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Oroboro
Joined: 13 Nov 2012
Posts: 143
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Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2013 11:19 pm
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I was actually thinking of bringing up an analogy of drinking to Chunibyo myself, with the point being that there's pretty much nothing wrong with drinking as long as it's done responsibly in moderation. Same with Chunibyo.*
There's nothing inherently wrong with Chunibyo behavior, but Rikka was taking to it excessively and for unhealthy reasons. It's important that she tackle her real issues, but it doesn't actually mean she has to stop being Chunibyo. Yuuta realized it in the end, even if it was a bit cheesy and rushed.
*Alcoholism is of course, a much more serious condition than juvenile fantasies, and recovering from it involves actual physical chemicals and dependencies to deal with, so don't look too deeply into the comparison.
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Ryu Shoji
Joined: 15 Jul 2009
Posts: 671
Location: Cambridge, United Kingdom
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Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2013 10:49 am
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Oroboro wrote: | I was actually thinking of bringing up an analogy of drinking to Chunibyo myself, with the point being that there's pretty much nothing wrong with drinking as long as it's done responsibly in moderation. Same with Chunibyo.*
There's nothing inherently wrong with Chunibyo behavior, but Rikka was taking to it excessively and for unhealthy reasons. It's important that she tackle her real issues, but it doesn't actually mean she has to stop being Chunibyo. Yuuta realized it in the end, even if it was a bit cheesy and rushed.
*Alcoholism is of course, a much more serious condition than juvenile fantasies, and recovering from it involves actual physical chemicals and dependencies to deal with, so don't look too deeply into the comparison. |
Bingo. (And yeah, alcoholism isn't a perfect analogy, but it's the only one I could think of).
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Kaioshin_Sama
Joined: 05 Feb 2005
Posts: 1215
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Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2013 11:38 am
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This show was kind of bullshit to me, but it doesn't surprise me it's scored so high in all categories either since Kyoani stuff always seems to get the most favorable and easy going reviews everywhere I go regardless of key flaws that seem rather obvious to me.
While the first half was about the best effort I've seen from Kyoani in years in actually making me laugh at the scenes by actually showing some variety and polish in the styles of comedy used instead of bombarding me with lame slapstick and manzai style comedy and practically screaming the jokes and meaning at my face the second half felt like the show was basically just affirming it's fanbase. That's some praise I can actually give the show, however I can't agree with nor praise an ending that basically states that facing reality and growing up both in character and emotionally is somehow a bad thing because it makes poor wittle Rikka (by far the worst character in terms of development and being annoying in this show) sad and thus apparently it's better to just use an emotional crutch like playing make believe to cope with the death of a loved one. About the stupidest resolution and probably the most obvious pander to it's audiences warped sense of morality and reality I've ever seen from an anime. It brought what might have been Kyoani's first tolerable anime for me since Haruhi crashing down there with the likes of Lucky Star and K-On, which I mostly see as insincere commercialized drivel. I feel they really missed the opportunity to make some social commentary or show some real character growth for a character that basically had none throughout most of the show.
The way I see it there were only two characters in this show that were well developed and likeable by the end and those were Shinka who eventually evened out into a person that seemed to have the most realistic assessments of most situations and Touka for showing the tough love that was necessary towards Rikka while also appearing to genuinely care about her future mental well-being, but also had her own desires for the future which made sense as well. Of course the show seemed to go out of it's way to try to portray Touka as somehow in the wrong for wanting Rikka to snap out of her Chuunism, face reality and eventually have a chance at a normal life and relationship, but that's not her characters fault so much as the overall shows warped sense of morality. Yuta was okay until he chose to take the easy way out with Rikka and allowing her to continue as she was instead of fixing what he was more or less responsible for and broke like Touka asked him to before she left.
@MaxSouth: No doubt Theron is by far the most generous reviewer this site has and by a country mile at that. He's about the only one I regularly see praising things far higher than I could ever possibly bring myself to in my wildest dreams while many of the others seem far to dismissive and like they came with an axe to grind rather than the intent to tell it straight. It's a shame Zac doesn't do reviews anymore as the rare time I hear him commenting on modern stuff in podcasts or doing the seasonal preview thing we seem to match opinions almost point for point. Other than that my closest match in viewpoints and opinions seems to be Rebecca.
