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Last edited by hikaru004 on Sat Nov 28, 2009 12:09 am; edited 3 times in total

kokuryu wrote:

Sheesh, over half the DVDs I bought last year were from Gonzo - don't know why they are not doing good. I am definitely looking forward to the new season of Strike Witches. I hope CR is able to pick up the 2nd season as well.

Because they do not sell consistently to the target Japanese population (within the last 2 years).

another forum wrote:

Getsumento Heiki Miina *1,220 (5) (Gonzo)
2007/04/06 *1,374 Vol. 1 (Two episodes)
2007/05/02 *1,176 Vol. 2 (Three episodes)
2007/06/06 *1,320 Vol. 3 (Two TV episodes and one unaired episode)
2007/07/04 *1,131 Vol. 4 (Three episodes)
2007/08/01 *1,098 Vol. 5 (One TV episode and one unaired episode)

Blassreiter ***948 (12) (Gonzo)
2008/08/08 *1,278 Vol. 1 (Two episodes up to current volume)
2008/09/21 ***828 Vol. 2
2008/10/21 *1,129 Vol. 3
2008/11/21 ***904 Vol. 4
2008/12/05 **,*** Vol. 5
2009/01/21 **,*** Vol. 6
2009/02/21 **,*** Vol. 7
2009/03/21 **,*** Vol. 8
2009/04/21 **,*** Vol. 9
2009/05/21 **,*** Vol. 10
2009/06/21 ***601 Vol. 11
2009/07/21 **,*** Vol. 12

Druaga no Tou ~the Aegis of URUK~ *1,781 (6) (Gonzo)
2008/06/27 *3,773 Daiichi no Miya (Two episodes up to Dairoku no Miya)
2008/07/25 *1,479 Daini no Miya
2008/08/22 *1,230 Daisan no Miya
2008/09/26 **,*** Daiyon no Miya
2008/10/24 *1,184 Daigo no Miya
2008/11/28 *1,237 Dairoku no Miya

Druaga no Tou ~the Sword of URUK~ ***811 (6) (Gonzo)
2009/03/27 **,*** Daiichi no Miya Limited Edition (Two episodes up to Dai-roku no Miya)
2009/04/24 **,*** Daini no Miya Limited Edition
2009/05/22 ***811 Daisan no Miya Limited Edition
2009/06/26 **,*** Daiyon no Miya Limited Edition
2009/07/24 **,*** Daigo no Miya Limited Edition
2009/08/28 **,*** Dairoku no Miya Limited Edition

Strike Witches 13,789 (6) (Gonzo)
2008/09/26 14,863 Vol. 1 Limited Edition (Two episodes up to Vol. 6)
2008/10/24 14,133 Vol. 2 Limited Edition
2008/11/28 13,665 Vol. 3 Limited Edition
2008/12/26 13,731 Vol. 4 Limited Edition
2009/01/30 13,134 Vol. 5 Limited Edition
2009/02/27 13,207 Vol. 6 Limited Edition

Saki *8,114 (5+) (Gonzo, Picture Magic)
2009/07/15 *6,996 Vol. 1 Limited Edition (Two episodes up to Vol. 2)
2009/08/19 *9,310 Vol. 2 Limited Edition
2009/09/02 *8,330 Vol. 3 (Three episodes up to Vol. 9)
2009/10/07 *8,764 Vol. 4
2009/11/04 *7,166 Vol. 5

Shangri-La was prob such a poor seller that the last 6 vol. were canceled for a boxset.

The only franchises that GONZO can be prod of selling wise is Saki and Strike Witches.

vashfanatic wrote:

You don't have Gankutsuou, Last Exile, or Yukikaze on that list, ergo we cannot have a real conversation about the awesomeness GONZO has produced. Wink

I can't speak for Last Exile or Yukikaze, but Gakutsuou's strength was entirely in its source material. Every tweak Gonzo made to the story was a steaming pile of epic fail strongly resembling the studio's worst works: Setting the story in outer space and adding giant robots (totally leaving off the significant role of Napoleon and background detail in general in the process), making major characters out of minor characters and badly fudging their characterizations in that process, eliminating significant and interesting subplots entirely (Maximilian & Valentine) and replacing them with cheaply contrived low-grade melodrama, making characters have sudden changes of heart on several occasions that glaringly contradict the attitude and spirit of the original work...

