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ANNCast - Now Macias, Now You Don't


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Frazmataz



Joined: 30 May 2010
Posts: 103
Location: Sheffield, UK
PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 11:58 am Reply with quote
DmonHiro wrote:
What? I thought that eulogy WAS the joke that episode. You mean the Heat Guy J references are really dead?


Hasn't been mentioned since the eulogy. Besides, it was clear that the joke was reaching the end of its tenure when Zac started adding it at a PS to the podcast itself. Laughing
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Mike Toole
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Joined: 09 Jan 2002
Posts: 105
Location: THE GOOD OLE U-S-A
PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 12:23 pm Reply with quote
jesus v for vendetta guy, can you ever talk about something without it turning into a 1,000 word textwall?

_V_ wrote:
"Hey, Toole's review in the print magazine was quite negative, but Luster's review on the official website was quite positive; how do you juggle assigning reviews, dividing it up, etc"


I have to take exception to this, because I don't buy into the whole "if it's not 100% positive, it's SCATHING!!!" mindset that is probably the fault of Rotten Tomatoes. My review was not particularly negative at all-- I think the film wasn't bad, but IMO it did fail to achieve it's raison d'etre as stated by Anno himself; he's said that he hopes to use Rebuild to retell Evangelion's story in a more coherent way for new fans, but from where I'm standing an awful lot of the first Rebuild film is more about lip service for current fans. If you applied Rottentomatoes' scoring rules, my take on the film would probably be high 60s-low 70s.

Quote:
...however, that was just the introduction; the second film drastically changes the plot to the point that its...sort of like when Gundam has alternate continuities, its not a "remake" anymore.


None of the alternate timeline Gundam shows really qualify as remakes, per se. Wing and SEED are both guilty of reusing themes and character types present in Tomino's original, but they're not altogether that similar to the original. By contrast, Rebuild part 1 is similar enough to the original material that I felt compelled to compare it to Van Sant's PSYCHO remake. It looks better, it's an odd treat for existing fans, but it doesn't work its new twists into the story until late in the film, and these changes are not presented in a way that will be the least bit obvious to new viewers. Consequently the only people I know who are truly excited by the Rebuild films are people who've seen the entire franchise already.

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Even that other fansite that doesn't like my fansite,


ahahaha sectarian bickering among Evangelion fansites. It really is just like the Sailor Moon website days!

As for why that dude you hate wrote the article for the magazine-- it's probably (don't know for sure myself) simply because McCoy makes himself visible and available. He has a history of working with Patrick, so Patrick is going to ask him first; kinda like how the go-to guy for writing about Gundam is Mark Simmons, it's a good idea to consult Walter Amos if you need info on LOGH, etc.

If you want to become a recognized authority on the subject, you're going to have to throw your name into the ring.
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VIPPER.



Joined: 10 May 2008
Posts: 10
Location: 2channel
PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 5:01 pm Reply with quote
Messenger of the Sea is an 8-minute-long (IIRC) animation by Non-chan. He's a self-taught animator who's done some gif animations and has some stuff on youtube. He's a greengrocer by day.
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_V_



Joined: 13 Apr 2009
Posts: 619
PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 5:38 pm Reply with quote
Mike Toole wrote:
jesus v for vendetta guy, can you ever talk about something without it turning into a 1,000 word textwall?


Non-Evangelion things, yeah.

Quote:
_V_ wrote:
"Hey, Toole's review in the print magazine was quite negative, but Luster's review on the official website was quite positive; how do you juggle assigning reviews, dividing it up, etc"


I have to take exception to this, because I don't buy into the whole "if it's not 100% positive, it's SCATHING!!!" mindset that is probably the fault of Rotten Tomatoes. My review was not particularly negative at all-- I think the film wasn't bad, but IMO it did fail to achieve it's raison d'etre as stated by Anno himself; he's said that he hopes to use Rebuild to retell Evangelion's story in a more coherent way for new fans, but from where I'm standing an awful lot of the first Rebuild film is more about lip service for current fans. If you applied Rottentomatoes' scoring rules, my take on the film would probably be high 60s-low 70s.


Oh no no no, you misunderstand Mr. Toole. I didn't think your review was "insulting and baseless" or something; just that it was your opinion and I disagree with it. I didn't think it was outright "scathing" because it wasn't whole hog for Rebuild. Please don't get that idea, sorry if I was short before.

What I *am* baffled at is how in an online feature for Otaku USA, you compared Rebuild to Death & Rebirth; even though you concluded that they're not quite the same...even making the comparison would lead people to associate Rebuild with "clip show" -- ***there isn't a single frame of re-used footage from the original series in it. Did they "faithfully/slavishly re-animate certain storyboards?" yes. But that was from the ground up, not a re-use.

Its just that I think John on AnimeNation.net expressed the same criticism in a better way: he said he thought it was too faithful of a remake, YET he could understand what Anno was shooting for...its just that as a returning fan who watched the series a lot, he was too familiar with it to enjoy it.

