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Hey, Answerman! [2009-02-06]


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posterior_praiser



Joined: 21 Oct 2007
Posts: 296

PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 6:56 pm Reply with quote
Humm I've never encountered such crazy con experiences, but that is likely because I live in a small city and our con is not that big (but growing). The fan base is getting younger, and im getting older, so I don't have the same excitement I used to for it. I'm doing a panel this year though, so that should make things more interesting for me. I'm mostly in it for the time i get to spend with my friends and the merch.
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reanimator



Joined: 25 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 9:46 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
Unless you, erm, don't like J-Rock. In which case, I have some very simple advice: don't go to see their shows.


I have another solution. Start your own convention, conference, or workshop. It doesn't have to be big with thousands of people. Start a small, meaningful conference or convention for people who happen to share the same sentiment as yours.
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Animehermit



Joined: 05 Aug 2007
Posts: 914
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 10:20 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
Zac wrote:
Not sure what the last convention you went to is but anime cons are basically becoming even worse than teenage party weekend, now it's teenage party BE AS ANNOYING IN PUBLIC AS HUMANLY POSSIBLE TO CALL ATTENTION TO YOURSELF weekend.

I think this is something we can blame sites like 4chan, myspace, and Ebaum's World for. 4chan has its good parts (I'm a regular in /co/), but /b/'s depravity has been turned up to 12 over the past four years, and it's leaked into just about every other portion of the internet with a large teenage presence. For some reason, it's now standard culture for internet-enabled teens that if you can't scream random quotes/memes, you won't be accepted. There are times when these are not only appropriate, but work very well, but not when you're just walking down the hallway (except, perhaps, shouting spoiler[THE GAME], but even that gets way over-used). I also blame parents to an extent, as they seem to be more willing to let their children be "free spirits", feh.



I disagree, i frequent 4chan, and the oppasit seems to be true of most of the anime fans there, /a/ hates that kind of behavior, as does most of /b/, its just stupid kids who think its, cool to memespam outside of the internet
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RyoShin



Joined: 19 Jan 2002
Posts: 81
Location: Michigan

PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 10:35 pm Reply with quote
animehermit wrote:
I disagree, i frequent 4chan, and the oppasit seems to be true of most of the anime fans there, /a/ hates that kind of behavior, as does most of /b/, its just stupid kids who think its, cool to memespam outside of the internet

While the attitude may have changed, it still started there, and so has a lot of the memes that are thrown around in real life.

And /b/ is still horrible.
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Chesis



Joined: 09 Mar 2007
Posts: 27

PostPosted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 10:42 pm Reply with quote
Manga collaborations - hooo boy. Some of the horror stories and drama I've witnessed with kids (and adults) like this.

Nine times out of ten, these are complete amateurs who don't know the first thing about *writing,* much less writing for comics, and only have "really cool ideas" for a comic or manga. They go look for an artist prematurely with totally unreasonable expectations - more or less expecting the artist to take orders like an automaton and do all the heavy lifting, and believe me, it's MUCH more labor intensive actually creating the graphics than writing the stories. Things can go sour real quick.

Brian's advice is exactly right. You gotta learn to write first, learn how to pace a story, how to break up dialogue - you don't need much artistic talent to mark out panels and figure out what goes where.
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MMORPGAL



Joined: 29 Nov 2008
Posts: 15

PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 2:52 am Reply with quote
My idea for a game would be a strategy game with characters from Death Note, Full Metal Alchemist, Inuyasha, Code Geass, and Bleach where you lead them in search of a way to gain better exposure from adult swim. L and Light can use there combined intellect to talk [AS] execs into getting more time for anime and Ichigo and Inuyasha can cut away and Adult Swims Comey that underperform in order to free up more time (I am looking at you Tim and Eric). You never win though, you just do a little better each time.
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Psycho 101
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 2:56 am Reply with quote
Mohawk52 wrote:
Zac wrote:
Mohawk52 wrote:
It certainly dispells the myth that otaku are sexual cretins, however I doubt that most of those predators are otaku, but more opportunists. Wolves in otaku t-shirts, so to speak. Wink


Nerds tend to sleep with other nerds, and 90 percent of the people who show up to these things are teenagers, who are more likely to sleep with eachother.

