Forum - View topicThe List - 8 Alternative Couples Sure to Touch Your Heart
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Dessa
 Posts: 4438 |
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No, it's not, unless it's in supplemental stuff outside of the series itself. |
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Fencedude5609
 Posts: 5088 |
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I don't think you can deny Homura's love for Madoka and at the same time acknowledge Sayaka's for Kyousuke. Its a massive, insulting double standard. |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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Sorry, but there never was a canon Sayaka x Kyousuke, and there never was a canon Homura x Madoka. Just because one side of a pairing has an unrequited romantic love for the other does not mean the couple is official, or even a couple at all for that matter. |
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Fencedude5609
Posts: 5088 |
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Thats not really the point. Obviously Homura and Madoka weren't a "couple" in the 'together and dating' sort of way, but no one has any trouble understanding that Sayaka loves Kyousuke, but people will prevaricate about Homura's love for Madoka. |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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Well then, why did you quote roseversailles and their question about canonical couples if you weren't even talking about that?
Or were you trying to shift the goalposts on me? Dessa correctly said that based on the Anime, Homura x Madoka was not canon. Then you bumbled in exclaiming that there's a double standard at work when there is none. It is you that missed the point. |
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Momokochan
 Posts: 103 |
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I'm on Midterms why I'm I even checking this foruummm.
Gah, anyway. @MadoHomu It is canon in the sense that Homura has canonical romantic feelings for Madoka. It might be one sided yes, but canon in romantic connotation. Shipping and Canons have maany levels. Crack!Shipping: This "paring/romantic connotation" hasn't been implied in the show, at all. Nevertheless, Fans think they should be together because they are hot. Example: RoV - Fersen and Rosalie Never even on the same scene. Why? what? Someone just liked the characters and match them up, but they never were even implied by the author. Shipping: This "pairing/romantic connotation" only exist in the mind of the fans. Though it is supported with fanservice by the author, nothing is confirmed and only allusions are given. Never factual answers from the creators. Shipping wars begin at this point. Example: Bleach - Orihime & Ulquiorra. We were given many MANY allusions that Ulquiorra might had have a romantic interest for Orihime, but it is debatable. Therefore UlquiHime is just a Ship, because it depends on the fans whether to believe or not that he had or had not a romantic feeling for her. Canon: One or more Character has expressed his/her romantic affection for the other side of the Ship. This does not mean they end up together, just that the allusions of his/her attraction are being met official and it is confirmed his/her feelings are real by the author. A.K.A It's not a theory made-up by the fans any longer and has been confirmed. They have 50% chances of ending up together. Example: Utena - Juri x Shiori Juri admits her feelings for Shiori, though this does not make Shiori correspond. Juri's romantic feelings for Shiori are canon. Canon-Shipping: Both sides of the Ship accept their love for each other, both are requited. They can or cannot end up together. Some do, some die, some are star crossed lovers. Some have happy endings. --------- So in general, Homura's feelings for Madoka are canon, as she much expressed with passion in several episodes. Now, Madoka DID friendzone Homura, but given that the series has not ended yet, we have a chance of 50% for them to end up together in the after-after life? At least, for now Homura's feelings are canon, and therefor it's not a ship only, since it's not a theory made by the fans only. Her actions were romantic enough to call them heart-warming and they are mainstream enough to deserve to be on this list. Also, this list does contain many couples that are not confirmed but just alluded in one side. Let's say, We actually never actually see Yukito say "lol touya, ok let's be lovers" it was implied but never confirmed on Yukito's side. Then again we do know that Touya's feelings for Yukito were canon, he did professed his love for Yukito. Juri and Shiori, again, was one sided. And let's not beat the dead Horse of Shinji and Kaworu. Most of the romances on this list are one sided, actually...But, canon. Last edited by Momokochan on Wed Oct 31, 2012 2:33 am; edited 1 time in total |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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You can't say that just because 50% (i.e. half) of two people are interested in the other that means that there is a 50% chance that the two will end up together.
Maths doesn't work that way. |
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Momokochan
Posts: 103 |
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In anime, yes. More if such anime is one that explains entropy driven by volatile teenage girls emotions and magical extraterrestrial pets.
If this was an otome game we would divide by the quantity of bishonens tho. |
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Dessa
Posts: 4438 |
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You know, I'm not sure we watched the same series. Yes, Homura cared deeply for Madoka. She may have even considered it love.
