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It's time for ANN to lose PayPal


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Key
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Location: Indianapolis, IN (formerly Mimiho Valley)

PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2012 4:43 pm Reply with quote
This sounds like a phishing scam to me. I've used PayPal at least a couple of times a month for several years (including within the past week) and never seen anything like this come up but I have seen phishing somewhat along these lines. Some of those can look very, very convincing, too.
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chefneer
Aria CompanyAria Company


Joined: 27 Aug 2009
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Location: Back in Forth Worth

PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2012 8:51 pm Reply with quote
I do not believe it's phishing. I'm getting this BS directly from the PayPal website. I've never gotten an email from anyone about this, until I discovered that they had limited my ability to manage my account, and I began asking them for an explanation.

However, in the interest of curiosity, I am going to proceed with a purge and scan of my computer to see what happens. It will likely take several hours.
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Shiroi Hane
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 10:51 am Reply with quote
chefneer wrote:
I do not believe it's phishing. I'm getting this BS directly from the PayPal website.

That still leaves potential for DNS spoofing and man-in-the-middle attacks.
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Keonyn
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Joined: 25 May 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 11:33 am Reply with quote
That's exactly what phishing is, an attack that intercepts a users attempt to access a legit site and redirects the flow to an exact replica of that site hosted illegitimately by someone else so they can then take your information when you try to send it in. It's still going to look just like Paypal's site, that's the point, if it's obviously a fake they're not going to fool anyone.

Of course, there is still the potential it is legit. If Paypal, or any financial credit processor, has reason to suspect there is fraudulent activity occurring they can shut down an account and request this information. It's possible that this is Paypal's official site and you are being asked to present this because they flagged suspicious activity on your account for one reason or another.

Either way, the best thing you can do is call Paypal to clarify what's going on, and I highly recommend you do so. If it is indeed an account that has been frozen because of suspicious activity, you're doing yourself no good in not pursuing that avenue to find out what the activity is. It could be a legit purchase simply flagged their system as suspicious, my bank once temporarily froze my card when I was out grabbing school supplies for college because the spending spree at so many locations tripped an alert in their system. I called them and it got cleared up. However, if there is some fraudulent activity or your information is in fact compromised then it might be important to know that, so calling Paypal is the best thing you can do. If it is a phishing site, calling Paypal will also rectify that as they will be able to confirm they are not requesting any such information as I assure you that isn't standard practice. I used my account just last week and I can tell you for certain they don't have any of that kind of information on file from me.
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egoist
Pirate KingPirate King


Joined: 20 Jun 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 11:36 am Reply with quote
It's probably safer and faster to ring them and sort it out.

I took the liberty to visit their site. You can proceed by logging on first at: https://www.paypal.com/​us/​cgi-​bin/​helpscr?​cmd=​_contact-​phone and getting some sort of password so they don't have to ask you about every detail.

Or...

Quote:
Contact Us
PayPal Customer Service:

1-888-221-1161
1-402-935-2050 (if calling from outside the U.S.)

4:00 AM to 10:00 PM Pacific Time Monday through Friday
6:00 AM to 8:00 PM Pacific Time Saturday and Sunday
Please note that hours of operation may vary on holidays
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dormcat
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Joined: 08 Dec 2003
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Location: New Taipei City, Taiwan, ROC

PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 4:08 pm Reply with quote
chefneer wrote:
I do not believe it's phishing. I'm getting this BS directly from the PayPal website.

May I ask by what standards and signs do you believe it came from the PayPal website directly? Did you perform a traceroute? Have you checked the IP --> domain name and vice versa via a third party server?

If I were you I'd just call them.
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dewlwieldthedarpachief



Joined: 04 Jan 2007
Posts: 747
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 8:52 pm Reply with quote
I've experienced being redirected to a phishing website using PayPal. Soon thereafter, I contacted both the merchant and PayPal and verified that the page was illegitimate, then I might have done some cleaning or even a fresh install of the OS, and the problem did not persist.

Don't be fooled by the legitimate appearance; anytime your SIN factors into a business transaction, that's a red flag.
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geishageek
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Joined: 28 Nov 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 10:31 pm Reply with quote
I went through this with paypal a few months ago. I pre-ordered a figure from Hobby Japan and they authorized a $0.01 charge to paypal to make sure the account was in good standing. This was a no no for paypal so they nixed my account until I could provide information that I was me and the $0.01 was legitimate, in case someone else (someone being in Japan) had gotten into my account. They just want verification that you indeed live at the verified address paypal has on file. I think finally they called me (well a messaging service) with a code I had to input to re-instate my account.

It was a pain but I am glad they looked at the silly charge and said "hey wait.. that seems strange".
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egoist
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 11:41 pm Reply with quote
I recall going through this 0.01 charge as well, but they didn't ask me for any other information.
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chefneer
Aria CompanyAria Company


Joined: 27 Aug 2009
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Location: Back in Forth Worth

PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2012 8:28 pm Reply with quote
I've been trading emails with them, to no effect. I keep telling them that I want an explanation, and they keep telling me to send them scanned copies of bank statements, utility bills and so on. Over and over. They insist that until I send them the documents I cannot add money to the account, which effectively means that I cannot use it. As I stated earlier, it does not appear that I am the only one singled out for this. I would like very much to know why I have been singled out, but so far they seem unwilling to explain themselves. My last communication from them was Wednesday, at which time I again requested an explanation. I've heard nothing from them since.