I don't think it's a display of sexual competence, rather just inevitable when you put a bunch of nerdy adolescents in a room together.
Surely not of mixed gender though? I can relate to school trips where the boys shared a room, but never with the girls as well. So it's the promiscuity that is the myth then?Wink

You have no idea how many mixed gender hotel rooms there are for these cons. First and foremost remember majority of these con goers are the young teens to early 20's crowd. These are NOT high rollers. These are poor ass high school and college students whose first priority is saving a buck. That means cramming 6-8 people in a room built for 4. it's a first come first serve we don't care if you're male, female, black, white, alien, human situation. If a 7 legged crab creature showed up with $50 bucks for a night they'd be welcomed. Then you toss in the rising hormones and opportunities just present themselves almost like a buffet. Add in the "sweet ass raves" at many of the larger cons and you've now got a bunch of horny adolescents dancing up on each other. I've seen more sexual bumping and grinding at Otakon's raves then I have a real club in Baltimore. And at the end of those nights all those kids pack into that same mixed gender room. This is why I started saving up early to get my own room so I didn't have to wake up in the middle of the night to a bunch of nerdy strangers doing it on the dresser in front of my bed while still in their cosplay outfits. No thank you.
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LauraOrganaSolo



Joined: 13 May 2006
Posts: 90

PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 3:02 am Reply with quote
Spoiler alert: I'm an anime fan like the rest of you but I'm also a fan of J Rock, so a number of the complaints in Talkback got on my nerves. I am not a mindless, squealing teenage fangirl and I find it offensive to denigrate talented, legitimate musicians to being mere eye candy for teenybopper consumption.

GATSU wrote:
No it's not, since the J-rockers don't have any presence here, so they take a pay-cut and use the whole thing as a chance to sell an international album.

That is absolute BS and as the only consumer of Japanese pop culture for a hundred or so miles who pines for J Rock to gain a foothold in the US beyond teenage weaboos, I take a modicum of offense.

Although L'Arc~en~Ciel's Smile and Best Hits 13 were released in the US the year they came to Otakon (and Sony failed to ever successfully market those releases or any of their other Tofu Records releases), the majority of other J Rock bands that have performed at cons do NOT have any domestic releases -- Psycho le Cému, SKIN (who sadly never got an album or anything at all, damn it), JAM Project, Girugamesh, AAA, The Seatbelts, Mana, Lin Clover, Miyavi, SID, Nana Kitade, Nightmare (at least not when they had their first concert), MUCC (they wouldn't get a domestic release till two years after their US performance), etc. etc.

Fans of Japanese musicians can only pray that their favorite artists sign up for an anime convention because they are SOL on seeing them live unless they are financially secure to travel to Japan.

GATSU wrote:
Hell, considering how many people complain about the prices of American CDs, how many people do you really see paying the double the cost for the overseas stuff?

Apparently you'd be surprised. As professional wrangler of Gackt fans, I can tell you that lots of people are willing to fork over $30 + outrageous internat'l S&H fees for one piddly album. I would be ecstatic to pay American prices for Japanese CDs (which is why I own numerous Tofu Records CDs and two Maaya Sakamoto CDs).

Quote:
But those cons don't make a profit; if they did, they would actually do a better job of dealing with over-crowding, instead of cutting corners at the expense of the attendees. These concerts are just an excuse to pay off "rising operation costs" most of the time.

I'll believe that when I see some proof. Evil or Very Mad I am one of many stupid saps willing to pay last minute expensive Anime Expo badge fees to see the announced-at-the-last-minute SKIN. And that's about all I did at AX because I didn't have the time or money to do other con stuff.

J Rock is not making your cons insufferable. Bad management will happen with or without it.

