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NEWS: Production I.G going public


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BrianRuh



Joined: 17 Dec 2003
Posts: 154
Location: Austin, TX, USA

PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 1:41 pm Reply with quote
Just so you know, this news is over a month old... Razz
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor


Joined: 05 Jan 2002
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 2:23 pm Reply with quote
BrianRuh wrote:
Just so you know, this news is over a month old... Razz


Hm. It was just posted today on I.G's English site.
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BrianRuh



Joined: 17 Dec 2003
Posts: 154
Location: Austin, TX, USA

PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 2:53 pm Reply with quote
Zac wrote:
Hm. It was just posted today on I.G's English site.

I don't remember where I first read about this, but this business article about the stock offering is dated November 16. There's also this one dated December 7.
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Lolotakun



Joined: 08 Dec 2005
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Location: Luxembourg

PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 7:26 pm Reply with quote
However, it is sad that such artistically demanding studio with some kind of alternative-independent-image like Production I.G. is going to play the vicious game of the stock market. A big "BOO!" for this! Evil or Very Mad
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Patachu
ANN Reviewer


Joined: 08 Jul 2004
Posts: 1325
Location: San Diego

PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 7:44 pm Reply with quote
I don't see why this should be so bad. It means I.G will now have more capital to invest, which they can put towards better equipment and more staff.

Of course, you can't buy creativity, but they can now afford more tools with which to exercise that creativity.
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Lolotakun



Joined: 08 Dec 2005
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 8:16 pm Reply with quote
Um... Production I.G. movies and shows don't seem do be done with a lack of personnel or modern equipment to me. Hey, they're probably the most sophisticated animation studio in Japan, so why insisting on expanding strategies by hook or by crook? Until now, I.G. was able to stand out because of it's individual projects driven by real artists and competent teams, backed by president Mitsuhisa Ishikawa. Do you really think this would be possible with a whole management board bitching over every artistic decision that possibly could not be appreciated by some anonymous investors?
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belisarius



Joined: 29 Jul 2005
Posts: 203
Location: Concord, NC

PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 8:22 pm Reply with quote
Lolotakun wrote:
However, it is sad that such artistically demanding studio with some kind of alternative-independent-image like Production I.G. is going to play the vicious game of the stock market. A big "BOO!" for this! Evil or Very Mad


Yeah just look at how going public completely ruined Google. Oh wait-
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Lolotakun



Joined: 08 Dec 2005
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 8:31 pm Reply with quote
Thanks, but little constructive and in no relation with what I wrote.
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Jabberwock



Joined: 19 Jul 2004
Posts: 92
Location: Currently attending the University of Florida

PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 9:20 pm Reply with quote
Lolotakun wrote:
Thanks, but little constructive and in no relation with what I wrote.


Just because a company goes public does not mean that it can no longer function correctly or whatever you are trying to say. If anything they will have more money to hire more talent, buy better equipment, or expand. Just because you think it looks like they have the best equipment, or have enough personel does not make it so. Your comments concerning what will happen to the company after it goes public are entirely speculation. If you hadn't noticed, the most successful companies are those which are public, not private.
The purpose of companies has and always will be to make money, now it will just be to make the money for investors instead of the owner/s. Investors have no influence over the day to day workings of the company, the board of directors will hire the CEO, probably Mitsuhisa Ishikawa, and he will continue to make the decisions for the company. No "management board" has to be hired just because it goes public as you claim, only if the CEO decides to hire one, if there already isn't one. And the CEO will make the final decision anyway, not the "management board." I don't know why you think this is so horrible, a company is a company whether public or private. You try and make it seem that they are somehow ruined by this, when really it only helps them.
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Lolotakun



Joined: 08 Dec 2005
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 10:08 pm Reply with quote
Thanks for the comment.

Okay, first, don't shoot me for the "management board"-vocabulary-mistake, because English is not my first laguage. What I meant was "board of directors", for all I care. So this should be clear.

So sure, I'm speculating about I.G.'s financial situation, but you will hopefully not trying to sell me that of all studios they are the most impoverished, are you? As a company, they want cash, granted, but I.G. just don't knit socks or bake deep-frozen pizzas, they're making art! They're not a factory, but as an atelier, they are losing a lot of credibility here.