She's also a pre-teen girl who has been through very serious trauma. She "loves" her as a very close and dear friend. I saw nothing to even imply it was deeper than a very deep platonic friendship. Not romance. Japan seems to have a different definition of "love" than the US does. It seems that in the US, you are only allowed to love your family, and the person you intend for your significant other. Whereas in Japan it's perfectly fine to care deeply and more than anything for another person, and it NOT be about the romance. |
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Shenl742
Posts: 1524 |
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I think the issue for me is that their seems to be very little self-identification or gay pride in anime or manga.
It's always either a person has a single-targeted love for one person or a "deep" friendship loaded with lots of subtext. Unfortunately the most "out" characters tend to be "raging queers" (Leeron from Gurrne Lagann, for example) who love to make lots of suggestive comments to members of the same sex or just grope everyone. It's played for comedy, but it often feels like a walking gay-panic joke. Maybe I haven't looked in the right places, but I don't think I've ever seen any characters actually "come out of the closet" or realize and identify the fact that they're gay and struggle with the issues (I believe Jason Thompson covered one that followed a lesbian couple, but I forgot the title). Blame it all on cultural differances I guess... |
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cl-shojo
Posts: 70 Location: New York |
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Shenyl742 wrote:
I would say that not only are most gay males in anime and manga 'raging' queers - they're outright crossdressers. It's bothersome that in Japanese culture homosexuality and crossdressing are completely intertwined as though they are the same thing - such as the term okama which is used interchangeably for both groups. And while it's common to see gay characters in anime and manga, we almost never see them in romantic relationships outside of yaoi/yuri - typically they have unrequited crushes or their love lives are never touched upon, and thus are destined to remain single (or they end up falling for someone of the opposite sex, realistic as that is  ). So I appreciate when (healthy, non-stereotypical) same-sex couples do show up in the media, and thus that's why I feel the word 'heartwarming' at the top of the article is appropriate. Also, there are plenty of non-homosexual couples given for those dismissing this article as a 'lame attempt at being LGBT.'
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Kelly
Posts: 868 Location: New York City |
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[quote="cl-shojo"]Shenyl742 wrote:
Sometimes, but then you have series like Hetalia, where that isn't always the case. In spite of fanfiction and a few teasers, there are only actually four characters who I'd actually confirm as gay as of what's been committed to anime so far - Sweden, Greece, Northern Italy (who I'd actually call bi considering his enthusiastic flirting with girls) and arguably spoiler[Germany - who came close to pretty much admitting to himself that he's in love with Northern Italy at the end of Season 4 and might be a reincarnation of Northern Italy's boyfriend Holy Roman Empire considering their resemblance]. Out of the four, I certainly wouldn't call Sweden or spoiler[Germany] effeminate. Actually, the most realistic portrayal of a gay couple in a healthy relationship I've seen in anime so far is probably the episode of Shigofumi: Letters from the Departed guest starring the female athelete trying to overcome emotional damage regarding her relationship with her mother. She has an awesome, extremely supportive girlfriend who helps bolster her up to reach her potential. |
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Shenl742
Posts: 1524 |
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[quote="Kelly"]
Well, when I meant "out" I meant "showing some kind of pride in their sexuality, and having actual sexual identity". The types I mentioned though also seemed to me to unfortunately also exhibit a lot of out-dated "queer stereotypes" simultaneously. In my eyes the two things kind of cancel eachother out. But I've never really had any interest in Hetalia so I really can't comment on that, that. It doesn't really sounds like it has what I'm looking for either, from what you've just described...Especially when you say that said character came close to admitted his feelings to another...the fact that he actually didn't or wasn't able to sounds pretty disappointing to me.
THIS however does actually interest me. Do the characters ever identify themselves as gay? Is this portrayed as an actual lesbian relationship? Rather than a kind of ambigous, subtext-filled "romantic school girl friendship"? |
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Kelly
Posts: 868 Location: New York City |
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The manner of their kisses leaves no room for ambiguity as to their relationship. I don't remember at the moment if the word "girlfriend" is ever used, but I got the impression that they would neither wear banners nor deny the relationship were they asked. What's interesting is that their orientation is treated as just a part of who they are rather than defining it. The guest star is a potentially world-class athelete with mother issues first and a lesbian second. |
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