Anyway just for fun this would be my final score:
Overall: C+
Story: C
Animation: A-
Art: B
Music: C-
+ Some amusing comedic sequences involving the contrast both visually and metaphorically between the perspectives of reality and fiction, Top tier animation quality
- Weak ending that basically highlights and ultimately affirms and even supports it's main characters mental illnesses may leave some scratching their heads, melodrama often enters the realm of sappiness at crucial moments
Last edited by Kaioshin_Sama on Sun Jan 13, 2013 11:56 am; edited 1 time in total
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Oroboro
Joined: 13 Nov 2012
Posts: 143
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Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2013 11:51 am
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Kaioshin_Sama wrote: |
While the first half was about the best effort I've seen from Kyoani in years in actually making me laugh at the scenes by actually showing some variety and polish in the styles of comedy used instead of bombarding me with lame slapstick and manzai style comedy and practically screaming the jokes and meaning at my face the second half felt like the show was basically just affirming it's fanbase. That's some praise I can actually give the show, however I can't agree with nor praise an ending that basically states that facing reality and growing up both in character and emotionally is somehow a bad thing because it makes poor wittle Rikka (by far the worst character in terms of development and being annoying in this show) sad and thus apparently it's better to just use an emotional crutch like playing make believe to cope with the death of a loved one. About the stupidest resolution and probably the most obvious pander to it's audiences warped sense of morality and reality I've ever seen from an anime. It brought what might have been Kyoani's first tolerable anime for me since Haruhi crashing down there with the likes of Lucky Star and K-On, which I mostly see as insincere commercialized drivel. I feel they really missed the opportunity to make some social commentary or show some real character growth for a character that basically had none throughout most of the show. |
It seems to me that you have completely misinterpreted the message and general meaning of the ending. Rikka came to terms with the death of her father. That was the important bit. The point was that, with that issue out of the way, there's nothing wrong with continuing to play pretend and have fun with her friends.
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Kaioshin_Sama
Joined: 05 Feb 2005
Posts: 1215
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Posted: Sun Jan 13, 2013 12:11 pm
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Oroboro wrote: |
It seems to me that you have completely misinterpreted the message and general meaning of the ending. Rikka came to terms with the death of her father. That was the important bit. The point was that, with that issue out of the way, there's nothing wrong with continuing to play pretend and have fun with her friends. |
There is if it could lead to a relapse, which is something that could easily happen with someone so emotionally fragile and prone to spontaneous acts without much forethought because it's okay whatever she does wrong Yuta will be their to fix it. Of course the series knows this and knows that it won't have to tackle the whole what happens after part so it can basically just get away with leaving off on that sugary note and ending up not treading on the heels of it's buyers who don't want to feel that their interests have been criticized somehow or taken into a different perspective as opposed to affirmed outright by the show.
And even if that isn't the reasoning behind why the writers of this show chose to go with a conclusion like that there were still much much better ways to handle that conclusion as has been pointed out numerous times by some posters here. When they are that easy to think of and people end up asking the obvious questions I think it points to a rather weak conclusion. The way I see it Kyoani is just too afraid and lazy in the writing department to leave anything they ever do off with a bittersweet or challenging ending and thus the conclusions to their shows are usually rather lame for it.
P.S: If it's no secret I really loathed Rikka by the end. She was a little annoying at first, but the show was a comedy so it was able to cover it up as just for laughs, but once the show actually started trying to make me genuinely care about the emotional well-being of a character that basically acts like either a shrill delusional idiot or a whiny mopey baby (as much as the show often makes us forget she's a high schooler and not in fact a little girl) and who can't figure out that people are trying to help her I basically didn't care how she ended up other than that it made sense...which sadly it didn't really. Personally I cared more about Touka who ended up putting her entire life and career on hold to try to care for this girl that just saw her as this oppressive force in her life. That's what strong familial bonds are all about.
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Ryu Shoji
Joined: 15 Jul 2009
Posts: 671
Location: Cambridge, United Kingdom
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Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 5:14 am
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I was just reminded of the scene where Yuta and Rikka are going to school and Yuta is trying to teach Rikka how to speak normally and she just can't understand how to do something so simple as to ask someone if they need something in a normal manner.
