Forum - View topicNEWS: Japanese Industry Launches Global Anti-Piracy Effort
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pparker Posts: 1185 Location: Florida |
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Haven't caught up with the thread yet, but meantime... http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/ This isn't difficult to imagine when you count all the Pokemon, DBZ, etc, merchandise sold to kids. But notice that most of the photos of shelves in Shelf Life show at least a few figures, posters, etc. Each of those figures often cost more than a complete anime series at today's thinpak prices, sometimes much more. And those pics are from ANN readers, a heavily skewed DVD-buying demographic. So even here it's possible that merchandise purchases equal or exceed DVD.
I've mentioned this before. Apparently, these companies did not going into merchandising, which was a mistake. ADV would still be here if they had done that. I find it interesting that TRSI was able to finance content licensing (Nozomi) via retailing DVDs plus merchandise--sort of "backing into" the business. I doubt we'll hear of them closing up shop because of a drastic drop in DVD sales either. Last edited by pparker on Tue Oct 27, 2009 9:29 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Top Gun Posts: 1622 |
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Remember, you have to include franchises like Naruto, Pokemon, and Yu-Gi-Oh! when considering something like this. Those are by far the most popular anime properties in the US (though you might split hairs with Pokemon, since the games were the original medium), and it isn't hard to imagine that merchandise sales for them utterly dwarf their respective DVD sales. I'm sure DVDs outsell merchandise domestically for any number of niche series, since many of those don't have domestic merchandise to begin with, but they can't make up for the juggernauts in the room. Edit: I'm used to being sniped, but not this quickly.  |
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| pparker Posts: 1185 Location: Florida |
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Hee... those milliseconds. Naruto is a good example I didn't even think about, and I suppose Bleach as well for the slightly older, more DVD demographic. I also wondered about conventions, since I don't attend them--if the majority of purchases there are merchandise? Because of potential rarity and the fact that DVDs are a commodity that don't need to be seen physically before purchase? |
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| Top Gun Posts: 1622 |
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| I don't have any statistics, but I'm sure that's the case. Like you said, everyone knows what they're getting with a DVD, and you can get it at any time, so unless some dealer is having a ridiculous sale, you're probably not going to put out money for them as opposed to plushies/wallscrolls/figures you might not see anywhere else. | ||||||
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| Kaioshin_Sama Posts: 561 |
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| When you consider that all of these companies have a strong foothold outside of Japan and are pretty much the ones leading the charge to globalize the release of anime I can see why they would want to take extra steps in order to protect their interests. | ||||||
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writerpatrick Posts: 410 Location: Canada |
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| If they can crack down on the RAWs getting out, then it's going to automatically affect the fansubs. Even if fansubbers were limited to just DVD releases, it would do a lot to stem the problem. Fansubbers can't fansub if they don't have the RAWs.
Fortunately, there's now online streaming, even if it's just mostly US only. But at least there's something legal starting up. Hopefully, we'll see more services appearing. This really has been about the first year for such services. Unfortunately, if you don't live in the US you're very limited. Even Canada can't get Viz's site, although we can get Crunchyroll. (ANN seems to be mostly just linking to the other sites.) Torrents are far from dead, but they have been dealt a blow with the lawsuits against some of the major sites. Yet I haven't seen any real drop in torrents. It's mostly the music producers (with some movie producers), not the TV show producers, that have been going after torrents. |
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jr0904 Posts: 1284 Location: New York City,New York,USA |
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No kidding. If they want to start,thay should start with US based video sites like veoh,myspace and especially youtube cause unfortunately despite their efforts,there's a lot of DVD ripped and leaked anime on those sites especially of one piece which was been stated by nebstv as one of the most downloaded series ever,espeically it's dub version and i'm afraid that naruto shippuden's dub is gonna surpass it later in the future cause of the 4kids type edits disney x.d will give it. and it may be too late. some sites i know already have 8 epsiodes streaming on their sites already and despites sunrise efforts,somehow users are finding way to bypass them and stream their series on veoh. It's like what Yorozuya said. it's about time that their doing something about it but it may be too little too late and they should be focusing more on the US than over there. |
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mglittlerobin Posts: 703 |
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Oh no, then they would be seen as "sellouts" by working the anime companies. How does one live without fansubs? I do it, and I'm watching plenty of legal streaming anime, borrowing from my library and watching stuff I would never watch without legal streaming, heck, Funimation's uploading "Spice and Wolf" subbed on their video portal so why should I go search for a fansub? Sure, not EVERY SINGLE ANIME in the world isn't offered legally, but I don't have the right to see every anime, which is the feeling I get from younger people. They feel they must see EVERYTHING the very second it's done airi9ng in Japan, and half of them download with no intention of buying any of it, and then they show up at cons bragging about how much of a "fan" they are, when all they do is watch and don't buy. And this is due to fansubbing. The only way for Toei to keep all their anime off YouTube is to sign up for the Content ID that would automatically block One Piece and Dragon Ball episodes from being uploaded, and even if they tried to dispute it, the dispute would fail. And a boatload of fansubs would automatically be gone from YouTube. |
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| Top Gun Posts: 1622 |
