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Eroge/Hentai/Lolicon/Shotacon linked to paraphilia.


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Ggultra2764
Collector ExtraordinaireCollector Extraordinaire


Joined: 21 Jan 2004
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Location: New York state.

PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 8:22 am Reply with quote
This might be a touchy subject for some to delve into. But I wanted to get a sense of what people may think of this matter. Over the past year or so, subjects like the Equality Now campaign to ban fetishes in eroge/ hentai titles and the Christopher Handley case have been hot-button topics regarding the legality of any content of the sort in Western countries. In such cases, I've heard of some on the end to ban such material claim that those liking the violent fetishes of eroge and hentai, lolicon and shotacon to be considered mentally ill and increasingly developing paraphilia as a result of said interests. So this brings up a question I'm curious to get some answers on: does seeking enjoyment out of violent eroge/hentai fetishes, lolicon and shotacon make one develop paraphilia from reading or watching it?
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The Dreaming Void



Joined: 14 Dec 2009
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Location: Amsterdam, The Netherlands

PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 9:10 am Reply with quote
i would say; If you were already had paraphilia. Because mental disorders (or things related), don't come that easily from things you know are fake. IMHO, i would have to say that it is bs
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DavidShallcross



Joined: 19 Feb 2008
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 10:57 am Reply with quote
A proper double-blind controlled human experiment would probably be unethical. I suspect there might be mild effects. After playing the Ai Yori Aoshi game, I had the urge to learn to ice-skate.
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Sophisticat



Joined: 29 Oct 2008
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:13 am Reply with quote
Ggultra2764 wrote:
Does seeking enjoyment out of violent eroge/hentai fetishes, lolicon and shotacon make one develop paraphilia from reading or watching it?


Well, yeah, if you come to like it. As the poster above says, if you like the ice skating segments enough to want to skate on ice, then the material had an influence on you.

But to classify it as a mental illness? That's a bit far. People are quite conscious of their choices, so this is just an attempt to heavily censure something EN doesn't like. I'm all for banning the loli/shota stuff, though.
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abunai
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:24 am Reply with quote
I'd like to point out that "paraphilia" (the new term for sexual deviation from the putative norm) does not completely equate to "perversion" (the old, and somewhat condemnatory, expression), and it certainly does not not equate to "sexually criminal behaviour". Be extremely careful not to conflate the concepts, or you'll have a devil of a time untangling them.

- abunai
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LordRedhand



Joined: 04 Feb 2009
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Location: Middle of Nowhere, Indiana

PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:24 am Reply with quote
Well I'd just say that the song Poison was the Cure by Megadaeath can sum things up nicely as to my opinion on this particular topic.

For those who don't know it's a song about using a weaker addictive drug to cure drug addiction (or in the case of smokers the same addictive drug to stop another habit.) While in some case it's okay, for most it ends up being addicted to the other drug which is, at least counter-productive and at worst more harmful than the initial problem.

The same can be applied here in the case of images as using them to "replace" the addiction or rush of feelings from actually dong it may at first seem desirable, if taken to far can lead to another addiction. Which we don't want either. We need people to take interest in solving the problems of our world instead of spiraling into themselves.
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12skippy21



Joined: 25 Nov 2008
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Location: Derby, England

PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 12:32 pm Reply with quote
LordRedhand wrote:
Well I'd just say that the song Poison was the Cure by Megadeath can sum things up nicely as to my opinion on this particular topic.


Good comparison, awesome song by the way. Humans can become addicted to anything given to much exposure, this ranges from drugs and depressants to any form of media. Some people are more susceptible than others in this regard, an scientific example being that a newborn will have a craving for heroin or one of its reliance drugs if the mother took them during pregancy.

In this case, an over-reliance on such material is likely due to the individual experiencing social constraints or problems in real life and this individual will 'break-out' these manifestations in different ways. I got into anime during my first year of university because of a combination of too much free time but also an unwillingness to go out and get drunk with others, so I explored various facets of the internet instead.

In conclusion, the answer is yes and no depending on the person's personality and the social background he has. However as abunai said, being into questionable paraphilia does not equate to crime. This is where the campaigns come in which use no evidence and at times false logic to dictate that humans have no self-control and therefore all questionable material should be banned.
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RHachicho



Joined: 07 Oct 2009
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 12:54 pm Reply with quote
Personally my philosophy is "whatever floats your boat as long as you don't hurt anyone along the way" People have been trying to explain such things for a looong time. But the fact is Pedophiles and other sexual deviants have been turning up since the medieval ages. The recent increase is probably more due to the fact that most people no longer believe in god or hell so they feel that as long as they don't get caught there is no consequence to their actions. If someone develops a fetish like this I would much rather they excised it by using pervy hentai rather than going out and trying to act on it.