I've been doing some research and this is what I have so far discovered.

Some time before Bush left office, he signed a farm aid bill. One of the earmarks on that bill resulted in a law known as IRC (Internal Revenue Code) 6050W. The purpose of this law is to increase tax revenues from small online sellers by requiring third-party processors (that would be PayPal, Amazon, and so on) to report to the IRS annual gross sales from said small sellers in January. The processors are required to report the individual seller's name, address, gross sales, and SSN or tax ID number. If they make a report on an individual seller they are required to send to that seller a 1099-k by January 31.

However, there is an exclusion, which is that only sellers that have in excess of $20,000 in sales AND a minimum of 200 transactions in a year are to be reported. Any seller under those numbers is exempt.

The law went into effect January 1, 2011, with the first reports due in January of 2012.

There is no provision in the law requiring the processors to collect the information PayPal is demanding, especially in the manner in which they are demanding it. As far as I can tell, no other processor is making the same demands of the people they service. In my case, they already have this information, and they have had it for some time. Why they want it all over again is a mystery, and their demand that I attach photographic images of these documents to an email is simply absurd.

PayPal appears to be using the law as an excuse to collect information about some of its account holders, though why they are picking on some, and not others, is a mystery - they refuse to explain themselves. So, it does indeed appear to be phishing, but it's PayPal doing the phishing.

There have been reports that some people who have been singled out like this have been prevented from closing their accounts until they provide the information, but I intend to try it anyway. Maybe I'll get lucky.

So, if ANN wants to continue to use PayPal as a payment processor, that is their privilege, but, like others before me have done, I do recommend, and request, that another means of accepting payment for subscriptions be made available, even if it's a P.O. box to which checks can be mailed.

I intend to attempt to close my PayPal account. If succesful, I don't know if I will ever try to open another. If I do, I suspect it won't be for some time.
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dormcat
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2012 8:41 pm Reply with quote
No offense, chefneer, but a phone call would be far more efficient than studying US tax laws. Unless they hang up your call; in that case you might want to send the phone recording to the press and/or a court of law.
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chefneer
Aria CompanyAria Company


Joined: 27 Aug 2009
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Location: Back in Forth Worth

PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2012 9:14 pm Reply with quote
Please don't assume that I'm stupid. I have been trying to contact these people, and they don't want to talk. They have stated in their form letters that all of this is required by law, which is bunk. It is that claim which induced me to look at the law. I am not the only person this is happening to. If it's not happening to you, that's awesome, but as I've previously stated they are not picking on every account holder, and the criteria they are using to select those they WILL pick on is not something they are prepared to explain. They appear to have begun doing this sometime last year and why they haven't gotten to me until now is another mystery - I have been using my account without issues until very recently. As for legal action, which do you really think would be more cost effective, spending years and thousands of dollars in a lawsuit, or simply closing the account?

In my world, it would be to close the account.

There appears to be an assumption that I'm somewhat touched in the head, and PayPal is flawless...neither is entirely true.
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dtm42



Joined: 05 Feb 2008
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Location: NZL

PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2012 9:31 pm Reply with quote
How expensive is a phone-call?

You come in here and moan about Paypal but don't do the simplest and most obvious thing you can; call them.

Eight-hundred customer service representatives are standing by, and they are unlikely to ignore a phone-call.

1-888-221-1161 <--- that's the number you need to ring. But first, make sure you visit this web-page...

https://www.paypal.com/​us/​cgi-​bin/​helpscr?​cmd=​_contact-​phone

...and get a pass-code which will identify you to Paypal so that they can discuss your personal account details with you.

That took me less than five minutes to find out.

You're welcome.
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mer2329



Joined: 29 Jun 2008
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Wed Oct 10, 2012 7:03 pm Reply with quote
chefneer wrote:
I've sent them an email requesting an explanation. God knows when, or if, they'll respond to it.

I've been doing some cruising on the net, and it appears that I'm not alone. There's no way to know, of course, how widespread it is, or if they're picking on selected accounts or if they'll eventually pick on everybody.

If it's malware they've already got my info, because the same connection that's giving me this BS has my complete profile. It's always possible, but I don't think I'm missing anything. I've logged in to the account several times, with the same result every time.

As for the Yen purchase, I have accounts in five different currencies, and I've never had problems with them, so I don't know.

What I do know, is that I cannot use my PayPal account, for anything.

have you tried a frends computer
also do a scan with malware bites and ad aware
if that dosent help i say call them

paypal's website wrote:
1-888-221-1161 (USA only)
1-402-935-2050 (if calling from outside the U.S.)
For eBay questions, go to www.ebay.com, sign in to your account, and click Customer Support near the top of the page.
4:00 AM to 10:00 PM Pacific Time Monday through Friday
6:00 AM to 8:00 PM Pacific Time Saturday and Sunday
Please note that hours of operation may vary on holidays
for reference pacific time is UTC-08:00
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