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NEWS: 4Kids Posts 3rd Quarter Results


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Yashouzoid



Joined: 10 May 2005
Posts: 411
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 5:55 pm Reply with quote
Gaining less is the first step to gaining nothing. And they're certainly gaining less.

As for Winx Club, they're not trying to push it. At all. They'd rather focus on Yu-Gi-Oh!. Seriously, if they keep this INSANE MENTALITY going, they're not going to last long.
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GodOfObelisk



Joined: 07 Nov 2005
Posts: 6
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 5:56 pm Reply with quote
Eww, if they keep buying anime then it might be Bleach up next on the chopping block (not that I care that much since Bleach just seems like some Yu Yu Hakusho and Shaman King rip-off, but what do I know, right).

I did a paper on how stupid Toei and 4Kids are for alienating us, let's hope the teach feels the same way after what I had to say.
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Yashouzoid



Joined: 10 May 2005
Posts: 411
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 6:00 pm Reply with quote
I don't think 4Kids will be touching any new series for a long time - One Piece, one of the top rated anime series in Japan, was a complete disaster. But I'm sure everyone knows that...

...if you don't you're only fooling yourself U_U *glares at certain 4Kids defenders from numerous boards including this one*

Kahn also stated that they're not going to focus on anime so much anymore but invest in their own properties, but I'd take anything he says with a saltshaker or seven...
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Buster Blader 126



Joined: 14 May 2005
Posts: 1206
Location: Mississauga, Ontario, Canada
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 6:31 pm Reply with quote
The only beef I have with 4Kids is that they don't keep any promises they make.

"We're not going to change any of the character's names in One Piece." You should've known all of the characters names before making that statement. (Referring to Captain Smoker, Zolo isn't really that bad considering r sounds like l when pronounced in Japanese.)

"We're going to eventually release all of our anime uncut." Whether it's a dispute between FUNi or not, we still haven't seen any uncut DVD's for a long time.

The anime being edited for the North American home is perfectly understandable and all, but if you don't target ALL audiences, then that's where you can lose potential profit.
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Abarenbo Shogun



Joined: 19 Jul 2005
Posts: 1573
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 6:49 pm Reply with quote
Navitron wrote:
Abarenbo Shogun wrote:
Keonyn wrote:
Hope they start to get the idea that they won't make money by alienating their market.


I'm betting that if they continue this trend, they might throw in the towel and come to us Otaku as a last resort.

I really... really.. really really really..... doubt that Laughing


*waves a wad of Jacksons* "Here Kahnny Khanny Khanny....."
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Abarenbo Shogun



Joined: 19 Jul 2005
Posts: 1573
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 6:53 pm Reply with quote
IchigoK90 wrote:
With 4Kids sales going down only one conclusion comes to my mind. That conclusion is that they will try to find another popular anime that they can maret/butcher. In a way having their sales go down might not be a good thing.

However I can think of one good thing that could come out of it. 4Kids merges with another anime distributer company and that prevents them from butchering less anime.

Thats what I think might come out of it.

- IchigoK90


Or the dumbass Anime Company that is stupid enough to license anything to 4Kids makes a few needed "stipulations."
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Pepperidge



Joined: 13 Sep 2003
Posts: 1104
Location: British Columbia, Canada
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 7:14 pm Reply with quote
Pokemon definitely isn't the only thing keeping Nintendo floating, but it's far from a stretch to claim that YGO is the only thing bringing 4Kids any substantial profit at all now.
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Hi no Neko



Joined: 17 Sep 2004
Posts: 204
Location: Austin, TX
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 7:17 pm Reply with quote
Yashouzoid wrote:
...if you don't you're only fooling yourself U_U *glares at certain 4Kids defenders from numerous boards including this one*


*is glared at*

I do agree with the majority, though. One Piece was truly a lost opprotunity.

Perhaps if it had aired on KidsWB rather than FoxBox/4KidsTV? Pokemon practically made KidsWB a giant among it's demographic, (Not including cable, of course.) and Yu-Gi-Oh managed to feed off that success pretty well. Perhaps they should push their next big license (Maybe Bleach, but I've got my eye on Viz in that department.) more at other stations rather than coop it up on their own.
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Tempest
I Run this place.
ANN Publisher


Joined: 29 Dec 2001
Posts: 10420
Location: Do not message me for support.
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 8:32 pm Reply with quote
Jimmy Balls-O-Steel wrote:
Don't you just love it when someone you hate fails at what they do?


Uhh, they aren't failing.

They just aren't doing as well as last year. For a company like 4Kids, it's pretty much hit & miss till you find a new cash cow....

With $100 million in near-liquid assets, they can afford a lot of misses or "small hits" (properties that are profitable but not cash cows).

For 4Kids to actually fail, they'd have to start, you know, losing money.... lot's of it.