Quote:
About the J-Rock band question, it bugs me too how a little-known Japanese rock band is shoved to the forefront for no reason.

See above. 3:<

Quote:
It's disappointing as an older fan to go to a convention just to see the same English voice actor guests over and over, with bands I've honestly mostly never heard of.

I trade all the no-talent English dub actors (there are exceptions but few) for A. people to actually give Japanese musicians a chance and B. L'Arc to return to an anime convention.

Quote:
-also like to mention that I'm not one of the aforementioned "teeny bopper" j-rock fans. I'm a 24 year old MALE who takes the shows seriously; I don't go and act like an immature 12 year old like many within the scene; it really gives us a bad name.

God bless you, sir. Unfortunately I am just a bitter old woman, so I'm probably not going to help matters.

Quote:
I disagree. In fact, I would argue that having the J-Rock show up props up the "teenage party fest" trend. If J-Rock is truly done to bring in those crowds, I say go ahead and stop it.

I'm going to try to clean up this post of mine a little and not be the sarcastic asshole I'd like to be in response to this.

Teenyboppers do not have the money or time to travel long distance and pay the more expensive badge fees when their flavor-of-the-month J Rock musician has been added to the roster 1-3 months before the con date.

The middle school girls you see in the audiences? They're there because anime is SUGOI KAWAII YAY BISHIES and they're probably attending the concert just because it's there/because it's related to anime (what's up L'Arc audience).

Quote:
Quote:
The fanbase has been building for years and it's bigger than most people believe it to be.


If you count Japanese expatriates living in America, sure.

It's unfortunate your confidence is not backed up by any sort of actual knowledge because that is also absolutely false. The fanbase may not be large enough to support nation-wide solo tours but L'Arc vocalist's Hyde's California show sold out in under a half an hour; three more dates were added, and two of them sold out in less than 15 minutes (unfortunately the San Francisco Chronicle's article on this has 404'd).

GATSU wrote:
Quote:
I don't go and act like an immature 12 year old like many within the scene; it really gives us a bad name.

You do know that's their target audience in Japan, right? Rolling Eyes

Maybe for Johnny's kei but not for the more... music-oriented actual musicians.

I don't have any websites or numbers to back this up but a friend of mine just went to a Gackt concert earlier this month. After years of bemoaning hormonal 15 year-old girls terrorizing the Gackt fandom, she was pleasantly surprised to find the audience to be largely 20+ -- which was the same when I went to one in 2005, although she said she saw a surprising amount of women who looked older than 35 (probably due to Fuurin Kazan's popularity in 2007).

Quote:
I have another solution. Start your own convention, conference, or workshop. It doesn't have to be big with thousands of people. Start a small, meaningful conference or convention for people who happen to share the same sentiment as yours.

I'm not even going to touch this. I don't think I can without my rage overflowing more than it is.

Quote:
They've also introduced me to artists that I'd never heard but now love.

You BAWWWWWWing close-minded anime fans should learn a lesson from this.

TL;DR - Please partake of a large bowl of male reproductive organs. Cons are full of obnoxious horny teenagers with or without J Rock.

Edit: A friend of mine -- who has no interest in J Rock and prefers the likes of JAM Project-- gave me a chuckle when I complained to him and he responded with the following:

Quote:
Conventions are organized with the goal of entertaining thousands of people, many of whom are not satisfied sitting in their hotel room all weekend jerking off onto KOS-MOS figures


Last edited by LauraOrganaSolo on Sat Feb 07, 2009 11:40 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Psycho 101
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 3:24 am Reply with quote
Quote:
But those cons don't make a profit; if they did, they would actually do a better job of dealing with over-crowding, instead of cutting corners at the expense of the attendees. These concerts are just an excuse to pay off "rising operation costs" most of the time.