I honestly believe the only way you can say Gankutsuou was a great series is if you've never read the novel and can't distinguish between what was created by Dumas and what was changed by Gonzo.

Seeing AIC taking GONZO's place as Strike Witches S2's animator isn't too surprising given the many times the two studios have collaborated on titles, such as Seto no Hanayome, Pumpkin Scissors, Special A, and Solty Rei (and they were planning to work on the now-halted Alive anime this year). It's clear that both have a good working relationship with one another, so it makes sense that GONZO (still a producer on the project) would put the show into their hands.

All that said, I would like to say that maybe the show will be more substantive and less mediocre (and fanservice-laden), but most of its original staff is returning...

On a separate note, for all of the ridiculous GONZO hate out there, it's good to see some people actually stand up for them. It seems many forget just how many good shows they've put out, the chances they've taken, and the impact they've made. Not every single title of their's has flied with me, but I do have a number of favorites from them and can recognize the titles that have been a success for them (even if I thought otherwise). If there is one thing I do appreciate about the studio, it is that opinions about their works can vary across the spectrum for different people (i.e. Fan A make like one show but not another, while Fan B may have a completely opposite view of them).

GrilledEelHamatsu wrote:

It wouldn't just be stupid for Funimation/Navarre to buy GDH it would be totally unethical and asinine.

Unethical? How?

GrilledEelHamatsu wrote:

As for this news, in my opinion it's both good news and BAD news. The good news is that since AIC is handling season 2, that might make it easier for Funimation's rivals Section23/ADV and MB to consider snatching up Strike Witches 2 before Funimation can even make a move.

That would be nearly impossible as Strike Witches was licensed at the point where FUNi very likely has a contractual option on season 2 regardless.

GrilledEelHamatsu wrote:

The bad news is that it's GDH shooting themselves in the foot and if this continues then they may indeed have to sell thier older licenses over to thier previous R1 distributors.

This makes absolutely no sense. Almost all Gonzo titles that are worth something in R1 are currently owned by a company in R1. There is nothing to sell.

hikaru004 wrote:

The only franchises that GONZO can be prod of selling wise is Saki and Strike Witches.

You are forgetting Rosario to Vampire which did well enough to get a S2 if Saki counts since Saki was only animated by Gonzo. (Well, most of it, as picture magic took over primary production 1/2 way through.)

> *7,456 Rosario to Vampire vol.1

vashfanatic wrote:

You don't have Gankutsuou, Last Exile, or Yukikaze on that list, ergo we cannot have a real conversation about the awesomeness GONZO has produced. Wink

Forgot they did Yukikaze, so that definately goes on the list. Haven't seen Gankutsuou or Last Exile yet, but certainly plan to.

bayoab wrote:

.

hikaru004 wrote:

The only franchises that GONZO can be prod of selling wise is Saki and Strike Witches.

You are forgetting Rosario to Vampire which did well enough to get a S2 if Saki counts since Saki was only animated by Gonzo. (Well, most of it, as picture magic took over primary production 1/2 way through.)

> *7,456 Rosario to Vampire vol.1

True. 3 titles...

another forum wrote:

Rosario to Vampire *5,034 (6) (Gonzo)
2008/04/25 *7,444 Vol. 1 (Three episodes)
2008/05/30 *5,456 Vol. 2 (Two episodes up to Vol. 6)
2008/06/27 *5,126 Vol. 3
2008/07/25 *3,907 Vol. 4
2008/08/29 *3,817 Vol. 5
2008/09/26 *4,455 Vol. 6

Rosario to Vampire CAPU2 *3,300 (6) (Gonzo)
2008/12/21 Vol. 1 *2,704 (Three episodes)
2009/01/30 *3,719 Vol. 2 (Two episoses up to Vol. 6)
2009/02/27 *3,589 Vol. 3
2009/03/27 *3,213 Vol. 4
2009/04/24 *2,974 Vol. 5
2009/05/22 *3,603 Vol. 6

[sarcasm]Oh, yeah that's an impressive track record. Only 3 sellers in 2 years of animation and mostly fanservice titles. [/sarcasm]

hmm..just wondering hikaru004, how did witchblade and afro samurai do for gonzo

hikaru004 wrote:

[sarcasm]Oh, yeah that's an impressive track record. Only 3 sellers in 2 years of animation and mostly fanservice titles. [/sarcasm]

Given that most studios (including AIC) do no better, I don't quite see your point.