That's how serious things got with her being a chunibyo.
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor
Joined: 05 Jan 2002
Posts: 7912
Location: Anime News Network Technodrome
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Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 5:19 am
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Kaioshin_Sama wrote: | It's a shame Zac doesn't do reviews anymore |
When did I announce that?
I'm working on reviews of Mass Effect, Blood-C and Penguindrum now. All should be up in the next 2 weeks.
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter
Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Posts: 23669
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Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 5:21 am
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Ryu Shoji wrote: | I was just reminded of the scene where Yuta and Rikka are going to school and Yuta is trying to teach Rikka how to speak normally and she just can't understand how to do something so simple as to ask someone if they need something in a normal manner.
That's how serious things got with her being a chunibyo. |
You continue to misunderstand the intent of the show. The scene you just described was part of the comedy. The writers never intended you to think, "oh my god, look how serious this situation is! She can't even talk in a normal manner."
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Ryu Shoji
Joined: 15 Jul 2009
Posts: 671
Location: Cambridge, United Kingdom
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Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 8:12 pm
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Blood- wrote: |
Ryu Shoji wrote: | I was just reminded of the scene where Yuta and Rikka are going to school and Yuta is trying to teach Rikka how to speak normally and she just can't understand how to do something so simple as to ask someone if they need something in a normal manner.
That's how serious things got with her being a chunibyo. |
You continue to misunderstand the intent of the show. The scene you just described was part of the comedy. The writers never intended you to think, "oh my god, look how serious this situation is! She can't even talk in a normal manner." |
Unless you're one of the writers, I'm not sure you can make your own assumption like that and say it as fact. Do you really think the writers intended me to laugh as she fumbled around trying to figure out how to speak normally?
The show was definitely a comedy to begin with, but it certainly did drift away from that in the second half and became more focused on the drama. In my opinion, the show had some very strong humour at the start which was very distinct than what we saw in the later episodes as the show developed into a drama and I believe that the "moe hook" of the show was used as a device to help us sympathise with Rikka, by finding her adorable in the earlier comedy scenes, which easily transitioned into sympathy for the later drama scenes.
Yuta did imply that Rikka was trying to make a joke out of it as the scene went on, but even then, it was such a sombre scene that it was hard to find it funny; I believe that we were supposed to feel sorry for her in that scene, not to laugh about it.
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walw6pK4Alo
Joined: 12 Mar 2008
Posts: 9322
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Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 10:16 pm
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Zac wrote: | I'm working on reviews of Mass Effect, Blood-C and Penguindrum now. All should be up in the next 2 weeks. |
Blood-C is one of the most unintentionally hilarious series I've come across. Reminds me of pure exploitation ultraviolence of the 80s and early 90s, sometimes it's even more graphic! That director is amazing, and I'm starting to become a fan of his work. He can't help that the series is awful if taken literally, that's the script's fault.
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Fencedude5609
Joined: 09 Nov 2006
Posts: 5088
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Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 10:29 pm
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walw6pK4Alo wrote: |
Zac wrote: | I'm working on reviews of Mass Effect, Blood-C and Penguindrum now. All should be up in the next 2 weeks. |
Blood-C is one of the most unintentionally hilarious series I've come across. Reminds me of pure exploitation ultraviolence of the 80s and early 90s, sometimes it's even more graphic! That director is amazing, and I'm starting to become a fan of his work. He can't help that the series is awful if taken literally, that's the script's fault. |
I didn't know you were a Girls und Panzer fan!
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walw6pK4Alo
Joined: 12 Mar 2008
Posts: 9322
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Posted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 10:39 pm
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Fencedude5609 wrote: | I didn't know you were a Girls und Panzer fan! |
And Another, Dai Mahou Touge, Joshiraku, Ika Musume, xxxHolic, and I don't dislike his other high energy comedies. He has quite a range of competent series, but Panzer may be his most consistent and even one so far, and not being an adaptation probably gives from freer range.
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kanechin
Joined: 21 Jan 2012
Posts: 447
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Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:14 pm
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I could had enjoyed this if they didn't add frakking romance in everything.
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