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All About Licensing: Part I


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Ingraman



Joined: 07 Feb 2005
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 5:47 pm Reply with quote
Chagen46 wrote:
Uh....the fact that Hydrogen is absurdly flammable?

Yes, it is!

I'm not denying that, but I was wondering which "huge balloons filled with hydrogen" (that aren't the Hindenburg) were being referred to. I'm curious to know of other examples, because I can only think of the Hindenburg as an example and the hydrogen apparently wasn't its main problem...
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jsevakis
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Joined: 28 Jul 2003
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:13 pm Reply with quote
Mohawk52 wrote:
Not forgetting the timecode logs for editing. HD-CAM has plummeted in value ever since the 11/03/11 earthquake and tsunami wiped the only factory in the world, located in Sandai, making the tapes literally off the face of the planet. SRs that sold for £75,000 each, are now just expensive boat anchors, and when the remaining world supply of HD-Cam tapes finally dry up the 2000 series will be dumped right on top of them. Video files is the future forever.


Uhh, the factories are back online, and the shortage is mostly over now. Japan still uses them religiously. B&H has HD-CAMs in stock, and Fuji and Maxell have both stepped up their licensed tape stock game. I prefer files, of course (as do most US anime publishers), but HD-CAM is far from dead. Faaaaaar from dead.

Mohawk52 wrote:
Quote:
Adjusted Gross Revenue
Should that be "Adjusted Net Revenue" since that will be what's left after the publisher gets his percentage of profit over and above his costs, in short; his slice of the pie? Gross being the whole pie.


Technically you're right, but they use the term "Adjusted gross revenue" to imply that the figure hasn't been subject to accounting shenanigans. Which, of course, it very well could've been and that's just a nice little bit of psychological reassurance that means nothing.
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belvadeer



Joined: 11 Jun 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:34 pm Reply with quote
dtm42 wrote:
Do they ever. I don't even want to remember how much was paid for Kurau: Phantom Memory, a show I love but which doesn't have widespread appeal.


How much are we talking? I'm not familiar with Phantom Memory.
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dtm42



Joined: 05 Feb 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:49 pm Reply with quote
belvadeer wrote:
How much are we talking? I'm not familiar with Phantom Memory.


From memory I believe the figure was US$940,000. Kurau: Phantom Memory is a very, very good series, I'm glad it was licensed, but that sort of figure is ludicrous. The series just doesn't have the sort of appeal necessary to justify a price that high, even back in the days of Anime being sold volume by volume rather than boxsets.

I don't know if it made a profit but I'll be flabberghasted if it did.
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agila61



Joined: 22 Feb 2009
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 8:01 pm Reply with quote
jsevakis wrote:
Mohawk52 wrote:
Quote:
Adjusted Gross Revenue
Should that be "Adjusted Net Revenue" since that will be what's left after the publisher gets his percentage of profit over and above his costs, in short; his slice of the pie? Gross being the whole pie.


Technically you're right, but they use the term "Adjusted gross revenue" to imply that the figure hasn't been subject to accounting shenanigans. Which, of course, it very well could've been and that's just a nice little bit of psychological reassurance that means nothing.

"adjusted net revenue'' would be redundant.

the "adjustments'' in adjusted gross revenue ought to be stipulated in the contract, so they could vary from license to license, but sticking to standard terms&conditions reduces the transaction costs. The only essential adjustment is accounting for the MG but for physical media, netting out physical production ('manufacturing') cost makes sense.

otoh, the licensor doesn't want to net out the licensee's overheads, and lots of monkey business with marketing cost and production cost accounting is aimed at smuggling licensee overheads into the adjustment.
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Cecilthedarkknight_234



Joined: 02 Apr 2011
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 9:20 pm Reply with quote
dtm42 wrote:
belvadeer wrote:
How much are we talking? I'm not familiar with Phantom Memory.


From memory I believe the figure was US$940,000. Kurau: Phantom Memory is a very, very good series, I'm glad it was licensed, but that sort of figure is ludicrous. The series just doesn't have the sort of appeal necessary to justify a price that high, even back in the days of Anime being sold volume by volume rather than boxsets.

I don't know if it made a profit but I'll be flabberghasted if it did.


I don't think it ever really did there is a lot of left over stock at rightstuf and I picked up a complete set of of crunchyroll deal for 30 dollars for all the singles/artbox last year. It's a great series but I don't think it came close to making even 1/4 of the profit needed. However Air was around 130,000 dollars to license so ADV might have managed to get some revenue back on that...

Dammiit I really need to stop using my ipod/tablet when typing out numbers.


Last edited by Cecilthedarkknight_234 on Wed Jun 13, 2012 2:46 pm; edited 1 time in total
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varmintx



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 9:42 pm Reply with quote
dtm42 wrote:
belvadeer wrote:
How much are we talking? I'm not familiar with Phantom Memory.
From memory I believe the figure was US$940,000. Kurau: Phantom Memory is a very, very good series, I'm glad it was licensed, but that sort of figure is ludicrous. The series just doesn't have the sort of appeal necessary to justify a price that high, even back in the days of Anime being sold volume by volume rather than boxsets.

