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Otakon 2009 - Fansubs and Industry panel


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mudduck454



Joined: 29 Jul 2009
Posts: 292

PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 5:26 am Reply with quote
why can't the original anime companies just subtitle the blu-ray disks only but not the the DVDs, since blu-ray is not region coded, and people buy stuff from japan all the time, it would be interesting to see how many new shows were bought in blu-ray just because of that reason, and wait and see how the American companies cry foul....

I hate to say it, but if the K-On blu-ray release had subtitles, I would have bought it and had it shipped to me here in America, since blu-ray disks from japan will play in an American blu-ray player.

I am always watching cdjapan for new releases, that may contain subtitles, since I cannot speak Japanese. and I don't care if the other person thinks I lie about buying DVDs, I have over 600 DVDs, and over 100 anime DVDs, and have started buying blu-ray, I only have 37 of them right now, but I am slowly replacing the DVDs with blu-ray

So am I the only one who thinks that would be a good Idea,
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krelyan



Joined: 30 Mar 2005
Posts: 166
Location: Utah

PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 11:18 am Reply with quote
mudduck454 wrote:
So am I the only one who thinks that would be a good Idea,

Not all of us share your enthusiasm for paying the high-price points on Japanese releases when the R1 companies release them for half the price (and sans exorbitant shipping prices).
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DomFortress



Joined: 13 Feb 2009
Posts: 751
Location: Richmond BC, Canada

PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 11:26 am Reply with quote
mudduck454 wrote:
why can't the original anime companies just subtitle the blu-ray disks only but not the the DVDs, since blu-ray is not region coded, and people buy stuff from japan all the time, it would be interesting to see how many new shows were bought in blu-ray just because of that reason, and wait and see how the American companies cry foul....

I hate to say it, but if the K-On blu-ray release had subtitles, I would have bought it and had it shipped to me here in America, since blu-ray disks from japan will play in an American blu-ray player.

I am always watching cdjapan for new releases, that may contain subtitles, since I cannot speak Japanese. and I don't care if the other person thinks I lie about buying DVDs, I have over 600 DVDs, and over 100 anime DVDs, and have started buying blu-ray, I only have 37 of them right now, but I am slowly replacing the DVDs with blu-ray

So am I the only one who thinks that would be a good Idea,
Well I think it's a bad idea, for a niche anime market to slowly replacing a more accessible DVD technology, when the Japanese anime industry is already suffering from a nation wide depression. That just doesn't sound very smart at all.
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Mohawk52



Joined: 16 Oct 2003
Posts: 7374
Location: England, UK

PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 8:46 pm Reply with quote
I find it interesting, and a bit vindicating, that the Media Blasters, and Funi reps both admitted that they looked at similcasting as "a way to bring the fansub downloaders back". I was also surprised to learn that Japan wants to increase UK and European licenses. I hope this is coming very soon, because so far it's still quite sparce.
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walw6pK4Alo



Joined: 12 Mar 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2009 9:03 pm Reply with quote
Mohawk52 wrote:
I find it interesting, and a bit vindicating, that the Media Blasters, and Funi reps both admitted that they looked at similcasting as "a way to bring the fansub downloaders back". I was also surprised to learn that Japan wants to increase UK and European licenses. I hope this is coming very soon, because so far it's still quite sparce.


I'd like simulcasting if the quality wasn't lower than the quality of fansubs that get released. If it continues like Phantom, they'll never get those people back.
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DomFortress



Joined: 13 Feb 2009
Posts: 751
Location: Richmond BC, Canada

PostPosted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 3:30 am Reply with quote
walw6pK4Alo wrote:
Mohawk52 wrote:
I find it interesting, and a bit vindicating, that the Media Blasters, and Funi reps both admitted that they looked at similcasting as "a way to bring the fansub downloaders back". I was also surprised to learn that Japan wants to increase UK and European licenses. I hope this is coming very soon, because so far it's still quite sparce.


I'd like simulcasting if the quality wasn't lower than the quality of fansubs that get released. If it continues like Phantom, they'll never get those people back.
If fansub groups have to pay for their bandwidth and maintenance of their online distribution networkd just like the anime industry do with theirs, do you honestly think that they'll be hosting the kind of file quality as is, for every single fansub, with every single file transfer? Rolling Eyes
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walw6pK4Alo



Joined: 12 Mar 2008
Posts: 8142

PostPosted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 3:49 am Reply with quote
DomFortress wrote:
walw6pK4Alo wrote:
Mohawk52 wrote:
I find it interesting, and a bit vindicating, that the Media Blasters, and Funi reps both admitted that they looked at similcasting as "a way to bring the fansub downloaders back". I was also surprised to learn that Japan wants to increase UK and European licenses. I hope this is coming very soon, because so far it's still quite sparce.


