Forum - View topicThe Mike Toole Show - Can't Fight Fate
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OtakuKitten
 Posts: 72 |
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Here is my only problem with the Fate/ series:
spoiler[ Why is King Arthur (Saber) a woman? I know that the target demographic for the series is male and thus the lead should be male and his servant female but then why choose a character from literature that is male? I am not saying that the series is terrible because of this I really enjoy the idea's behind it and right up until the reveal of Saber's past I was fully on board with anything they were going to send my way, but that gender reversal purely for the sake of having a tsundere character killed everything for me. Here is my catch though. If someone can explain to me an in story reason for the gender change of King Arthur and all of his knights (that we have seen anyway) then I will gladly eat my words, feet, hat, whatever and give this series another shot. That being said every time I pose this question to a fan the only response that I get is "She hid her identy so her men would follow her." or other ways that the creators changed the legend around to make the female version work not the why. So once again I am posting in order to better understand this series: Why is King Arthur female other then they needed that character to be a woman? ] Other than that small matter which I have made large I really liked that they used Medea in Fate/Stay Night as the magic welding servant and I wish that there was more of her in the show. Anytime my theatre history knowledge comes in handy while watching anime makes me giddy. |
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ryukage
Posts: 32 |
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Here are some of my picks for servants:
Berserker- William Wallace Caster- Nikola Tesla Saber (the strongest class)- King Leonidas |
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jojothepunisher
 Posts: 799 |
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I think it is difficult for anybody to think up of a legendary hero that has the same impact as the ones from Fate/ series. What mainly sells the characters in Fate/ series is their portrayal as tragic heroes. Almost every single one of them had some sort of misfortune happen to them. Now, most of these portrayals are romanticized, so asking people to come up with a hero that they want to be fighting in the next Grail War is like the same thing as asking them to write an elaborate back story for their hero, which is almost impossible because none of us can write as good as Nasu. So I am just saying, the heroes that average people come up with are not going to be impactful, not until Nasu gets involved.
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DavidShallcross
 Posts: 1008 |
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I like Odysseus for Archer. But, pretty much, the whole Grail War is EVIL, resulting in nothing but misery for everybody even in the general vicinity. I would hope that there is never another iteration after the one in Fate/Stay Night.
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GVman
 Posts: 729 |
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You left Fate/hollow ataraxia and Fate/Apocrypha out of your article.
Anyway, I hope that sometime in the future you actually do read through the original VN and do an article on it. Same goes for Tsukihime; the anime adaptation for that is even worse than the F/SN anime. |
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jojothepunisher
Posts: 799 |
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Just to troll you, spoiler[there is no reason that Saber is female other than making an interesting plot twist. You can't ask why Saber is female, because that is just the way it is in the Fate/series. Its like the same thing as asking why the acceleration due to gravity on earth is 9.8m/s^2, the answer is that's just how the universe works. And just to make things clear, Saber was female right from when she was born, so in this universe there is no such thing as Saber was originally a male but got turned into female by some dark magic.] But regardless, I hope you give the series another try. Because it is more than just a harem game/show. If anything, Fate/series pack intense actions, drama, and plot twists. If you really get irritated by things like harem or +18 material, just skip those parts, pretend they never happened, and you will still be able to enjoy the game/show, at least that's how I enjoyed it. |
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Seif
 Posts: 456 |
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Because that's the pitch.
spoiler[Arthur is the only one genderbent.][/quote] |
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Fencedude5609
 Posts: 5088 |
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All my money |
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Fencedude5609
Posts: 5088 |
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Because she is. Literally, thats the reason. Its an interesting plot twist, and is well integrated with the lore of the universe. You may as well ask why Medusa, Medea and Heracles are "real" in this universe while Sasaki Koujiro is "fictional". Its just the way things are. |
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agila61
 Posts: 3213 Location: NE Ohio |
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There's certain to be a bucketload of things he's left out, writing about a media family like "Fate/" will either be incomplete or unwieldy and absurdly long. Any particularly interesting connection between these two and the things he included? |
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Hardgear
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I was one of the crazy fools buying the Fate/Stay Night singles as they were coming out from Geneon back in the day. Damn I was relieved that they were able to squeeze that last one out before collapsing, cause they had me worried for a second there. Overall the Fate/ franchise is definitely one of my all time favorites, glad Fate/Zero dragged more people into it.