-t
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Mozilla
SPAMMER


Joined: 10 Nov 2005
Posts: 93
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 9:46 pm Reply with quote
Don't forget, I was hoping 4Kids would be in Dept after getting One Piece, Magical DoReMe? and butchering it, and bringing its Notrh American Demise, and paying for their spot on Fox every Saturdays, and other stuff.

Seriousely the statement also says 4Kids has "$104 million in cash and investments. They aren't gonna close down because of a couple of million dollars (who knows? Companies do the strangest things these days). And remember it says its Quarter is down, it didn't say they were actually losing money, they just wern't making as much at their peak. I see 4Kids in their business for a long time *Shivers* and I don't think they plan to go by anything else, even their name supports this "4Kids" is for kids.

I doubt there will be any change, and I am grateful they took their time and effort on trying to make shows 4Kids and making them viewer friendly (too friendly in my opinion). I don't hate 4Kids to death, but I don't like them too much, I just choose to avoid them on Saturday Mornings on Fox and I ignore any of their titles at the store.

Just my Opinion.
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Yashouzoid



Joined: 10 May 2005
Posts: 411
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 10:03 pm Reply with quote
tempest wrote:
They just aren't doing as well as last year. For a company like 4Kids, it's pretty much hit & miss till you find a new cash cow....


Here's the thing: 4Kids has 2 "big" series. Guess what? They have 5 more that have a lot of potential. What do they do? They stick them in the WORST POSSIBLE place to make a hit out of them. The only show that they were actually smart enough to NOT premiere on 4Kids TV was Yu-Gi-Oh! GX, which was already pretty much a given success.

But even that was pretty stupid. Al Kahn said that they wanted 4Kids TV to become their main source of profit this year - almost immediately after, they sold off Pokemon Chronicles and Yu-Gi-Oh! GX, two series with potential and backed behind well-known franchises, to their competitors. Does this sound like a smart company to you?

Various sales reports have indicated that the uncut DVDs have actually outsold their corresponding edited DVDs. 4Kids themselves have said that the uncuts did good. Many times. Yet they canceled them in favor of the lesser product. They've said that the reason was money. If they say uncuts aren't profitable, then wouldn't it be logical to assume that the edited counterparts aren't either? So why are they still producing them? Does this sound like a smart company to you?

4Kids has had many shows that have made up for their declining Yu-Gi-Oh! sales. Shaman King? Winx Club? One Piece? TMNT? Sonic X? Why isn't 4Kids DOING anything with those shows? Why are they so intent on driving Yu-Gi-Oh!, which is for all intents and purposes a done deal, into the ground, not even giving their other properties a second glance? If they're not going to do anything with them, why pick them up in the first place? Why did they take one of the top-rated shows in Japan and make it a complete disaster here? Does this sound like a smart company to you?

Honestly I don't think 4Kids is even trying anymore. Either that or Al Kahn is stuck in this 80s-mid 90s mentality where everything has to be butchered to work in America and that shows can sell themselves. Um, no. Doesn't work that way.

Quote:
For 4Kids to actually fail, they'd have to start, you know, losing money.... lot's of it.

-t


Gaining less is the first step to gaining nothing. 4Kids is dying, slowly but surely. I gurantee you that if Nintendo were to switch merchandisers and they lost all ties with the American Kennel Club, they'd be gone in a year.
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Mozilla
SPAMMER


Joined: 10 Nov 2005
Posts: 93
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 10:50 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
Here's the thing: 4Kids has 2 "big" series. Guess what? They have 5 more that have a lot of potential. What do they do? They stick them in the WORST POSSIBLE place to make a hit out of them. The only show that they were actually smart enough to NOT premiere on 4Kids TV was Yu-Gi-Oh! GX, which was already pretty much a given success.


I agree, hands down. Your right.

Quote:
Various sales reports have indicated that the uncut DVDs have actually outsold their corresponding edited DVDs. 4Kids themselves have said that the uncuts did good. Many times. Yet they canceled them in favor of the lesser product. They've said that the reason was money. If they say uncuts aren't profitable, then wouldn't it be logical to assume that the edited counterparts aren't either? So why are they still producing them? Does this sound like a smart company to you?


I'm not trying to back up 4Kids, but remember, they ARE "4Kids Entertainment" and their slogan "We know what KIDS like". Just imagine, little Jimmy, 5 years old, watches Yu-Gi-Oh or Shaman King everyday on Tv, so for Christmas he wants a Yu-Gi-Oh or Shaman King DVD, now I don't think little Jimmy's parents would appreciate it if they picked up the Uncut Dvd, which may scare little Jimmy and his parents. No seriousely, I guess 4Kids is way too much For Kids then the rest of us. And although I hate the idea, it may not be so good to sell uncuts for shows aimed for kids - I bet I'm gonna get flammed for this.

Quote:
4Kids has had many shows that have made up for their declining Yu-Gi-Oh! sales. Shaman King? Winx Club? One Piece? TMNT? Sonic X? Why isn't 4Kids DOING anything with those shows? Why are they so intent on driving Yu-Gi-Oh!, which is for all intents and purposes a done deal, into the ground, not even giving their other properties a second glance? If they're not going to do anything with them, why pick them up in the first place? Why did they take one of the top-rated shows in Japan and make it a complete disaster here? Does this sound like a smart company to you?