I'd like simulcasting if the quality wasn't lower than the quality of fansubs that get released. If it continues like Phantom, they'll never get those people back.
If fansub groups have to pay for their bandwidth and maintenance of their online distribution networkd just like the anime industry do with theirs, do you honestly think that they'll be hosting the kind of file quality as is, for every single fansub, with every single file transfer? Rolling Eyes


No, but that's irrelevant with the scope of my argument, being the inferior visually quality, regardless of these bandwidth problems. If anything, the distribution among everyone is better, because you don't end up with bottlenecks or slow downs, like FUNi's streaming had for like two shows. Imagine if they got more, you'd never get those files to load.

Anyway, this could have all been easily solved if they'd host it on YouTube, and not on their own site.
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DomFortress



Joined: 13 Feb 2009
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Location: Richmond BC, Canada

PostPosted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 4:29 am Reply with quote
walw6pK4Alo wrote:
Anyway, this could have all been easily solved if they'd host it on YouTube, and not on their own site.
While Google is insisting on content providers to pay for hosting their videos on Youtube, when the site can't generate enough revenues, to host its user-submitted base contents via ad supports alone?
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bayoab



Joined: 06 Oct 2004
Posts: 830

PostPosted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 8:07 am Reply with quote
DomFortress wrote:
walw6pK4Alo wrote:
Anyway, this could have all been easily solved if they'd host it on YouTube, and not on their own site.
While Google is insisting on content providers to pay for hosting their videos on Youtube, when the site can't generate enough revenues, to host its user-submitted base contents via ad supports alone?
Having trouble finding the better sources but that article was pretty much debunked. [Links here and here] Youtube basically has responded by claiming the numbers are pulled out of the air and aren't even close to representative.
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DomFortress



Joined: 13 Feb 2009
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 4:05 pm Reply with quote
bayoab wrote:
DomFortress wrote:
walw6pK4Alo wrote:
Anyway, this could have all been easily solved if they'd host it on YouTube, and not on their own site.
While Google is insisting on content providers to pay for hosting their videos on Youtube, when the site can't generate enough revenues, to host its user-submitted base contents via ad supports alone?
Having trouble finding the better sources but that article was pretty much debunked. [Links here and here] Youtube basically has responded by claiming the numbers are pulled out of the air and aren't even close to representative.
Only, and only if, that YouTube will become the only major content hosting site, when that kind of prediction will become a reality through Google monopolizing online streaming market. Is that what you would like to see it happens?

Furthermore, what's your thought about debunking my comment not by your words but with others instead. And yes, by doing so, I am questioning the very existence of your authority, when you obviously don't have a comment of your own. What makes you to even believe in anything that you've said, when you're not even authentic?

And finally, the fact still remains that YouTube will still ask content providers to pay for their bandwidth cost for hosting their contents via YouTube, when Google isn't a monopoly by far.
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Zin5ki



Joined: 06 Jan 2008
Posts: 3485
Location: London, UK

PostPosted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 4:34 pm Reply with quote
Mohawk52 wrote:
I was also surprised to learn that Japan wants to increase UK and European licenses.

I'll admit their discussion on the European situation was optimistic and promising, if a little brief. I'd fathom the intentions expressed aren't quite ready to come into fruition though. If there are big plans to shake up the existing licensing paradigms, I expect we'd be hearing about them through the relevant grapevines. Best keeping our ears to the ground, just like we normally do...
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mudduck454



Joined: 29 Jul 2009
Posts: 292

PostPosted: Sun Aug 02, 2009 11:38 pm Reply with quote
krelyan wrote:
mudduck454 wrote:
So am I the only one who thinks that would be a good Idea,

Not all of us share your enthusiasm for paying the high-price points on Japanese releases when the R1 companies release them for half the price (and sans exorbitant shipping prices).


but there lies the problem... there are a lot of shows I would love to have that will never see the light of day in america, because funi thinks they know what I want to buy,

If thats the case, then I should have been able to buy Rizelmine on DVD in america with subtitles, the show is over 5 years old, and still popular, so why has it not been released in R1??????

And another show I would love to see that might never see a R1 release is Kanokon..... so my only option is to buy the R2 japanese version, put it on my computer, add subtitles to it, and burn it to a blank DVD, but if the japanese companies would offer the show already subbed, I would consider it, because I have seen the production quality of some subtitles DVD releases in R1, and I can do a better job than that....

so since we live in a global economy, it makes sense for japanese anime companies to consider adding official subtitles to their new releases, a simple web search will show you that a region free DVD player can be bought fairly easy..... and leave the crappy english dubs to the american companies...

and about the high price for anime, some people will pay a premium for a quality product, have you ever compared a R2 anime DVD to a R1 DVD??? there is a difference, and the R2 DVDs are of better encoding quality, but that is to be expected when you try to cram 7 episodes onto one DVD, you lose in picture quality.

