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ANNCast - Sheh's All That


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Ashen Phoenix



Joined: 21 Jun 2006
Posts: 1646

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 3:45 am Reply with quote
Zac, please allow me the honor of bein' the first to say that your bold statement of preferring cake over pie instantly brought to my mind the small sequence of webcomics Roosterteeth devoted to this very, very volatile topic.

For that alone, I thank you. The sheer wholeheartedness in which you declared your choice made me laugh. Anime catgrin

I'm absolutely entranced by ANN's podcast, and will surely be hooked on it from hence forth.

The discussion regarding buying anime DVDs to support dubbed work really hit home for me. As recently as a few months ago, I, like far too many people, was unemployed and had been so for over a year.

Admittedly I've turned to a friend to get burned CDs of anime series which I've wanted to investigate. All the same, it's nagged me with a persistent, lingering guilt in the back of my mind, and listening to this arose it in full force.

Given how badly I've felt over the past couple of years watching, in my eyes, rather helplessly as the industry and fans suffer alike, I'm now in deep contemplation as to what my first paycheck ought to go towards.

I'd planned to save most of it for a artist tablet, while spending the rest on a handful of manga, but now I'm thinking, "Hey, I'm really into Baccano! right now. It's not like anything I've seen before. And it's not that long a series. Maybe I should buy that."

I've no idea if a Thinpak or otehr such boxset exists, but it's something about which you've all given me much thought. I hope, similarly, hearing (err--reading) this from me will make you guys a little happy knowing at least one person "got" what you're saying. Embarassed
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ayashe



Joined: 31 Mar 2008
Posts: 105

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 3:53 am Reply with quote
Quote:
In the grim future of anime, there may be only subs!


Please don't get my hopes up.
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Scamp



Joined: 30 Mar 2008
Posts: 94

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 3:56 am Reply with quote
I agree wholeheartedly with Zac. Cake >>> Pie

What people here seem to forget is how many anime fans are kids who can't afford to spend vast amounts of money on DVDs. Sure some 14 year old can badger their parents to get them the latest One Piece DVD and they could possibly save up to buy some manga for themselves, but are they really going to be able to afford anything else? It takes a long time until you are finally in that glorious world of disposable income.
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ninjaclown



Joined: 17 Dec 2008
Posts: 194

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 3:57 am Reply with quote
That is something to think about, if convention attendance is so huge and everyone bought one dvd, would that help the industry? Can they finally afford to dub more shows?
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vtnwesley



Joined: 10 Jun 2007
Posts: 171
Location: Natrona Heights, PA

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 4:26 am Reply with quote
Excellent podcast. I dig it. I complained before a while back regarding a different segment that made me question the direction of ANN. This reassures me greatly. Fun stuff. Thanks.
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Past



Joined: 14 Feb 2006
Posts: 3126
Location: Olympia, WA

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 4:37 am Reply with quote
I haven't gotten around to listening to the podcast yet, but to think that the anime industry in North America was pretty much dominated by dubbed anime back in the day. I sometimes had to get retailers to go out of their way to see if a subtitled version was available (this was during the prime of the VHS days). How times have changed.
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pparker



Joined: 13 Oct 2007
Posts: 1185
Location: Florida

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 5:05 am Reply with quote
Great new feature. You both work very well together, but just, how about Bamboo as a recurring character every month or so? And no, I'm not one of the stalkers. Not quite old and strange enough... yet. And kudos to Stephanie, too. Excellent guest.

As to dubs and cast fatigue, it's true. I don't often prefer dubs even though I started in anime from DVDs and dubs. The fatigue factor is one of the reasons. It's not the movie business (or to a lesser degree Japanese voice acting), where hundreds of actors find work every year, and even though only 50 or so make "star" status, the range is wide enough and the pool from which new blood comes so large, that it's not an issue. When you seem to have 20 or 30 people that do ALL the shows, just rotating as leads, and even multiple characters, the voices do begin to sound repetitive, regardless of the actors' skills at assuming new personas and altering their voices.

I've lamented the lack of creativity and originality before in new anime, and one would hope this year is the bottom, though that's not likely. One factor is the Japanese otaku. Unless and until they evolve (and they seem exempt from evolution due to the 2ch inbreeding factor), they will command the market in Japan. Usually it's only when the tried and true formulas really, really, for sure don't work anymore that aging, ruling management throw up their hands and bet on "anything new" to survive. Just like most previous revolutions in entertainment, it will be a handful of crazy kids that get a chance because everyone in charge has run out of solutions.