I don't know if it made a profit but I'll be flabberghasted if it did.
Agree on both points and I'll add, it's pretty sad that the series was completely over-looked and forgotten.
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belvadeer



Joined: 11 Jun 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:00 pm Reply with quote
dtm42 wrote:
From memory I believe the figure was US$940,000. Kurau: Phantom Memory is a very, very good series, I'm glad it was licensed, but that sort of figure is ludicrous. The series just doesn't have the sort of appeal necessary to justify a price that high, even back in the days of Anime being sold volume by volume rather than boxsets.

I don't know if it made a profit but I'll be flabberghasted if it did.


N...nearly a million? Holy smokes, that just doesn't seem real. I was guesstimating about something in the 350k range in my head, but that amount is just...every synonym that goes with absurd. Now I'm curious to see this series that ADV blew damn near a cool million to license.

Out of sudden curiosity, I just looked at the cover art for the first DVD and suddenly recognized it from about five years ago: it was being sold in my old hometown's anime store back then when I was still attending university (I can't believe my memory sometimes, only certain images ever register). The individual DVDs and the boxset aren't really going for a lot online either. It wasn't a smash hit as you said, but it was unique for its time, right? It has to be good.


Last edited by belvadeer on Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:12 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Sailor S
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:11 pm Reply with quote
belvadeer wrote:

N...nearly a million? Holy smokes, that just doesn't seem real. I was guesstimating about something in the 350k range in my head, but that amount is just...every synonym that goes with absurd. Now I'm curious to see this series that Funimation blew damn near a cool million to license.


ADV spent the million to license it. Funimation acquired the rights later probably via the Sojitz deal.
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belvadeer



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:13 pm Reply with quote
Sailor S wrote:
ADV spent the million to license it. Funimation acquired the rights later probably via the Sojitz deal.


Oh, my bad. I should have looked at the cast list first.
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manga1



Joined: 12 Jun 2009
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:35 pm Reply with quote
Well there is not as much money to go around for one on anime, its very popular, but not as popular as it once was to buy, and people always try to score a deal on it, not much money for the companies to make on it, as they say on twins the movie, "Money talks and bullshit walks"

they want soo much money for a gamble that it will be a hit on both sides it is not funny, then you have people not having all the disposable income they once did, top that onto fewer distributers to bring stuff, smaller amout to try to feed the market less money for the artists and makers companies in japan, its a vicious cycle, and that is not even talking about piracy, or the less effective showing on traditional media like tv or movies then what it used to be, most people watch online but there is less money being made off that, and getting a few ads that they charged out the wazoo for anyway is not producing the big money corporations want, then there is the whole issue of market perception, some people just don't like the job that a certain company does to a favorite anime so they refuse to buy the products from them.

anyway as far as digital being the future, it might preserve the color and data better, but files can corrupt and format can become obsolete therefore you spend twice as much time transfering to a new type of digital format, and cds don't last as long as they though about 25 to 50 years which is longer then most tape but still only temporary.
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Polycell
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 12:09 am Reply with quote
There are dozens of archive-quality storage media, including ultra-high-grade DVDs. As for the codecs and container format, support for uncompressed audio, h.264 and transport streams isn't going anywhere anytime soon.
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dtm42



Joined: 05 Feb 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:22 am Reply with quote
belvadeer wrote:
It wasn't a smash hit as you said, but it was unique for its time, right? It has to be good.


It is a great retro-Sci-Fi series, with a really powerful bond between the two leads Christmas and Kurau.

And I apologise, it wasn't US$940,000. It was actually US$960,000. Surely that's bet- no, wait, it's even worse.

Read and weep people, read and weep.

Sure, there were some good deals for ADV. Air: The Movie was just US$20,000, and UFO Ultramaiden Valkyrie was US$21,335. But what were the ADV executives smoking when they forked over US$780,000 for a mediocre title like Pumpkin Scissors? Maybe someone can correct me on this, but I don't seem to remember that show being marketed to consumers as one of their premier titles, and yet the company sure paid a premium price to license it. Were the ADV execs still suffering from a hangover after the drinking party the night before the offer?

Sorry, I didn't mean to rant on about this. But since we're talking about licenses anyway I thought I'd might as well mention the license fees that were simply outrageous, even for those heady boom times.


Last edited by dtm42 on Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:55 am; edited 1 time in total
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Polycell
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:33 am Reply with quote
Apparently some Sojitz people were appointed to high positions in ADV as part of that agreement - like having your credit card company "help" you make purchases.
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belvadeer



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:51 am Reply with quote
dtm42 wrote:
It is a great retro-Sci-Fi series, with a really powerful bond between the two leads Christmas and Kurau.

And I apologise, it wasn't US$940,000. It was actually US$960,000. Surely that's bet- no, wait, it's even worse.

Read and weep people, read and weep.

Sure, there were some good deals for ADV. Air: The Movie was just US$20,000, and UFO Ultramaiden Valkyrie was US$21,335. But was were the ADV executives smoking when they forked over US$780,000 for a mediocre title like Pumpkin Scissors? Maybe someone can correct me on this, but I don't seem to remember that show being marketed to consumers as one of their premier titles, and yet the company sure paid a premium price to license it.


I will take your word on that and see about viewing it then.

960k? And 780k for Pumpkin Scissors? To quote Little Orphan Annie: "Leapin' lizards!" I'm just plain stunned. How does a company justify a price tag like that?
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