×
  • remind me tomorrow
  • remind me next week
  • never remind me
Subscribe to the ANN Newsletter • Wake up every Sunday to a curated list of ANN's most interesting posts of the week. read more

Forum - View topic
Shelf Life - Dragon Age


Goto page Previous    Next

Note: this is the discussion thread for this article

Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Bored_Ming



Joined: 17 Jun 2009
Posts: 242
Location: The Edge of ......
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 5:58 am Reply with quote
Next ANNCast features Sheriff Zac....in a cave....singing Trogdor. I'll mail you a check for $100 bucks if you use a Gabby Hayes delivery.

Thanks for the columns Erin. I've enjoyed each one. A different point of view is always appreciated.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
Ashen Phoenix



Joined: 21 Jun 2006
Posts: 2904
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 10:14 am Reply with quote
Quote:
"Trogdor was a man!
I mean, he was a dragon man.
Or maybe he was just a dragon.
But he was still Trogdor!"

Oh, Erin. You've no idea how happy it made me to read this. Anime hyper

I like dragons, too. imho they seriously need to have more creative portrayals than simply "mech," "cutsie mascot," "vicious End Boss," or "treasure hoarder."
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
erinfinnegan
ANN Columnist


Joined: 31 Jan 2005
Posts: 598
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 1:10 pm Reply with quote
Quark wrote:
Some of us girls were unfortunate enough to have to start wearing a bra in elementary school. It's a rarity, it's embarassing, but believe me, it happens.

I know. I think it's the hormones in milk! Er... that's a conspiracy theory, anyway. There are always training bras, and one would think Japan may have plenty of AAAA cups or whatever. The scene was played for laughs - had it been written by an actual girl, maybe it could have captured the bizarre poignancy of purchasing a first bra, or really, any bra at all.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
pparker



Joined: 13 Oct 2007
Posts: 1185
Location: Florida
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 1:12 pm Reply with quote
Just cause I'm a dictionary fag...
Josh7289 wrote:
Splitter wrote:
Review: an appraisal or evaluation
Criticism: disapproval expressed by pointing out faults or shortcomings

You got the review part right, in that a review is an evaluation of a work intended to tell the reader if they should invest their time/money into the work, but you got the criticism part wrong.

Some time ago, I started substituting "critique" wherever I would have used "criticism", for the very reason that the meaning has drifted in common usage. As in, this:

"Usage Note: Critique has been used as a verb meaning 'to review or discuss critically' since the 18th century, but lately this usage has gained much wider currency, in part because the verb criticize, once neutral between praise and censure, is now mainly used in a negative sense. But this use of critique is still regarded by many as pretentious jargon, although resistance appears to be weakening [as of 1997]."

The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/critique

The problem comes from criticism having the second, distinct definition you referred to: "the act of passing severe judgment; censure; faultfinding." The majority of people now hear criticism and incorrectly but not illogically assume the negative slant in an act of analysis that is defined as entirely neutral. Not surprising since most "critics", as reviewers, do write negatively more than positively about entertainment--for good reason Wink. It's the wrong definition being used in his(?) statement, but an easy mistake.

And then there is the difference between criticizing a work, such as the review in this case, and criticizing the reviewer. Criticizing the work is valid--reviewing the review, but criticizing the reviewer (as in, for having certain personal viewpoints and attitudes) is just silly and pointless.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime
erinfinnegan
ANN Columnist


Joined: 31 Jan 2005
Posts: 598
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 1:16 pm Reply with quote
Fronzel wrote:
As someone who had seen the whole thing, I can say the first episode is one of the weakest and least substantial episodes in series that’s hardly heavyweight. It isn’t representative of the whole.


CareyGrant wrote:
If milk has gone bad, I'm not gonna drink the whole carton to confirm that fact. One taste is enough.

I really like the spoiled milk line, I'm gonna use that someday.

Ironically, because I hated Popotan, I knew I'd have to watch the whole thing (plus it was only 12 episodes) so I could build an informed case against it. It's like... I haven't read or watched Twilight, so I'm not going to go arguing against it without being able to back up my claims.

Popotan does make a shift - the first few episodes are 80% romping sexy jokes/boobs, and 20% attempted poignant plot/emotion. Eventually the series flops, until the ratio is reversed in the 2nd to last episode. (The last episode is more like 90% boobs.) But if you hate the first episode, it's not really worth it to hang around for more of the same.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
erinfinnegan
ANN Columnist


Joined: 31 Jan 2005
Posts: 598
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 1:27 pm Reply with quote
Splitter wrote:
Because no one else is going to make this clear to you, I will. This little disclaimer does not excuse you from our own criticism.