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But what about the more mature of us who do buy DVDs and who don't want to see EVERY SINGLE ANIME EVER, yet still want to watch the odd show or two that isn't licensed or being streamed, or that we don't currently have the money to buy? I don't have any problems with Japanese production companies cracking down harder on piracy efforts, since they're completely within their rights to do so, but at the same time, that isn't going to stop me from acquiring certain titles. I support the industry as best as I'm able to at the present time, and I hope to continue to support it to an even greater extent in the future. |
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| mglittlerobin Posts: 703 |
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If it's an obscure show that would NEVER EVER be licensed, I understand the need for fansubs, but a lot of the fansub groups like to sub shows that will OBVIOUSLY get licensed in the States. They always choose shows that would sell well because they are popular in the Japan, they will be popular in the States because they have a wide appeal, I.E. Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood, which is being simulcast on Funimation's site. |
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Zin5ki Posts: 3440 Location: London, UK |
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This description is befitting of many of us. Under the proposals, I would assume that even the 'supportive' types would be forced to adhere to legalities at all times, in spite of any positive financial effects their fansub usage may bring. If all means of previewing a series without making monetary contribution are to be 'stamped out', I am cautiously intrigued by what is meant in the article by the additional goal of promoting legal distribution. Whether this implies better DVD deals to regions in which piracy is rife, or the ever-problematic approach of legal streaming, some sort of trade-off will be required for the supportive fansub users to continue contributing to the industry to extent they currently do. |
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| pparker Posts: 1185 Location: Florida |
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This is the rub. Distributors too often just want to turn back time using force, without serving the new market. The music industry is the best analog, being the first to progess to a stability in digital distribution. Piracy of music wasn't eliminated, but the new digital distribution model satisfies the consumer demand of the many innately ethical people, enough that they do contribute their 99 cents for getting music the way they wanted it. Note also that as soon as the new financial model was proven, the RIAA reversed their methodology of legal attacks on consumers and then essentially folded. Once video producers are willing and able to distribute their content the way people want it at the right value point, then the issue will be dead. Fansub success, at their level of quality, proves what people want. It's the value in exchange that's missing. The problem of viability is the same for anime as for music. Can the industry afford to offer its product at prices acceptable to the average consumer? They sell DVDs in Japan at $30+ per episode. Here, most surveys indicate a per-episode maximum of about $2.00 for digital download. Producers have to first be willing to offer full quality downloads to own, and then figure out how to make that work financially. |
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LordRedhand Posts: 1472 Location: Middle of Nowhere, Indiana |
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I'd say stop supporting fansub being the easiest way in addition to supporting any effort that the industry tries to bring anime to you (including streaming and DTO.) Reminds me of something I sent to you Zin5ki, a story if you will. One person asks another concerned "How can I stop others from distributing my work against my wishes.?" The other responds, "Well you contact them and tell them what your goals are with that work and why your doing it and they stop." Too bad the actors in that scene can't heed their words, as an industry tried that once, I think hand bitten off, one offered, desperately seeking a peace that is being constantly rejected, they the fansubbers try to undermine any offer. The world the fansubbers seek is a contradiction and one if you know the above exchange is one they don't want, yet they enable it at strive for it anyways. We've been deluding ourselves with this image of the industry and of the fans and fansubber and need to wake up, we can be better than what we are know, we're just too lazy to actually put in the effort to work for it. As that's all I hear, excuses as to why one hasn't acted yet to actually bring their dreams into fruition, all these little things that we distract ourselves with, so anime fans it's time to wake up and see the walls crumbling around you but there may still be time. |
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| Zin5ki Posts: 3440 Location: London, UK |
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I suppose I ought to apologise for not responding to that message you sent me. (I was considering deliberating over logical positivism with you, but technical discourse takes up a lot of free time.) You seem to imply here, if I read you correctly, that it is the fans who can improve the industry. Through continued investment in their fandom this would certainly the case, but sooner or later a given devotee could come across an intriguing title unavailable for purchase, or else could deplete all potentially interesting releases in their region. Egotistic fansubbers certainly pose a problem when it comes to those who're wooed by their offerings, but an industrial focus needs also be kept on maintaining paying fans' interest in their region's licensed releases. Companies are certainly doing this, perhaps indeed as a modus operandi, though room for improvement on their part is evident here and there. |
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egoist Pirate King Posts: 7278 |
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So they do have some good translators, huh. I sure wish they could have used one of those "good translators" to do Skip Beat!, because the subs were really crappy. Which left me wondering, with so many apparent mistakes, why didn't they just fix them already? I'm sure CR wouldn't have much trouble fixing it.
That's a little drastic. I don't think foreign market affects anime to that extent. At this point, and with the depression we're currently going through, there's just no way anime fans can do as much as you expect them to. But well, I'm glad there are sites like CR around, they could pretty much replace my need for fansubs, which is actually good. Though, all this crap about licensing an anime in just a country sounds like bullcrap to me. Maybe they should start considering licensing anime worldwide instead, I mean, how many titles have I wanted to buy that are licensed in the US but not over here, in the UK. |
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