Either way, I do not think your review was outright "scathing", it was "a point on which reasonable men may defer", but....I had a scant 140 words in my Twitter question to say "Toole's review was negative"...I didn't really have a full paragraph to nuance that description Smile

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Quote:
...however, that was just the introduction; the second film drastically changes the plot to the point that its...sort of like when Gundam has alternate continuities, its not a "remake" anymore.


None of the alternate timeline Gundam shows really qualify as remakes, per se. Wing and SEED are both guilty of reusing themes and character types present in Tomino's original, but they're not altogether that similar to the original. By contrast, Rebuild part 1 is similar enough to the original material that I felt compelled to compare it to Van Sant's PSYCHO remake. It looks better, it's an odd treat for existing fans, but it doesn't work its new twists into the story until late in the film, and these changes are not presented in a way that will be the least bit obvious to new viewers.


I agree....though, we've sort of been comparing it to the twist ending of Turn-A Gundam....


Quote:
Consequently the only people I know who are truly excited by the Rebuild films are people who've seen the entire franchise already.


Possibly, because not enough attempt has been made to promote the show amongst new fans: "Eva fandom peaked 10 years ago"....though I must agree with your earlier comments on ANNcast, that *nothing* is ever going to match the effect Eva had in 1996, where *literally every anime fan in existence* watched it because there were so few new shows coming out. I agreed with everything you said.

But its been so long, and these days at cons when they ask panel rooms "who here has seen Eva?" maybe half raise their hands.

Its been 14 years, there's a whole new generation of 14 year olds to watch it.

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Quote:
Even that other fansite that doesn't like my fansite,


ahahaha sectarian bickering among Evangelion fansites. It really is just like the Sailor Moon website days!


The Truce of Teh Internets will be shattered. This isn't some messageboard flaming, this isn't same-old bickering over subs vs dubs. It's the Old Days! The Bad Days! The all-or-nothing days. They're *back*. Rolling Eyes

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IwIlEu7o9ZM&featuret#t=0m43s

Quote:
As for why that dude you hate wrote the article for the magazine-- it's probably (don't know for sure myself) simply because McCoy makes himself visible and available. He has a history of working with Patrick, so Patrick is going to ask him first; kinda like how the go-to guy for writing about Gundam is Mark Simmons, it's a good idea to consult Walter Amos if you need info on LOGH, etc.

If you want to become a recognized authority on the subject, you're going to have to throw your name into the ring.


Welcome to the ReVolution.

Wink
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Charred Knight



Joined: 29 Sep 2008
Posts: 3085
PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 6:55 pm Reply with quote
The boat set sail on being the expert on Evangelion. Keep in mind that Mark Simmons didn't just show up in 2005 and got hailed as the expert on Gundam, he was the first guy to have information in english on the various gundam series. The only real information english speaking fans had of say G Gundam was the blurb on Mark Simmons website.

Just check out the bio I mean Justin started ANN in 1998, Zac joined in 1999, I don't even know how old Anime jump is but Mike has been writing for a very long time. A lot of it is right place at the right time, for example a video review series of anime really wouldn't make that much noise because Desu Des Brigade has already claimed it. The main people of the Abridge fandom are people who did it right after Yu-gi-oh The Abridge series came out.

Now obviously that doesn't mean the role of experts is only reserved for people in their 30's-40's, Hope/JesuOtaku isn't even out of colledge but it's not enough that you have a website on one of the most popular anime of all times, you need to carve your own niche.
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_V_



Joined: 13 Apr 2009
Posts: 619
PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 8:11 pm Reply with quote
I do run Eva panels at national conventions.

Look, there's a long way to go...but in 2007 I was nothing more than some random guy who literally watched the series off Adult Swim, never bought anime DVDs but just watched what was on TV, had never been to a convention.

At least I'm trying to *do* something, when anime seems stuck in a rut.

I refuse to believe that the people who, often by chance, *happened to be around 10 years ago* are somehow the unquestioned "experts"...what, we all just stopped asking questions? When was that crucial point when we could have changed something?

We're preserving the status quo, treating Sean McCoy as an "expert" out of...habit? The guy's a babbling crazy person. Have you *heard* some of the nonsense this guy says?
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Charred Knight



Joined: 29 Sep 2008
Posts: 3085
PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 8:16 pm Reply with quote
_V_ wrote:
I do run Eva panels at national conventions.

Look, there's a long way to go...but in 2007 I was nothing more than some random guy who literally watched the series off Adult Swim, never bought anime DVDs but just watched what was on TV, had never been to a convention.

At least I'm trying to *do* something, when anime seems stuck in a rut.


Just so you understand that it is going to take hard work, and years of dedication. Like I said if this was 1998 or 1999 then ambition like yours would have made you the expert on Evangelion.

As for not questioning experts, if I think someone is wrong I will tell them that I think their wrong, but I am not going to start calling them petty insults. I mean what's that going to accomplish other than getting me banned?
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_V_



Joined: 13 Apr 2009
Posts: 619
PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 8:55 pm Reply with quote
McCoy is such a crazy person he deserves no respect, to even do so would only in some small way acknowledge a status as "an expert"

In reality, he's no different than if a fan at a con panel wandered up to the microphone and none of the staffers thought to physically remove him.