Zac wrote:
Right, but you seem to be the only person who really interpreted that opening statement to mean "you guys can't disagree with or criticize my opinion." I mean, I certainly didn't get that...
I'm glad Zac responded, because you really interpreted my intro to mean something I didn't intend. I was writing the intro in response to previous forum debates, not as some kind of disclaimer for what I was about to write.

Splitter wrote:
If you think anyone here is going to stop because you ask, you're only showing us how weak you are. You either step on toes or you dance around them, but you can't do both. If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen. Honestly, I expected better of Bamboo's successor.

I'd just like to say that I can take some heat on the internet. I've been writing in BBS's for about 18 years now, before some of the people around here were even born.

Your mention of showing weakness sounds like... being around wild animals? Don't make eye contact!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
GrilledEelHamatsu



Joined: 02 Sep 2009
Posts: 703
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 1:44 pm Reply with quote
erinfinnegan wrote:

I'd just like to say that I can take some heat on the internet. I've been writing in BBS's for about 18 years now, before some of the people around here were even born.



I'm almost 27 BTW. Have been an otaku for about 8 years and have been reading BBS's for over 10. All I'm saying is that I just wish you weren't so black and white about lolicon. You don't have to like it, you can at least respect it.

I would advise you about the next volume of Dragonaut, because you haven't seen anything yet. It's about to get ugly. VERY UGLY.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
GrilledEelHamatsu



Joined: 02 Sep 2009
Posts: 703
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 1:53 pm Reply with quote
erinfinnegan wrote:

Ironically, because I hated Popotan, I knew I'd have to watch the whole thing (plus it was only 12 episodes) so I could build an informed case against it. It's like... I haven't read or watched Twilight, so I'm not going to go arguing against it without being able to back up my claims.

Popotan does make a shift - the first few episodes are 80% romping sexy jokes/boobs, and 20% attempted poignant plot/emotion. Eventually the series flops, until the ratio is reversed in the 2nd to last episode. (The last episode is more like 90% boobs.) But if you hate the first episode, it's not really worth it to hang around for more of the same.


I kinda of find it ironic that you find a mediocre ecchi loli series to be worse then Dragonaut.

I guess that's because you haven't seen the other half of the series. Dragonaut is pure garbage.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
ArthurFrDent



Joined: 05 Aug 2008
Posts: 466
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 2:31 pm Reply with quote
"I guess that's because you haven't seen the other half of the series. Dragonaut is pure garbage." - GrilledEelHamatsu

hmmm, sounds like a denial from someone who has a guilty interest in dragonauts... Twisted Evil
wait, wait, don't bite me! gotta be careful with teasing...

heh, you're doing well Erin... it's kinda astonishing at how wrapped around the axle people get Wink
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Yorozuya



Joined: 11 Mar 2009
Posts: 332
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 2:36 pm Reply with quote
GrilledEelHamatsu wrote:
erinfinnegan wrote:

I'd just like to say that I can take some heat on the internet. I've been writing in BBS's for about 18 years now, before some of the people around here were even born.



I'm almost 27 BTW. Have been an otaku for about 8 years and have been reading BBS's for over 10. All I'm saying is that I just wish you weren't so black and white about lolicon. You don't have to like it, you can at least respect it.

I would advise you about the next volume of Dragonaut, because you haven't seen anything yet. It's about to get ugly. VERY UGLY.


I'm not going to mention the L word again but I don't think its likely that someone who finds that sort of thing is 'morally repugnant' is going to be able to have any respect for it Razz

Just my two pence.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
GrilledEelHamatsu



Joined: 02 Sep 2009
Posts: 703
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 2:53 pm Reply with quote
ArthurFrDent wrote:
"I guess that's because you haven't seen the other half of the series. Dragonaut is pure garbage." - GrilledEelHamatsu

hmmm, sounds like a denial from someone who has a guilty interest in dragonauts... Twisted Evil
wait, wait, don't bite me! gotta be careful with teasing...

heh, you're doing well Erin... it's kinda astonishing at how wrapped around the axle people get Wink


Trust me, I've already watched 24 episodes, I don't want to watch anymore.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
erinfinnegan
ANN Columnist


Joined: 31 Jan 2005
Posts: 598
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 3:11 pm Reply with quote
GrilledEelHamatsu wrote:
I would advise you about the next volume of Dragonaut, because you haven't seen anything yet. It's about to get ugly. VERY UGLY.


GrilledEelHamatsu wrote:
I guess that's because you haven't seen the other half of the series. Dragonaut is pure garbage.

