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NEWS: Roger Ebert Reviews Steamboy


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abunai
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 4:15 pm Reply with quote
I'm sure that, given his limitations, this is the best he can do. Let's not expect a leopard to change his spots, eh?

- abunai
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Tempest
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 4:18 pm Reply with quote
Are you talking about Roger Ebert or Katsuhiro Otomo ?

-t
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Proman



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PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 4:21 pm Reply with quote
abunai wrote:
I'm sure that, given his limitations, this is the best he can do. Let's not expect a leopard to change his spots, eh?

- abunai

What are you talking about?
By the way, let's not forget the version he saw was cut by 20 minutes. Two stars out of four is not that bad. He has given "Gladiator" and "Troy" two stars in the past and I enjoyed both of those movies.
In the end, it's just one critic's opinion (that doesen't mean it should be ignored). It is also worth mentioning, that as of this moment "Steamboy" has a 64% Fresh rating on Rotten Tomatoes:
http://www.rottentomatoes.com/​m/​steamboy/​
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OTP



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PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 4:25 pm Reply with quote
Yikes, that's not the best review. It doesn't really bother me since I never agree with Ebert's judgement anyway, but the note at the end sort of confused me. Why is the subbed version longer than the dubbed one?
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v1cious



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PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 4:38 pm Reply with quote
wow, that's an interesting review of "Steambiy"
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abunai
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 4:42 pm Reply with quote
tempest wrote:
Are you talking about Roger Ebert or Katsuhiro Otomo ?


I was talking about Ebert, but come to think of it, it applies to both. Smile

Proman wrote:
By the way, let's not forget the version he saw was cut by 20 minutes. Two stars out of four is not that bad. He has given "Gladiator" and "Troy" two stars in the past and I enjoyed both of those movies.

Well, good for you. Personally, I consider both of those films (to varying degrees) to be waste of time and money - but different strokes for different folks.

In my book, Ebert is a mainstream American reviewer. If he likes a film, it is likely to be a film that appeals to the general American public. Since I am neither "general public" nor American, I feel safe in ignoring his opinions.

- abunai
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LordByronius
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 5:18 pm Reply with quote
abunai wrote:

In my book, Ebert is a mainstream American reviewer. If he likes a film, it is likely to be a film that appeals to the general American public. Since I am neither "general public" nor American, I feel safe in ignoring his opinions.

- abunai


Uh, no. You obviously don't read the guy's stuff. He gave last year's Sundance winner, "Primer," a glowing review, and if any American audience outside of maybe 100 goes to see that movie and much less LIKES IT, I will eat my shoe.

However, compare his review to J. Hoberman's from the Village Voice. Ignore his usage of the word "Japanimation," please. He gives the film high marks, and quite honestly you couldn't ask for a tougher critic. And as somebody brought up, Steamboy's doing okay on the Tomatometer. Typically, if it's anime and doesn't have Miyazaki's name anywhere, critics hate it. Even GITS2 did very poorly there.

THE MORAL OF THE STORY:

The only critics who write reviews in the "General Public American" mindset which you mentioned so snidely, are the so-called "Press Junkies" that write snappy quotes that the studios feed them to put on commercials for crappy family comedies. Ebert is highly respected and isn't a Press Junkie, and is my homie. Don't diss on homies. Word.
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abunai
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 6:25 pm Reply with quote
LordByronius wrote:
Uh, no. You obviously don't read the guy's stuff.

Wrong. Oh, I'll grant you that my general consumption of critics' opinions (Ebert's and others) is lower than most, since I don't generally regard their opinions highly. But you'd be wrong to assume ignorance.

LordByronius wrote:
He gave last year's Sundance winner, "Primer," a glowing review, and if any American audience outside of maybe 100 goes to see that movie and much less LIKES IT, I will eat my shoe.

I'm sure you're right, but I fail to see how one exception disproves a postulated trend.

LordByronius wrote:
THE MORAL OF THE STORY:

The only critics who write reviews in the "General Public American" mindset which you mentioned so snidely, are the so-called "Press Junkies" that write snappy quotes that the studios feed them to put on commercials for crappy family comedies. Ebert is highly respected and isn't a Press Junkie, and is my homie. Don't diss on homies. Word.