Yes they make a profit but those profits go into the expenses for the next year. Every guest a con brings is at the cons expense 95% of the time. That means travel, hotel, food, etc. The larger the con the more guests the more expenses. Not to mention renting larger convention centers themselves are NOT cheap. I can only speculate how many thousands of dollars AX/Otakon spend booking con centers for 3-4 days. Then there's your staff. Most cons I've worked at/been to do not pay them but there is a staff dinner afterwards. That's not cheap. Plus if you do something for the guests then you have more costs. In the case of bands the con also probably has to cover the extra cost of not just transporting the band but their equipment too. As for the problem of over crowding, that had almost nothing to do with money or profit but logistics and staffing. All the money in the world won't help if the con staff are douchnozzles and lazy rude jerks. I've seen quite of a few of them at larger cons and I've heard all the wonderful tales from this past AX. Most over crowding issues are the result of poor planning or lazy staff and not profit/monetary issues. Remember, the staffers and gophers are volunteers and not paid in 99% of all cons and their staff.
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LauraOrganaSolo



Joined: 13 May 2006
Posts: 90

PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 3:27 am Reply with quote
Psycho 101 wrote:
In the case of bands the con also probably has to cover the extra cost of not just transporting the band but their equipment too.

Fees to record label, food & lodging, etc. aside, musical guests are not THE CANCER THAT IS KILLING ANIME CONVENTIONS though.
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Zac
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 4:03 am Reply with quote
LauraOrganaSolo wrote:

Fees to record label, food & lodging, etc. aside, musical guests are not THE CANCER THAT IS KILLING ANIME CONVENTIONS though.


THE CANCER KILLING THIS THREAD is kinda you though, just saying.
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Roy9076



Joined: 06 Jan 2006
Posts: 286
Location: California

PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 4:46 am Reply with quote
Quite an interesting article there Brian. I would like to comment about the J-rock/pop scene within the anime conventions since that hardly gets in an Answerman column. A very interesting insight and really does present a true case of an increase rise of Japanese musicians entering an anime convention world. Is Japanaese musicians really needed with an anime convention? Really depends on the cons, but seems that a fair amount would bring them over. Not all of them are for profit, but really, the money is what makes things happen. Really gets down to that. Furthermore, I would love to see Dir en grey show up in an anime convention. That would be amusing considering their fanbase are different from the anime fanbase, but the point still stands on what the article represents. Good job!


LauraOrganaSolo wrote:
Fans of Japanese musicians can only pray that their favorite artists sign up for an anime convention because they are SOL on seeing them live unless they are financially secure to travel to Japan.


Japanese musicians have other options than anime conventions. There are quite a few business companies and industry within the J-rock/pop business actively trying to bring in Japanese bands to North America as much as possibly can.
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penguintruth



Joined: 08 Dec 2004
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 5:29 am Reply with quote
If it's a band that has done a popular theme song for a popular anime, I can accept their presence at an anime convention. Otherwise, I can't approve. Just like those lame LARP rooms at cons. It's not anime or manga-related. I only accept gamer rooms with the understanding that there is some crossover between the two fandoms, but as unwashed and dirty as they say anime fans are, its always the gamer room that smells like a gerbil cage.
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Animehermit



Joined: 05 Aug 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 7:49 am Reply with quote
penguintruth wrote:
If it's a band that has done a popular theme song for a popular anime, I can accept their presence at an anime convention. Otherwise, I can't approve. Just like those lame LARP rooms at cons. It's not anime or manga-related. I only accept gamer rooms with the understanding that there is some crossover between the two fandoms, but as unwashed and dirty as they say anime fans are, its always the gamer room that smells like a gerbil cage.


I agree most of the time J-rock is not even close to being related to anime.
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Prinnydood



Joined: 12 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 9:47 am Reply with quote
Re: J-Rock at anime conventions.

Different conventions have different objectives. At a strictly anime or anime/manga convention, the presence of a Japanese musical guest might have only tangential relevance. However, Otakon (for example, there are probably others) promotes itself as a celebration of Japanese (and to a lesser extent other Asian) "pop culture". In that context, having a Japanese band as guests makes perfect sense.
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