I had the option to buy the complete set for the anime shuffle, I had 2 choices, either buy the 6 separate DVDs, or the new thinpack 4 DVD set, I opted for the 6 DVDs, because I can almost guarantee they had to compress the video a little to get them onto 4 DVDs. and since the R1s are already not as good as R2 releases, I didn't want more compression, that and due to the sale I was able to buy the 6 DVD set cheaper that the new thinpack release, it came out to 20.00USD for 6DVDs whereas the thinpack of 4 cost 49.00USD retail, 35.00USD on sale.

so when funi starts releasing anime with the same video quality as Japan I would consider paying more for it,

but in reality, most shows will never make it to america, so if I want a show I have to pay a premium for it, but if I really like the show, then I will, but having them already subtitled would be a nice touch.
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DomFortress



Joined: 13 Feb 2009
Posts: 751
Location: Richmond BC, Canada

PostPosted: Mon Aug 03, 2009 12:22 am Reply with quote
mudduck454 wrote:
krelyan wrote:
mudduck454 wrote:
So am I the only one who thinks that would be a good Idea,

Not all of us share your enthusiasm for paying the high-price points on Japanese releases when the R1 companies release them for half the price (and sans exorbitant shipping prices).


but there lies the problem... there are a lot of shows I would love to have that will never see the light of day in america, because funi thinks they know what I want to buy,

If thats the case, then I should have been able to buy Rizelmine on DVD in america with subtitles, the show is over 5 years old, and still popular, so why has it not been released in R1??????

And another show I would love to see that might never see a R1 release is Kanokon..... so my only option is to buy the R2 japanese version, put it on my computer, add subtitles to it, and burn it to a blank DVD, but if the japanese companies would offer the show already subbed, I would consider it, because I have seen the production quality of some subtitles DVD releases in R1, and I can do a better job than that....

so since we live in a global economy, it makes sense for japanese anime companies to consider adding official subtitles to their new releases, a simple web search will show you that a region free DVD player can be bought fairly easy..... and leave the crappy english dubs to the american companies...

and about the high price for anime, some people will pay a premium for a quality product, have you ever compared a R2 anime DVD to a R1 DVD??? there is a difference, and the R2 DVDs are of better encoding quality, but that is to be expected when you try to cram 7 episodes onto one DVD, you lose in picture quality.

I had the option to buy the complete set for the anime shuffle, I had 2 choices, either buy the 6 separate DVDs, or the new thinpack 4 DVD set, I opted for the 6 DVDs, because I can almost guarantee they had to compress the video a little to get them onto 4 DVDs. and since the R1s are already not as good as R2 releases, I didn't want more compression, that and due to the sale I was able to buy the 6 DVD set cheaper that the new thinpack release, it came out to 20.00USD for 6DVDs whereas the thinpack of 4 cost 49.00USD retail, 35.00USD on sale.

so when funi starts releasing anime with the same video quality as Japan I would consider paying more for it,

but in reality, most shows will never make it to america, so if I want a show I have to pay a premium for it, but if I really like the show, then I will, but having them already subtitled would be a nice touch.
It's not that you can't get what you want because FUNimation won't license it. And while FUNimation do need to consider who their target audiences are and what do they want, the fact that most North American anime fans just don't like what you want for yourself isn't because of you.
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Agent355



Joined: 12 Dec 2008
Posts: 2190
Location: Crackberry in hand, thumbs at the ready...

PostPosted: Mon Aug 03, 2009 1:38 am Reply with quote
I just want to butt in on the fansub discussion to thank ANN for the high quality panel video. This, and the Miyazaki clip from Comic-Con, really made my day! Very Happy

I know its hard work for you guys, but I really appreciate being able to feel like I was at panels that I am unable to go to. I'd love for this to become a regular featuren because it will keep ANN head and shoulders above its competitors in anime news coverage! Anyone can "live-blog" a con panel, but being able to provide video so we can all hear the info straight up? That's incredible! More please? Wink
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ConanSan



Joined: 13 Jun 2007
Posts: 1818

PostPosted: Mon Aug 03, 2009 5:46 pm Reply with quote
Zin5ki wrote:
Mohawk52 wrote:
I was also surprised to learn that Japan wants to increase UK and European licenses.

I'll admit their discussion on the European situation was optimistic and promising, if a little brief. I'd fathom the intentions expressed aren't quite ready to come into fruition though. If there are big plans to shake up the existing licensing paradigms, I expect we'd be hearing about them through the relevant grapevines. Best keeping our ears to the ground, just like we normally do...
Nipon can wish to do whatever it wants but wishes donesn't get food on the table nor One Piece DVDs spining in my DVD player.
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