Gonzo's problems weren't just about sales per se. Had they gone with the typical business model, they'd be much better off today even with poor DVD sales.

animeboy12 wrote:

hmm..just wondering hikaru004, how did witchblade and afro samurai do for gonzo

another forum wrote:

Witchblade *2,580 (8) (Gonzo/FUNimation)
2006/07/26 *3,538 Vol. 1 (Three episodes up to Vol. 8)
2006/08/23 *2,985 Vol. 2
2006/09/27 *2,845 Vol. 3
2006/10/25 *1,764 Vol. 4
2006/11/22 *2,341 Vol. 5
2006/12/20 **,*** Vol. 6
2007/01/24 *2,263 Vol. 7
2007/02/28 *2,325 Vol. 8

Not the best of numbers either.

Sorry, I couldn't find any data on Afro Samurai. Not having a heading on cdjapan may be a clue to popularity in Japan.

TJR wrote:

Given that most studios (including AIC) do no better, I don't quite see your point.

Gonzo's problems weren't just about sales per se. Had they gone with the typical business model, they'd be much better off today even with poor DVD sales.

This isn't about AIC. It's about GONZO. Might haves don't work. They went bankrupt. They don't have a good sales track record with their own population.

RtV and their other recent second seasons don't do as well. Why bother trusting them with a second season of Strike Witches when you see the writing on the wall already?

hikaru004 wrote:

This isn't about AIC. It's about GONZO. Might haves don't work. They went bankrupt. They don't have a good sales track record with their own population.

.....which is obviously a moot point if other large studios don't have a good sales track record with their own population either. There're plenty of reasons that Gonzo floundered, but blindly throwing Japanese sales figures into the mix is a gross oversimplification and an incorrect assessment. In the scheme of things, the numbers meant jack.

With recent smashes like Strike Witches and Saki, there's also proof that the company can produce a hit fine with the right intellectual properties and the right focus from external sponsors.

Case wrote:

vashfanatic wrote:

You don't have Gankutsuou, Last Exile, or Yukikaze on that list, ergo we cannot have a real conversation about the awesomeness GONZO has produced. Wink

I can't speak for Last Exile or Yukikaze, but Gakutsuou's strength was entirely in its source material. Every tweak Gonzo made to the story was a steaming pile of epic fail strongly resembling the studio's worst works: Setting the story in outer space and adding giant robots (totally leaving off the significant role of Napoleon and background detail in general in the process), making major characters out of minor characters and badly fudging their characterizations in that process, eliminating significant and interesting subplots entirely (Maximilian & Valentine) and replacing them with cheaply contrived low-grade melodrama, making characters have sudden changes of heart on several occasions that glaringly contradict the attitude and spirit of the original work...

I honestly believe the only way you can say Gankutsuou was a great series is if you've never read the novel and can't distinguish between what was created by Dumas and what was changed by Gonzo.

First of all - hey, a fellow fan from Iowa CIty! Recently moved from there, I was attending college.

To answer your question, I've read both the novel and seen the anime.

And I much, much prefer the anime. For example, the "significant and interesting" subplot of Maximilien and Valentine was quite possibly the most boring romance ever created, and sidelining it was a smart move. Not to mention transforming Eugenie from a horrible Victorian-era lesbian stereotype into a strong female heroine. Or just the whole storytelling style of telling everything before hand; the reveal on Haydee's past in the anime was vastly more dramatic than in the book. The sci-fi setting allowed them to ditch the Napoleanic history that you need to know to understand the novel in favor of making up their own so that you don't need the footnotes that accompany just about every edition of Dumas' work. The "giant robots" are in all of one episode, and I scoffed at them at first until I realized the heart-rending plot-twist they enabled.

Besides, Gankutsuou isn't a true adaptation of The Count of Monte Cristo so much as a re-imagining into a surrealistic sci-fi setting. If you can't see past your fixation on the book, then my dear, that's your loss, because it is one of the greatest anime ever made.

