers who always pepper their speech with godforsaken honorifics and glomp people. The yaoi fangirls running up to some guy with a wooden paddle because he looks like Tamahome or Hagi or whatever bishie boy suits their fancy. The younger generation of fans who don't appreciate the classics, wanting their Naruto, Bleach, etc., instead (If it weren't for Astro Boy, MD Geist, first Gundam, Orguss, Lupin, Macross, Mad Bull 34, etc., we WOULDN'T have the stuff we've got now!). Ad nauseam.
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Unit 03.5-ish



Joined: 07 Dec 2008
Posts: 1540
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 2:05 am Reply with quote
Japan's never really produced things specifically FOR an audience outside Japan, though some stuff like CB has a more universal appeal. But the fact that recently it's been a rash of ho-hum moe shows based on forgettable dating sims from yesteryear gives me little confidence for teh future. And hey, I guess if people are dumb enough to buy bare-bones hour-long DVDs over there at $60-$70 per disc, who needs the R1 market, right?

I think the rush to license a bunch of titles and blindly hope for a few hits amongst the pile was really a bad move, especially for ADV, in the long run. They probably thought they could somehow squeeze out another NGE somewhere (which explains why, for example, Media Blasters gave us the lovely Devadasy). I mean sure I love robots, I love sci-fi, I love action, but that doesn't mean those genres don't have their fair share of excrement, too.

EDIT: Libertarian -- I'm surprised someone else shares my view on fansubs as a blight to the industry.


Last edited by Unit 03.5-ish on Fri Jan 23, 2009 2:07 am; edited 1 time in total
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enurtsol



Joined: 01 May 2007
Posts: 10854

PostPosted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 2:06 am Reply with quote
GATSU wrote:
Quote:
Anime has largely returned to being, from a financial point of view, a by-Japanese-for-Japanese medium. Just like it was way back when.”

Essentially, if you're wondering why all the relatively big series in Japan are the usual Moe and Giant Robot-centric shows that are mostly impenetrable to mainstream US audiences, there's your answer. It's not quite “they really just don't care about us anymore,” but it's close.


It's more like a "by-Akihabara otaku-for-Akihabara otaku" at this point, which means that they don't even care about regular Japanese viewers, either.


And then there's companies like, IIRC, Gonzo who try to tap the international markets by co-producing shows intended initially for that local audience.


penguintruth wrote:
It's weird, introducing people to anime through Cowboy Bebop, because even though I have been able to get people who otherwise don't care about anime to watch it, and they always enjoy it, they then find themselves disliking everything else because, "it isn't as good as Cowboy Bebop." I mean, what can measure up to it? It's not like Cowboy Bebop is your run-of-the-mill anime.


There was a time that it was Ninja Scroll or Ranma 1/2 (my anime-oblivious college dorm got addicted to that). Something universally relatable without knowing too much about Japan.

Nowadays, there's too much to choose from, though 2-hr movies or short OVAs are easier than longer TV series.


The_Libertarian_Otaku wrote:

Anime fandom--different factions or a sense of community: Maybe 10-20 years ago it might've been really unified, all centered around a common interest: We love Japanese cartoons. These days, it seems to be splintered.


10-20 years ago, most discussions were centralized in a few BBSes, usenet groups, mailing lists, or fanzines. Every faction were in contact with each other.


Last edited by enurtsol on Fri Jan 23, 2009 2:12 am; edited 1 time in total
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penguintruth



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PostPosted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 2:07 am Reply with quote
Unit 03.5-ish wrote:
Japan's never really produced things specifically FOR an audience outside Japan


Big O season 2.
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Unit 03.5-ish



Joined: 07 Dec 2008
Posts: 1540
Location: This space for rent

PostPosted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 2:11 am Reply with quote
I'll admit Big O was an exception, and that without AS it wouldn't have gotten anymore traction.

Also, Witchblade was based off of an American comic book, so it had its share of appeal for people over here, and it was a co-production between American and Japanese peeps. Samurai 7, too, had instant cult appeal due to its strong following here. I wish more companies adopted Gonzo's strategy of trying to make anime that can be appreciated by a worldwide audience.
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The_Libertarian_Otaku



Joined: 11 Sep 2008
Posts: 189

PostPosted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 2:25 am Reply with quote
enurtsol wrote:
The_Libertarian_Otaku wrote:

Anime fandom--different factions or a sense of community: Maybe 10-20 years ago it might've been really unified, all centered around a common interest: We love Japanese cartoons. These days, it seems to be splintered.


10-20 years ago, most discussions were centralized in a few BBSes, usenet groups, mailing lists, or fanzines. Every faction were in contact with each other.


Really? I always imagined it'd be a bit more unified than that, especially as small as the fandom was back then, with VHS fansub tapes usually being the only way to watch anime (Sure, there was anime on U.S. TV and home video, but it wasn't even 5% of what you could get in Japan) and otakus having to roll up their sleeves, make connections, and work together to help each other get their fix, even for the heaviest users of anime.
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enurtsol



Joined: 01 May 2007
Posts: 10854

PostPosted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 2:58 am Reply with quote
The_Libertarian_Otaku wrote:
enurtsol wrote:
The_Libertarian_Otaku wrote:

Anime fandom--different factions or a sense of community: Maybe 10-20 years ago it might've been really unified, all centered around a common interest: We love Japanese cartoons. These days, it seems to be splintered.


10-20 years ago, most discussions were centralized in a few BBSes, usenet groups, mailing lists, or fanzines. Every faction were in contact with each other.


Really? I always imagined it'd be a bit more unified than that, especially as small as the fandom was back then, with VHS fansub tapes usually being the only way to watch anime (Sure, there was anime on U.S. TV and home video, but it wasn't even 5% of what you could get in Japan) and otakus having to roll up their sleeves, make connections, and work together to help each other get their fix, even for the heaviest users of anime.


Pretty much. The only way to get your anime fix was to personally contact other fans, so you get to know people. So it helps when people are in the same sites.
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ice9



Joined: 16 May 2006
Posts: 21

PostPosted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 3:38 am Reply with quote
For the butterfly question, I'm not sure how far back the historical context goes, but they've been used as symbols of death for a while in Japanese cinema (I know I've seen them in a Kurosawa film, I think Rashoman, but I can't remember). It would make sense as a cinematic invention since their "moving on" symbolism is enhanced by their physical moving away (just like a flock of geese flying into the distance which has been in film basically for as long as it's been a narrative form).

Of course, they're also used because that's what the audience has come to expect - like the hero riding off into the sunset at the end of almost every western.
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