Going public always goes along with restructuration. Responsibilities are splited up, people get hired, people get fired, goals are rearranged. Ishikawa is a pretty nerdy and laid back person for someone in his position, and he always stood behind his crew and the ideal to keep the balance between profitability and artistry, with a little more weight on the latter (which is why nothing is less secure than his CEO-position).

Now imagine (attention: little hyperbole) all those freaks of the team suddenly having to answer to a bunch of guys in suits who don't even know how "animation" is spelled, who themselves are "representatives" of 2000 anonymous shareholders, mostly played for suckers!

Jabberwock wrote:
The purpose of companies has and always will be to make money, now it will just be to make the money for investors instead of the owner/s.


You're being a bit of a devil's advocate here. How's this: money should go as directly as possible to the pockets of the people who work for it, avoiding to the maximum sharing it with opportunists who want a slice of big loaf, laid back with their fingers in their nose. I'm not starting the discussion about why the stock market is responsible for most of the misery in the world, but in this particular case, you maybe should, as an animefan, be a little more worried about what money-prurience is about to do to your favorite artists. Does anyone remember the old Toei classics before they became merchandise-whores? I do.

Sorry for the little harsh tone, but the topic makes me boil somehow.
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belisarius



Joined: 29 Jul 2005
Posts: 203
Location: Concord, NC

PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 11:16 pm Reply with quote
Lolotakun wrote:


So sure, I'm speculating about I.G.'s financial situation, but you will hopefully not trying to sell me that of all studios they are the most impoverished, are you? As a company, they want cash, granted, but I.G. just don't knit socks or bake deep-frozen pizzas, they're making art! They're not a factory, but as an atelier, they are losing a lot of credibility here.

Going public always goes along with restructuration. Responsibilities are splited up, people get hired, people get fired, goals are rearranged. Ishikawa is a pretty nerdy and laid back person for someone in his position, and he always stood behind his crew and the ideal to keep the balance between profitability and artistry, with a little more weight on the latter (which is why nothing is less secure than his CEO-position).

Now imagine (attention: little hyperbole) all those freaks of the team suddenly having to answer to a bunch of guys in suits who don't even know how "animation" is spelled, who themselves are "representatives" of 2000 anonymous shareholders, mostly played for suckers!

Jabberwock wrote:
The purpose of companies has and always will be to make money, now it will just be to make the money for investors instead of the owner/s.


You're being a bit of a devil's advocate here. How's this: money should go as directly as possible to the pockets of the people who work for it, avoiding to the maximum sharing it with opportunists who want a slice of big loaf, laid back with their fingers in their nose. I'm not starting the discussion about why the stock market is responsible for most of the misery in the world, but in this particular case, you maybe should, as an animefan, be a little more worried about what money-prurience is about to do to your favorite artists. Does anyone remember the old Toei classics before they became merchandise-whores? I do.

Sorry for the little harsh tone, but the topic makes me boil somehow.


I was sort of hoping my sarcasm and Google's obvious success as a publicly traded company would make you re-consider your position, but as it has failed to do so, I suppose I'll compose a more detailed reply.

1) You are correct in assuming that producing art is a different endeavor than producing frozen pizzas. However, an artist is just like a factory worker in that he or she has to put food on the table for themselves and their family. Production IG is a company whose purpose is to make money by SELLLING art products. Companies, from time to time require injections of capitol to grow and expand or improve the quality of their product. An IPO is often a good way to generate such capitol if the company was privately held previously.

2) Your assumption that having a board of directors or public share holders who are largely ignorant of how the anime industry works will somehow have an adverse affect on the quality of IG's works is both laughable and ignorant. Do you even know how corporations work? As long as the members of the company (that is the current owners) retain a majority of shares then they dictate who gets to sit where on the executive board. Let's make it simple. Let's say IG has 1 Million shares of itself available at a price of 10 dollars US a share. If the company holds onto just 500,001 of those shares and offers 499,999 to the public, it retains TOTAL control of the company while at the same time generating almost 5 Million in new capitol. Neat huh?