Otaku_X wrote:

Forgot they did Yukikaze, so that definately goes on the list. Haven't seen Gankutsuou or Last Exile yet, but certainly plan to.

Yayz, another Yukikaze fan! I was certain that someone would be bashing on that, not on Gankutsuou. Just goes to show there are some people out there who miss the forest for the trees. You can change something a lot from its source material (especially when its source is a dated 19th century orientalist novel) and still have it be brilliant.

vashfanatic wrote:

First of all - hey, a fellow fan from Iowa CIty! Recently moved from there, I was attending college.

To answer your question, I've read both the novel and seen the anime.

And I much, much prefer the anime. For example, the "significant and interesting" subplot of Maximilien and Valentine was quite possibly the most boring romance ever created, and sidelining it was a smart move. Not to mention transforming Eugenie from a horrible Victorian-era lesbian stereotype into a strong female heroine. Or just the whole storytelling style of telling everything before hand; the reveal on Haydee's past in the anime was vastly more dramatic than in the book. The sci-fi setting allowed them to ditch the Napoleanic history that you need to know to understand the novel in favor of making up their own so that you don't need the footnotes that accompany just about every edition of Dumas' work. The "giant robots" are in all of one episode, and I scoffed at them at first until I realized the heart-rending plot-twist they enabled.

Besides, Gankutsuou isn't a true adaptation of The Count of Monte Cristo so much as a re-imagining into a surrealistic sci-fi setting. If you can't see past your fixation on the book, then my dear, that's your loss, because it is one of the greatest anime ever made.

Yeah, I have no idea what Gankutsuou he watched, such a fantastic show.

Since it was mentioned I've got to add that as I've said before Last Exile remains one of my all-time favorites. Smile

I too really enjoyed Yukikaze, it's ashame that many people only give flashy fast-paced works a chance when both can be good.

[Edit: Trimmed the quote a bit. Try to quote relevant parts only when the quoted text gets so large it takes an entire screen height to display. - Keonyn]

vashfanatic wrote:

Besides, Gankutsuou isn't a true adaptation of The Count of Monte Cristo so much as a re-imagining into a surrealistic sci-fi setting. If you can't see past your fixation on the book, then my dear, that's your loss, because it is one of the greatest anime ever made.

Well, can you really fault him for not liking that? When you think about it, when the US adapts manga and anime properties people are up in arms over it, particularly around here. Gankutsuou was loaded with anime friendly cliches and storytelling style, the same way US adaptations are adapted to a style friendly to those audiences. It's really the same thing.

It wasn't that Gankutsuou was so different from Dumas' masterpiece that bothered me, but I just didn't feel the changes worked in the stories favor and the applauded art style felt cheap and lazy to me, not to mention distracting. Honestly, I far and away prefer the masterpiece of a novel to the pandering of the anime. Honestly, I wonder which version you read, you do realize that abridged copies of the book are far more common than unabridged right? Of course, the anime would work better for audiences that prefer that medium to classic literature; to each their own.

No problem, my bad on quoting the whole thing.

Keonyn wrote:

and the applauded art style felt cheap and lazy to me, not to mention distracting.

Yeah, it's such a unique style that I can certainly understand not everyone liking it but personally I thought it a perfect fit for the style of costumes required for the characters and wonderfully fit the setting. While they could be a bit distracting, especially since it's pretty unique the way they did it and eye-catching, I think that it was very fitting for the clothing to be a little like that and a little distracting with the patterns and animating them nicely with all the extra detail that they did I thought was kind of the opposite of cheap but there's nothing wrong with not liking them either. Actually I'm surprised given how relatively unique it was that it was less divisive than it could have been.

Cloud668 wrote:

Tyrenol wrote:

And last I heard, Gonzo's working on Seitokai no Ichizon (which SUCKS despite the fanservice).

No, that's Deen. Gonzo was only credited for assistance for an episode with a Strike Witches parody. And yes, I agree that the show sucks.

not to me. i liked it a lot when i saw the first epsiode. if there's one series i hope to get licensed soon is this one along with kodomo no jikan.

also i'm preety sure nothing drastic will happen with the switch over to AIC. alongs that the fanservice that made the first one a otaku fav since the 1st season of nanoha remains in the 2nd season then it's no big deal.

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