But Sean is a special case.

Oh, we're in this for the duration.
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Charred Knight



Joined: 29 Sep 2008
Posts: 3085
PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 9:28 pm Reply with quote
What did Sean Mccoy do to make you this riled up? I mean I haven't seen someone this angry since the first Anncast where I raged for 4 pages.
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Paploo



Joined: 21 Nov 2006
Posts: 1875
PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 9:35 pm Reply with quote
I hope people are buying Otaku USA- it's pretty low-priced at the moment and full of all kinds of anime goodness that's fun to look back on. Very rereadable, and the bimonthly schedule makes for an easy committment.
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Tanteikingdomkey



Joined: 03 Sep 2008
Posts: 2345
PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 11:13 pm Reply with quote
I love the sherlock inspired opening
as a subber I have to say I am very happy the moe bubble has finally burst. *looks at the anime my group is probably going to be doing assuming the 20% chance that it gets licensed does not happen animenewsnetwork.com/news/2009-12-10/bushiroad-confirms-tantei-opera-milky-holmes-anime
we are only doing it because we love mysteries...mystery anime.... it could be good....I want to work on shrine tantei, but funimation will probably simulcast it..... don't break the rules of subbing, don't break the rules of subbing.

Frazmataz wrote:
DmonHiro wrote:
What? I thought that eulogy WAS the joke that episode. You mean the Heat Guy J references are really dead?


Hasn't been mentioned since the eulogy. Besides, it was clear that the joke was reaching the end of its tenure when Zac started adding it at a PS to the podcast itself. Laughing

I agree with you though the eulogy was hillarous
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penguintruth



Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Posts: 8458
Location: Penguinopolis
PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 11:38 pm Reply with quote
Charred Knight wrote:
What did Sean Mccoy do to make you this riled up? I mean I haven't seen someone this angry since the first Anncast where I raged for 4 pages.


Was that when Zac said he had little interest in Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood?
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Mike Toole
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Joined: 09 Jan 2002
Posts: 105
Location: THE GOOD OLE U-S-A
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:05 am Reply with quote
_V_ wrote:

What I *am* baffled at is how in an online feature for Otaku USA, you compared Rebuild to Death & Rebirth;


Again, it's how one might reasonably compare Hitchcock and Van Sant's PSYCHO, or for a somewhat more similar example, Billy Bob Thornton's SLING BLADE to the featurette SOME PEOPLE CALL IT A SLING BLADE that he'd made earlier. The first Rebuild film may be entirely new footage, but it does in some ways seek to achieve similar things to Death and Rebirth - to retell a portion of the story in digest form. The article came about because Joe Luster, who handles editorial duties on OUSA's website, was asking for some articles to tie into the magazine's Rebuild of Evangelion coverage. I pitched, he accepted, and boy, did I have a hell of a time digging up a DVD of Death and Rebirth to re-watch!

Quote:
I agree....though, we've sort of been comparing it to the twist ending of Turn-A Gundam....


If you ask me, that twist ending is Tomino baffling us with bullshit again. I love it (really can't wait to watch Turn A on DVD, I'd initially watched it on unsubbed LD waaay back in 01 or 02), but I don't take it seriously.

Quote:
Its been 14 years, there's a whole new generation of 14 year olds to watch it.


Well, good luck getting those 14 year olds to stop watching Bleach long enough to sit through the Rebuild films. What is interesting is that the movies are runaway success stories in Japanese theatres, but don't generate the same enthusiasm in the west. I'm not suggesting that they really have the potential to become hits like they are in Japan, but rather that I'm mystified by their popularity there. The TV series was widely discussed in its time, but it's not like it was beating Initial D in the ratings.

Quote:
Welcome to the ReVolution.

:wink:


no no dude, I mean your REAL name

_V_ wrote:

We're preserving the status quo, treating Sean McCoy as an "expert" out of...habit? The guy's a babbling crazy person. Have you *heard* some of the nonsense this guy says?


Yeah, you posted some links. These links lead to usenet posts from ten years ago. What were YOU up to ten years ago, v for vendetta guy? I can certainly find some embarrassing bullshit from two years ago!
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penguintruth



Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Posts: 8458
Location: Penguinopolis
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:09 am Reply with quote
Uh, what exactly is the "twist" in the end of Turn A Gundam? If you mean spoiler[Dark History], they revealed that way before the end, and it's probably not to be taken literally. It's a culmination of Gundam up until that point.
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KanjiiZ



Joined: 28 Jun 2009
Posts: 661
Location: Central Coast
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2010 12:19 am Reply with quote
It seems as if the name "Patrick Macias" has become associated with Daryl Surat for some reason since everyone was simply ripping off AWO jokes.

Awesome show. I have been having some complaints with Otaku USA lately though. The fact that they're slowly starting to cut out content and completely removed the posters has really made me question if I want to buy the magazine. The content is still pretty bitchin' but when I compare the early issues to the issues of today, I can't help but feel disappointed.
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