I always thought that Bloody Mary (the ghost more so than the the queen who may or may not have been an influence) would be an awesome Caster. Much fun to be had with mirror and divination based magics. |
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agila61
Posts: 3213 Location: NE Ohio |
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(oops, redacted too much: just spoiler the actual spoilers)
Well, spoiler[Launcelot was male.]. I never saw Fate/stay-night, spoiler[what other Authorian knights appear in that one? ] However, on the main question ... I think I got it, on an emotional level after the scene in Fate/Zero ep11 spoiler[where Rider and Saber talk over wine about what it means to be a King], but I don't feel any particular desire to try to pin that down into some dry verbal rationale just so you give the series another shot. Heck, if you can't relax and see where they go with it, maybe the ride isn't for you. |
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RTL3
 Posts: 36 |
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I gave the Fate/ series a spin this summer. Heard lots of great things about Zero but decided to start with the visual novel (the less than legal way). It was.... interesting. It was my first visual novel experience so the novelty didn't wear off for awhile, but damn did it drag. I can very close to giving up many times, I just hated those main characters so much, but the concept was really interesting.
Im glad I stuck with it, because it made the Fate/Zero experience more enjoyable. Im sure I would have enjoyed it without the visual novel, but all the little moments and references enhanced the experience. I also picked up the movie but that was less enjoyable. All in all I would say its an interesting francise, but comes with a steep learning curve. Vlad the Impaler/Count Dracula as class Assassin. Because the ridiculously detailed Servant system allows for fictitious characters. Or on the other hand, real people, but with powers from their myths. |
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LuScr
Posts: 140 |
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For those who are piracy-averse and don't want to blow $200 on the PC game (+PS2 version for the voices) there is a complete Let's Play of Fate/Stay Night that's pretty easy to find through Google. It's mostly screen shots and text with a few video clips, but it is complete (with all three routes and all 40 bad ends) and it's better than nothing...and you really do need to experience the original visual novel to fully appreciate why F/SN has such a strong following.
Setting aside, the thing which impresses me the most about the game is its masterful use of foreshadowing. There are three routes (different ways the 5th Holy Grail War plays out, with different Servants taking prominence and different results) and they have to be played in order--you can't get to "Unlimited Blade Works" until you finish "Fate," and you can't access "Heaven's Feel" until you've completed "Unlimited Blade Works." Type-moon took full advantage of that. Not everything gets revealed right away, because not everything has to be. There are questions raised in "Fate" that are only answered in "Unlimited Blade Works" or "Heaven's Feel" (some of which, unfortunately, made it into the original anime adaptation of "Fate," where they became merely aggravating loose ends). There are almost identical situations between the routes played out with different characters, with the contrasts highlighting important developments. There are several instances where some element of a situation in one route will unexpectedly come into play to resolve a situation in a later one (e.g. spoiler[Rule Breaker]). There are multiple layers in just about everything, and implications for events in the earlier route(s) as things develop further--you almost have to go back and replay "Fate" and "Unlimited Blade Works" after you finish the whole game to fully appreciate how it all fits together. |
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OtakuKitten
Posts: 72 |
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Nice troll.  Thanks for taking my question seriously though.
Why this really ticks me off is because they stick closely to the original mithos of these characters; or at least as close as they can with a story that puts ancient heroes in modern Japan. Why suddenly change that just because the figure you chose isn't the gender needed and then take pains to alter the myth.W hy not try and find a character that would fit the mold that they needed. Hypalita of the Amazon springs to mind. |
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