I mostly review what they send me. If I am sent the second half of Dragonaut when it comes out I'll be forced to watch it.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Hardgear





PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 3:55 pm Reply with quote
erinfinnegan wrote:
Hardgear wrote:
That being said, I find it funny how a lot of reviewers mention that a show has "no social, educational, or societal value".

Eek, a lot of people are taking this the wrong way. I was trying to reference a Supreme Court ruling on obscenity, specifically to the Roth Test, which came out of a cased called A Book Named "John Cleland's Memoirs of a Woman of Pleasure" v. Attorney General of Com. of Mass.:
383 U.S. 413 (1966) wrote:
it must be established that (a) the dominant theme of the material taken as a whole appeals to a prurient interest in sex; (b) the material is patently offensive because it affronts contemporary community standards relating to the description or representation of sexual matters; and (c) the material is utterly without redeeming social value. ...
You can read more about it on PBS's website. I had started off writing a much longer piece with more Supreme Court references, but it was getting really ridiculous and I cut most of it out of the final column.

I'm a big proponent of television as art. I have a B.F.A. in Film and Television, and I'd like to the think the F for Fine Arts in there means something.

That said I don't necessarily want everything I watch to be educational or "deep." My husband, on the other hand, will never watch a "popcorn movie" or anything that requires you to "shut your brain off" and have a good time. He always freaks out about that. I'm more open to watching something that's "shallow" entertainment.

I think a lot of anime, for example, Dragonball, has redeeming artistic value. It may be "stupid fun" sometimes, but not every episode is without some value - including social value.

If you were talking about the Bleach movie "Memoirs of Nobody," It didn't entertain me. It failed to hold my attention because the protagonist was a movie-only character and it had no impact on series continuity.


Oh! that makes sense now, thank you. I just see that come up so often in reviews (not on this site usually) that I failed to even consider that.

As for the movie I was actually referring to Diamond Dust Rebellion and it's recent review here on ANN. I personally think it's flaws were blown out of proportion. But then again, I am a guy who can give a movie/series/whatever F's in every possible category and still highly recommend it to everyone (once again using the Super Mario Bros movie as an example... )
Back to top
ArthurFrDent



Joined: 05 Aug 2008
Posts: 466
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 4:33 pm Reply with quote
"Trust me, I've already watched 24 episodes, I don't want to watch anymore." - GrilledEelHamatsu

I'm still waiting to find the ep with Machina jumping rope... 'because I think I'd remember something like that. :devil:
heh, I know I'm in the minority of people amused by it... there are some intriguing elements, and I'm just easy that way. I've stopped recommending things, because I think my taste is just too offbeat for most people.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
LiuXuande



Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 201
Location: Chicago
PostPosted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 6:04 pm Reply with quote
erinfinnegan wrote:
Your mention of showing weakness sounds like... being around wild animals? Don't make eye contact!


I lol'd.

I agree with Zac on the whole debate thing, each side believes that justice will prevail and the others will see the light, but neither will back down from their position or actually change things outside of an internet debate.

Which brings me to my point...even though I disagreed with some of the talkback and reviews, I'll continue to read your column just because the way you write is fresh and amusing, even though it indirectly trolls people of a certain fanbase or whatever...that actually makes it even more amusing.

Quote:
Ai, Mai, and Mii live in a big house with a huge Japanese bathtub ofuro thingy, so you're guaranteed at least one naked bathing scene per episode.


Laughing

And this is coming from a Key/KyoAni fan who doesn't care about loli or any other fandom. Who watches at least one harem anime a season. lol.

Anyway, I think that it would be most civil if people treat this talkbalk as:

"oh, you didn't like Popotan? I rather enjoyed it and didn't think it was 'morally repugnant' "

"I can't believe you like (whatever that show about Trains was)! lol"

"Too bad you didn't like Dragonball, it's a classic!"

Of course, with the appropriate level of sass in line with your tone Wink However, being the internet, this isn't going to happen. But eventually these are the kinds of responses people had to Bamboo's reviews (not so cookie cutter, of course) and I think the level of RAGE mainly stems from the fact that people can't take a stab at themselves that is implied from the more pointed tone of your writing, and that you're a newbie in 'these here parts' (though not so much anymore, people are still treating it as that) Anime hyper

But I do agree with this week's reviews. The Dragonball manga is much stronger than the anime, but I would personally own Dragonball just because it reminds me of what a 'good' anime adaptation of the franchise should be like, as opposed to Dragonball Z. Hopefully Kai gets released here to change my mind...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous    Next
Page 9 of 11

 


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group