Anyway, I really enjoyed both these podcasts. And please, I second the continued testicle references--no GD PC rules here!
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ikillchicken
Space CowboySpace Cowboy


Joined: 12 Feb 2007
Posts: 7015
Location: Vancouver

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 6:55 am Reply with quote
My reaction during the Avatar trailer was like: Huh? What's everyone complaining about. This looks pretty co...oh hell.

Regarding creativity in anime: I'll say the same thing I do about games. We need more creative anime and the best way to do it is just to produce them on super cheap budgets. I don't care how it looks. Yeah, nice animation is a plus but it's hardly a requisite. I'm so starved for anything original I don't even care. I'll happily buy something that looks like crap if it was just something new and interesting.

On the whole same voice actors thing: I don't especially like it but I sort of accept why it has to be this way. I totally would get sick of seeing the same actors over and over again even if I like them. It's just nice to have variety. The reality though is that this may just not be possible. There just isn't a big enough market to draw a whole bunch of talented people, only a handful.
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Otaku_X



Joined: 25 Nov 2008
Posts: 298

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 8:19 am Reply with quote
I hope they don't hate Otaku In-joke or moe shows, I love those. Although, as I love other stuff, I see their point, as I agree with their point that the lack of variety does get redundant.

And I agree. Screw pie. And not in the American Pie way.
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lordcalgar



Joined: 02 Apr 2007
Posts: 4
Location: Germany, NRW, Schwerte

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 8:54 am Reply with quote
One question, regarding original anime. What are your opinions on shows like, Bakemonogatari, Kaiba, Kemono no Souja Erin and Genji Monogatari Sennenki?

I am watching currently two of these shows, and have read several comments about the other two. So, what I would like to know, would these qualify as original anime, or come close to it, or what would be needed, that you would be able to call it original?
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pparker



Joined: 13 Oct 2007
Posts: 1185
Location: Florida

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 8:55 am Reply with quote
Otaku_X wrote:
I hope they don't hate Otaku In-joke or moe shows, I love those. Although, as I love other stuff, I see their point, as I agree with their point that the lack of variety does get redundant.

Oh, I'm a fan of otaku shows, don't get me wrong. I've been anxiously awaiting the widescreen versions of K-On! to complete so I can marathon it. My viewpoint is there's K-On!, Eden of the East maybe, and then what else? Where's this year's Casshern Sins (Kurozuka even), or Nodame Cantabile, or Lucky Star or Gurren Lagann, or Death Note or Code Geass, or Aria, or... lots more that I could list? Haruhi "Season 2" should have been a bright spot, but totally failed with the Endless Eight debacle (Aya Hirano has even apologized to fans now). FMA Brotherhood didn't grab me, and so much of it so far is remake that it's difficult to judge yet.

Although there is more Sayonara Zetsubou Sensei, so it's not a total loss. And Hayate no Gotoku, though I'm saving it for marathon, so don't know if it's still good.
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mglittlerobin



Joined: 28 Aug 2008
Posts: 752

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 9:00 am Reply with quote
Stephanie Sheh is my hero. She says all the things I wanna tell the anime fan dumbs, but can't articulate well enough. I'm proud of my small but special anime collection!
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Anime World Order



Joined: 05 May 2006
Posts: 354
Location: Florida

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 9:11 am Reply with quote
I have a VHS tape consisting of nothing but old commercials for cereal, toothpaste, Tang, cool-Aid, and the like. That Snagglepuss ad was one of the things on there. When he delivers that line at the end, he's staring directly into the camera as it zooms toward his face.

I gotta strongly disagree about Ocean Group doing good work. If you ask me, Ocean Group's English dubbing for anime has been consistently mediocre for the last like, two decades. When I think of that fake-as-hell sounding anime dub acting, Ocean Group is the absolute poster child for it. Their work on videogames and non-anime tends to be significantly better, but much like Bang Zoom if you see Ocean Group as the dubbing studio for an anime title then you may as well not even bother. In both cases, I don't think it's the actors so much as the direction they're given.