I'll "diss" (*snicker* You silly person, what were you thinking? "Ebert's my homie", forsooth) on anybody I see fit, and if you want to consider it snide, be my guest.

- abunai
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LordByronius
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 6:43 pm Reply with quote
abunai wrote:

LordByronius wrote:
He gave last year's Sundance winner, "Primer," a glowing review, and if any American audience outside of maybe 100 goes to see that movie and much less LIKES IT, I will eat my shoe.

I'm sure you're right, but I fail to see how one exception disproves a postulated trend.


Again you are wrong! That is but one example in a sea that includes thousands. Will any "General Public American" audience warm up to the NC-17 Documentary "Inside Deep Throat"? What about Gaspar Noe's gut-wrenching film "Irreversible"? Or the "humanizing Hitler" German film "Downfall"?

Then there's his recent bad reviews for hits like "The Ring Two," "The Pacifier," "Be Cool," "Diary of a Mad Black Woman," "Napoleon Dynamite," et cetera.

You don't have to listen to critics; noone does. They never have, except in rare circumstances. But you seem to be discounting their usefulness entirely. I think that's a tad wrong.

Annnnd I'm still not seeing any credible evidence that you AREN'T totally ignorant on the subject. Except that you told me you weren't. FORSOOTH HOWEVER SHOULD I REQUIRE MORE SUBSTANTIATED CLAIMS GOOD SIRRAH.
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biliano



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PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 6:50 pm Reply with quote
Heh, I don't care what Roger Ebert said. I enjoyed the movie, and that's all that matters to me. Wink
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cubs2084



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PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 7:26 pm Reply with quote
LordByronius wrote:
And as somebody brought up, Steamboy's doing okay on the Tomatometer. Typically, if it's anime and doesn't have Miyazaki's name anywhere, critics hate it. Even GITS2 did very poorly there.


GitS 2, while animated beautifully, lacked any substance and plot. Critics saw this, as did the few who saw it in theaters.

A lot of the not-so-good reviews of Steamboy are echoing the same thing that Ebert is saying: gorgeous animation, but the story fizzles out into lots of action towards the end. So don't go and label every critic as reviewers for the average movie goers.
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jfrog



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PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 7:43 pm Reply with quote
LordByronius wrote:
You don't have to listen to critics; noone does. They never have, except in rare circumstances. But you seem to be discounting their usefulness entirely. I think that's a tad wrong.


You could always just read film blogs instead, that's what I do. No one pays attention to them, so they don't need to have any consideration to the mainstream audiences that could actually find something to enjoy in Teh Avaiter (or whatever Hollywood dreck is soaking up acclaim now).

Ebert's review of Irreversible isn't so much "Why I liked it" as much as it is "Why this movie didn't offend me." As I said in the other thread, I don't hate the guy...Beyond the Valley of the Dolls was so brilliant that I'm willing to overlook any shortcomings he may have, including actually liking the recut version of The Brown Bunny (if that one was 'good' I'd hate to see what the Cannes version is like).
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Jkid



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PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 7:53 pm Reply with quote
Proman wrote:


By the way, let's not forget the version he saw was cut by 20 minutes.


Why Columbia/Tristar would produce a shorter English-dubbed version along with a uncut subtitled version?

And why produce a shorter English-dubbed version?
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Proman



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PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 7:59 pm Reply with quote
abunai wrote:
Personally, I consider both of those films (to varying degrees) to be waste of time and money - but different strokes for different folks.

I can cosider any movie to be a waste of time to a varying degrees Wink .
I will reserve my judgement on "Steamboy" until after I see it.


Last edited by Proman on Sun Mar 20, 2005 1:18 am; edited 1 time in total
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Pop-Art Samurai



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PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 8:01 pm Reply with quote
Because they aren't stupid maybe?

The cut and dubbed version is supposed to be released in more theaters. The uncut subbed version is playing in more "select" venues.

The obvious reason being that this way those who refuse to watch something dubbed may have a chance to see it the way they want; and the 'general public' who would likely be turned off by the idea of subtitles are more likely to go see it because it looks cool etc. So the studio probably figures that this way they can make money off both the general public and the anime elitists.

"Pay no attention to what the critics say... Remember, a statue has never been set up in honor of a critic." - Jean Sibelius
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