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Incest with sisters and cousins is old, now. But Mothers? That's barley been touched in non hentai animes.

As a longtime anime fan, I remember when incest was shocking along with a whole grocery list full of other plot elements that were shocking back in the day and now only get a "meh!" What we are posting on here is one of the main reasons why. The internet flooded people with a wide range of images and videos covering all sorts of things that at first were shocking and now not so much. It simply takes a lot more to shock the average viewer than it used to. Horror films are not as scary as they used to be. Gross-out comedies are now mediocre at best. In the end, we need to have the impossible happen: To wipe the slate clean of the "information overload" so that things like incest are shocking once more.

se37 wrote:

Yeah, I agree with the others above. I have seen a good number of brother/sister incest but nothing (outside of hentai) for parents. I think the main reason is due to the fact that they are mainly around the same age while parents are a whole generation and can turn off even people who like the brother/sister incest type.

If I remember correctly the show MM had the main character who's mother AND sister were always trying to get into his pants. Somehow that seems a little less disturbing than the other way around, ESPECIALLY when your parents are still together!

What! Hasn't anyone here heard of, read or seen Oedipus Rex? I mean, it's the mother of all incest stories.

Oh, wait. It's not anime. Silly me.

maximilianjenus wrote:

of all the great work that kusunoki key has, this was the one that became anime ?

There's an OVA for Ogre Slayer as well. Viz released it on dub-only VHS back in the nineties.

I vote for keeping "Pile of Shame" - there's a nice double meaning there for when Justin talks about embarrassingly awful incest shows, but it still allows him to talk about shows he enjoys when he finally gets to them in his backlog.

Zac wrote:

However I just now realized that that's going to get another series of pedants coming in complaining 'HOW IS THIS TITLE BURIED I JUST HEARD ABOUT IT THE OTHER DAY'.

Maybe simply adding that first paragraph in italics before each column would explain it to people who are somehow struggling with the extremely simple title 'Pile of Shame'.

Surrender Artist wrote:

I'd rather not see pedantic backseat editing be vindicated.

Seriously, some people harp on the silliest things.

Is there a new definition of pedantic that I am not aware of? What this thread and other PoS (heh) discussion threads have established is there is a segment of ANN readership that has not encountered the term "Pile of Shame" in the context intended.

If you have not encountered that context, and given the fact that Justin tends to highlight obscure titles that often have some dubious elements, it is not to be wondered at that some people might interpret the term to mean the column is dedicated to reviewing bad anime the way Buried Garbage was. As Zac himself points out, this has to be explained in virtually every PoS discussion thread.

How does noting this make somebody a pedant? As a person who has struggled with remaining polite and respectful in the past, I have to say this kind of sneering contempt for a suggestion that has a justifiable rationale doesn't make the effort to remain polite and respectful any easier.

I could also note that having to put a disclaimer in front of every PoS column to avoid confusion for new readers who may not be familiar with the term would work, but the need for such a disclaimer suggests the title might be problematic. Oops, I guess that's just me being pedantic again. Rolling Eyes

I'm just thankful; that someone didn't start trying to defend real life incest as that's happened a couple times when other Anime that deal with this have been discussed.

pachy_boy wrote:

se37 wrote:

Yeah, I agree with the others above. I have seen a good number of brother/sister incest but nothing (outside of hentai) for parents. I think the main reason is due to the fact that they are mainly around the same age while parents are a whole generation and can turn off even people who like the brother/sister incest type.

We're also talking about people that literally gave birth to you. That's what I can't not think about.

My mother never gave birth to me.
Sorry in advance, but I just had to say it.

The Japanese have the incest taboo like (nearly) everyone else. It might be worth asking as to how recently it caught on as a trope over there, usually (as in Love Hina) it isn't real incestuous attraction, as they aren't really siblings.

I have to say that although I've seen anime and manga that insinuate brother x sister pairings (or simply the attraction), or mention them in passing, or feature couples that are supposed to remind you of it... I don't see explicit sibling incest as anything common. I guess I watch the wrong things. Wink

Probably the appeal of it is related to people having brothers or sisters (therefore no Westermarck effect). And without the Westermark effect a brother and sister look like any other boy and girl who live together and are especially close to one another ('just like brother and sister...') - I noticed most people with this kink have no brothers or sisters of their own, and people with no brothers or sisters are less likely to be squicked by the idea outright.

Zac wrote:

Astra4000 wrote:

If all it takes to get a shameful review is genial direction, then this column will have a lot of material.

Pile of Shame refers to 'stuff Justin hasn't gotten around to watching yet but has meant to for decades' not 'everything that gets reviewed in this column is trash'.

Since launching this column I've become intimately familiar with just how many people have never heard the term 'Pile of Shame' before and think it's somehow negative. All it means is 'stuff I'm ashamed I still haven't seen'.

Yet the majority of the reviews do indeed turn out negative... Laughing

Lord Geo wrote:

Galap wrote:

Well, to be fair it's not like the mother-son incest thing isn't completely untouched as a general statement.

For example, it was one of the main sources of humor in the fairly mainstream Back to the Future, which isn't even really considered a very risque movie.

True, but that was more of incidental incest humor, because Marty went back into the past & was interacting with his then-future mother who was the same age as him at the time. It's technically incest, sure, but it also had a bit of a qualifier to it, hence why it's more silly fun than potentially "squicky". Also, Marty didn't want anything to do with his future mom... She was all over him.

Also, Fry slept with his grandmother in Futurama...(and let's face it, even if Fry momentarily thought Mildred wasn't his grandmother after all, he had to know there was a 50/50 risk to what he was doing. He was just desperate to get some... Laughing

)

I also watched Timerider: The Adventure of Lyle Swann recently and they basically did the same thing too.

Time travel stories loves them incests. Razz

Blood- wrote:

Is there a new definition of pedantic that I am not aware of? What this thread and other PoS (heh) discussion threads have established is there is a segment of ANN readership that has not encountered the term "Pile of Shame" in the context intended.

If you have not encountered that context, and given the fact that Justin tends to highlight obscure titles that often have some dubious elements, it is not to be wondered at that some people might interpret the term to mean the column is dedicated to reviewing bad anime the way Buried Garbage was.

I agree with what you are saying.
I do not think that it is pedantic to be ignorant of something and admit that you were not aware of it, and that is what I am seeing here. Maybe I just did not read the thread closely enough, but I did not notice anybody who was insisting that the title be changed because it violated some rule. It is mostly just people who admitted to being confused.

And I was one of those confused people, and I did not even know that I was confused until I read this thread.
Somebody pointed out that you can find the intended meaning by using Google. This is correct, but I never saw any reason to do that. Between the generally negative connotation of "shame" and the fact that "pile of shame" is very similar to "pile of" something else that starts with "s" I never wondered about the meaning because I thought that I knew it.
Most of what I read in the column seemed to be negative, but that may be just because something that you expect to be bad is more likely to be in your backlog than something that you expect to be good.

Now that I understand it "Pile of Shame" seems like a good title. I feel ashamed of how huge my backlog pile is.

I like to see this have USA release. Just because I want to see hell freeze over.

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