I've been totally huge on Sword of the Stranger for over a year now, but I never actually got to review it. As fate would have it, it was the latest review ON MY LIST of things recorded now that the Blu-Ray is out in the US. At the rate I'm going, I'll post that...next month...

lordcalgar wrote:
One question, regarding original anime. What are your opinions on shows like, Bakemonogatari, Kaiba, Kemono no Souja Erin and Genji Monogatari Sennenki?


Obviously this wasn't directed at me, but I'll chime in: I'm pretty big on Kaiba, but when it comes to that kind of stuff, Masaaki Yuasa / 4C is kind of going it alone. In my experience, people just say they want different stuff, but when you actually give it to them, they don't like it because "oh, that's TOO different." To demonstrate my point, here's a case in which I forced two people to watch Kemonozume and Kaiba. That's the reality of the situation on the ground: when innovative stuff like Kaiba or Planetes comes out and tanks horrendously, the studios are going to play it safe for years to come after the fact to recoup their cost. Planetes is the perfect example: after its spectacular failure, the staff of Planetes regrouped and did Code Geass, which while a good show is still meticulously crafted by committee to virtually guarantee commercial viability at every single level.


Last edited by Anime World Order on Fri Aug 21, 2009 9:18 am; edited 1 time in total
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pparker



Joined: 13 Oct 2007
Posts: 1185
Location: Florida

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 9:14 am Reply with quote
lordcalgar wrote:
One question, regarding original anime. What are your opinions on shows like, Bakemonogatari, Kaiba, Kemono no Souja Erin and Genji Monogatari Sennenki? ....what would be needed, that you would be able to call it original?

Maybe original isn't the right term, since there's little in terms of plot that hasn't been done. But creative, and original universe. I'm watching Aria right now, for instance. The sense of capturing place and culture and then creatively weaving that into an engaging story with interesting characters. It's not new, but it really is new. And that experience crosses all genre boundaries.

Much of such observations are subjective, I know. I watched a bit of Bakemonogatari, and it's interesting, but I didn't feel anything groundbreaking. It's one I will finish someday as I work through my backlog, but not a show that I just couldn't stop watching.

With Aria, I passed over it for some time and heard it was one of those "take in short doses" kind of shows. Now I'm almost done with season two and can't stop watching because it is so unique, the music is gorgeous and original, the art is beautiful and fitting, the characters so well done, and it's just so damn good at what it's doing, and what it's doing is extremely rare and risky to even attempt. That's I guess the experience I'm looking for.
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walw6pK4Alo



Joined: 12 Mar 2008
Posts: 7935

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 9:30 am Reply with quote
I do feel that the actual movie and OVA market is kinda dying, but at least TV anime is up and coming, looking beautiful on HDTV's. So maybe otaku would rather just pay their yearly bill for TV? But it's weird, because almost all of the movies coming out are pretty much recaps.

As for dubs, it's not that I hate them, I just don't ever find them as intense as the usual Japanese dub. Let's the normal Japanese dub is neutral, at 0, then I find most dubs to be in the negatives while a small few go positive, but that small few is so few and far between that you just tend to bunch the entire group together and overlook all of it. I'd love good dubs, but you can never tell until the show actually comes out. Justin is right about the dubs, some shows shouldn't have been dubbed, or even licensed. Stuff like Dragonaut will get dubbed, but it's a terrible show, so that's literally just money down the drain. It would have been preferable to just ignore it. For Geneon, they did make an huge mistake on tons of shows as well, ADV to some degree. You can't keep licensing everything when nearly nothing is going on TV.

The other problem is that people want DVD boxsets for way lower costs, like 26 episodes for less than $50, because that brings it somewhat close to American TV boxsets. Whether you like it or not, in the mindsets of buyers, being that much higher than a boxset of 24 does make an impact, because you don't think of all the work that goes in to the production and licensing of the anime when you're at Costco. And then you have a problem of a good deal of anime fans being shrewd nerds who know how to not waste money and how to adapt to new technology.

Like I keep saying, the biggest problem is that the exposure of anime isn't there on TV, the one main place it needs to be for the market to expand. Also, no one listens to Disney cartoons, because no one watches them or cares.

As for the Eureka Seven movie, it was decent but weird, but Fathom charges out the ass for those tickets.


Last edited by walw6pK4Alo on Fri Aug 21, 2009 9:59 am; edited 6 times in total
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