3) I hate to break it to you kid, but stock markets are an integral part of the modern economy of all developed nations. Major and minor entertainment companies rely on them as a means to generate capitol and finance growth. I'm all for anything that moves cash from investors pockets and into IG's hands, as this IPO will. More over, it's nice to know the money I'm shunting into my IRA will help me retire one day because I've invested it wisely. If I read your final point correctly, you're suggesting I shouldn't be allowed to invest in a company I don't myself work for, which is patently absurd. That's not how a free market economy (again, a staple of the developed world) works. When you get to college, do yourself a favor and take a few courses in macro-economics, they will serve you well.

EDIT : Because I'm a nice helpful guy, feel free to follow this here link http://money.howstuffworks.com/​stock4.​htm to learn more about how stock markets and corporations work here in the United States. Japan may be different on the specifics, but I suspect the general template is the same.

DOUBLE EDIT : I got curious and followed BrianRuh's links (thanks man) and discovered that the IPO will consist of an offering of 1,100 shares of a total 13,900 shares of the company. This means that even if all of those shares sell out to private investors, they would control less than 10% of the company, rendering them virtual non-entities when it came to voting for company executives. So relax Lolotakun, you've nothing to fear.
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Deacon Blues



Joined: 09 Mar 2005
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Location: Niagara Falls, NY

PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 11:36 pm Reply with quote
Hm... I wouldn't mind purchasing some stock in their company... if I knew where to that is... D:
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Lolotakun



Joined: 08 Dec 2005
Posts: 45
Location: Luxembourg

PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2005 1:24 am Reply with quote
Thanks for your answer, belisarius, but you didn't need to get uncomfortable. First, I'm not your or a kid that you can "break" because of his lack of opinion. As well-meant as your link was, I actually know most of its content from back in high-school, from which you're right to deduce that I am already in college. Settled. A good point is that in fact I haven't yet experienced how companies exactly work in the U.S., since I am European, which might explain some hard-to-solve issues in the discussion.

1) Why are you people all acting like I.G. only went public to prevent an otherwise inevitable financial apocalypse? Don't worry, I'm sure every single member of I.G. can make sure that his family doesn't starve; gosh! They went public it in the sole intention to grow an expand. But tell me: why do they have to? They have been one of the most popular animation studios in the world for 10 long years, all their productions are perfectly lucrative artistically and commercially, so why change the winning recipe? OK, "zero accretion" isn't really a popular economic concept in the U.S., but at least in this special case it would have been the better alternative for I.G. in order to keep their face in front of the world-wide fan-community.

2) That's where you didn't seem to get the gag. I do assume that the management board of I.G. is not fully composed of total retards. Your neatly explained share-balance-trick is worthless over time: shares are maybe the most instable economical value, in terms of worth as well as of possession. It doesn't take much for a group of obscurely interested shareholders to take over a company like this by majority. Let's not forget that I.G. is now less defensive against a theoretical buyout. And there surely are lots of biggies who'd like a nice I.G.-slice!

3) Stock markets may be a part of our economy, but it's not based on them, seriously! Maybe that in times of massive North-South divide and abusive globalisation we should be a little bit more sceptic about the current way to play. You noticed that I have a pretty hardened opinion concerning this matter for the time being, and I won't deepen it for now to prevent the topic from being locked.

Let's finish with a little sample calculation to prevent Deacon Blues from going broke Wink : even without greater investments and steady profits, the shares of a decent local theatre company lost 50% of their worth in less than 3 years. Where did all the money go? Not into Innocence, if you ask me.


Last edited by Lolotakun on Sun Dec 18, 2005 1:33 am; edited 1 time in total
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The Ramblin' Wreck



Joined: 07 Apr 2003
Posts: 924
Location: Teaching Robot Women How To Love

PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2005 1:29 am Reply with quote
Deacon Blues wrote:
Hm... I wouldn't mind purchasing some stock in their company... if I knew where to that is... D:


http://ccbn.aol.com/​company.​asp?​ticker=​3791.​Q&​coid=​195256&​client=​aol

As soon as more details become available......any stock broker or online service would do.
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Ranmah



Joined: 27 Jan 2003
Posts: 294
Location: Stomp'n on Tokyo Tower

PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2005 9:35 pm Reply with quote
If I had the money I would buy stock in that company.

I would also buy stock in Pow! Entertainment (Stan Lee's Company)
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