Doesn't sound smart to me. I can't wait to see what 4Kids will do once Yu-Gi-Oh! is over!



Quote:
Gaining less is the first step to gaining nothing. 4Kids is dying, slowly but surely. I gurantee you that if Nintendo were to switch merchandisers and they lost all ties with the American Kennel Club, they'd be gone in a year.


Well, I don't think they are losing enough money ever quarter to put them out of business, and remember, they still get money every quarter, unless they go in debt.[/quote]
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Joe Mello



Joined: 31 May 2004
Posts: 2253
Location: Online Terminal
PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2005 12:16 am Reply with quote
Where the heck did these ties to Nintendo and the AKC come from?

From the looks of some of the replies, there seems to be a bit of confusion, so I'd like to clear it up right now:

4Kids IS NOT AN ANIME DISTRIBUTOR 4Kids does not do what Geneon or ADV does. 4Kids does their own thing, and that thing just happens to include anime. After all, it's not only popular, they made it popular.
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aluria



Joined: 11 Nov 2005
Posts: 367
Location: New Westminster, B.C., Canada
PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2005 2:01 am Reply with quote
Ah, what nice words:) Its not unexpeced when 4Kids doesn't give the people what they want. Hopefully they will keep going downhill and have to shut down some time....I can dream....
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Emerje



Joined: 10 Aug 2002
Posts: 7334
Location: Maine
PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2005 3:35 pm Reply with quote
Wyvern wrote:
Actually, I bet they are feeling it. Big profitible companies tend to go into internal panic attacks when they become less profitible, even if they're still very successful by any objective standard, because it might be a harbinger of bad things to come, and even if it isn't, their objective is to grow every quarter, just like any other big company, and not meeting that goal is never a good thing. There's probably a lot of hand-wringing over these numbers over at 4Kids, even though the public will never see any of it.


Companies like 4Kids is well aware that that their titles wont be popular forever and they've made it pretty obvious by reporting their assets that they're very much prepared for what amounts to a couple pot holes in their profits. I doubt they're sweating over this and they shouldn't be as long as their profits remain as high as they are and they maintain their zero debts.

Quote:
Look at the movie industry. They're still worth billions of dollars and DVD sales are healthier than ever, yet nearly every single report about movies I've read this year goes to the trouble of pointing out that movie sales are down from last year, and for some reason this constitutes a "slump" despite the fact that the studios are still massivly profitible. Okay, so it's only the SECOND most profitible year in movie history, no big, right? But try telling that to studio executives-I can't count the number of news stories I've read about how the people in charge of studios are getting more and more uneasy and some are even predicting the death of movies as we know them, just because this year was only massivly profitible instead of phenomally profitible.


There's a lot of media and internet hype going into those reports too. You really hear about the positives these days, talking about nervous producers and slumping ticket sales is much more entertaining (news reporting has become more about entertaining than actual reporting, but I digress).

Quote:
It seems there's no perspective in the entertainment industry, so I bet 4Kids (also an entertainment company, of course) is having similar panic attacks. It probably doesn't mean the end for them, but at least they'll sweat a little.


Again, I doubt they're sweating, they prepared for it, they knew it would be coming eventually, and they're in a position where they can deal with it comfortably. It's not as if they're making any wild accusation looking for a scape goat, Yugioh and TMNT sales ARE down all around. Yugioh has lost its steam and TMNT is in a rut thanks to odd ball sales decisions like Playmates selling the same characters over and over again (and often several variations at the same time) causing a saturation of toys on the shelves while not pushing for characters kids want or creating show accurate versions of the characters. Playmates needs to reevaluate play patterns, but that's another story for another website.

Quote:
I bet 4Kids will think long and hard before liscencing another major property, considering the money pit One Piece has become for them (even if that is mostly their own fault, try to get them to admit that.)


On the contrary, this is even more of an incentive for them to hunt down the next big thing, they wont want to sit on a decline like this for too long. As for One Piece, keep in mind that they still show it at a key hour on Cartoon Network's Toonami where for the longest time it was showing double episodes every weekend. This is the same network that bumps shows off on a whim so it must be doing something right to remain, it only went down to one episode because it was taking up too much space on the block (Naruto got bumped down to one episode as well).

I know you hate to believe it, but 4Kids isn't hurting for money and wont be as long as they continue to turn a profit and stay out of dept. Let's also not forget that we're talking about a quarter that takes up most of the mid and late summer, a period where most kids aren't inside watching cartoons and aren't getting as many toys with the holidays so far away. All areas of the entertainment industry seems to hurt just a little bit more during that period. If they can't get things back up in the fourth quarter then maybe they can worry a bit, but for now it's business as usual.

Emerje
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