Human's have a natural compulsion to do things they are forbidden to do call it "Red Button Syndrome" if you will sometimes as I see it this gets out of control and results in things like sexual deviancy. Actually about the best thing to do i reckon is to try to educate children not to be so hung up on their sexuality. Labeling anything as forbidden will attract people to it in the silence of their minds.

As for Paraphiles .. I understand this term as people who have kinky sexual tastes. As far as I am concerned THAT is none of their god damn business. Like I said you don't hurt anyone (unless they want that ofc) and what people do in their private moments are no concern of any government or authority.
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dewlwieldthedarpachief



Joined: 04 Jan 2007
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Location: Canada

PostPosted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 8:33 am Reply with quote
I really wonder about the legitimacy of these claims. What's more likely? The media is seriously concerned with public health and wants to draw attention to real science being done to manage a problem, or the instant ramen of controversy that is sexual deviancy is being milked, once again, for its creamy gossip goodness?
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LaFreccia



Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 324

PostPosted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 10:54 am Reply with quote
RHachicho wrote:
the fact is Pedophiles and other sexual deviants have been turning up since the medieval ages. The recent increase is probably more due to the fact that most people no longer believe in god or hell so they feel that as long as they don't get caught there is no consequence to their actions.

I don't know of any evidence that "sexual deviancy" has increased recently relative to the size of the population. Therefore it seems premature to ascribe a cause.

In many places it was common practice in the past to sell (or "arrange the marriage") of extremely young girls. Such practices are often associated with organized religion. In fact, many modern cases of pederasty have involved religious leaders such as priests.
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RHachicho



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PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 2:10 am Reply with quote
Yeah you might be right about that. However the one thing I am definately certain of is that up or down it's always been there. And the increase is not as monumental as some would claim if it is even present at all. There are always people who try and ascribe societies problems onto some third party. A wartime enemy, an ethnic group, a new form of entertainment. And try and hold society up to some standard as if it was their right to set it. I have always thaught stuff like that smelled of moral cowardice.
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Past



Joined: 14 Feb 2006
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Location: Olympia, WA

PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 4:08 am Reply with quote
RHachicho wrote:
The recent increase is probably more due to the fact that most people no longer believe in god or hell so they feel that as long as they don't get caught there is no consequence to their actions. If someone develops a fetish like this I would much rather they excised it by using pervy hentai rather than going out and trying to act on it.

This is a rather touchy subject in itself. Studies have actually shown that more atheistic societies have lower accounts of criminal behavior, ranging from both petty, minimal offenses to violent and more serious crimes. So there are 2 brands of reasoning for compelling one to be a moral, law abiding citizen: 1) The one in which a notion of an afterlife and a god to manage peoples behavior when no one is looking, or 2) one in which no kind of forgiveness exists except for secular punishment and any opportunities to redeem or remediate yourself.

I am completely of the latter (2nd one)
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RHachicho



Joined: 07 Oct 2009
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 4:42 am Reply with quote
Perhaps, I would be rather interested in reading those studies you talk about. The feeling that religion has something to do with it stems from my own personal bias admittedly it just seems as though society has become so materialistic. Since there seems to be an almost palpable phobia or even stigma against those who have any beliefs that go beyond accepted science. Such people are seen as cooky at best and insane at worst. This has resulted in a shift to a purely materialistic view of the universe. Which I can't help but feel has released people of a lot of the guilt that both repressed our better and worse natures. I am not advocating religion by any means. It was just as bad in different ways.

Just in case you are wondering about my own viewpoint I'm an agnostic.
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abunai
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Joined: 05 Mar 2004
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 4:58 am Reply with quote
The idea that only religious feelings can engender morality is a theistic, not an agnostic viewpoint, Rhachicho. I don't think your "agnosticism" is more than skin deep, if you truly believe that.

In the God-haunted USA, I am given to understand that this is, in fact, a common argument used by theists against atheists: that a lack of belief in God will inevitably lead to a depraved and immoral nature. Nonsense, but many seem to believe it.

- abunai
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dewlwieldthedarpachief



Joined: 04 Jan 2007
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Location: Canada

PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 10:12 pm Reply with quote
Oh Divine Command Theory, you have an entire wikipedia page with responses...that for some reason doesn't include Euthyphro's dilemma, i.e. is the pious loved by the gods because it is pious or is it pious because it is loved by the gods. In other words, is it some God's whim that dictates moral behavior or is that ideal independent of the God? Neither option is comforting for the theist.
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