Forum - View topicGantz -- need help understanding the ending.
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maxxjulie
Posts: 192 |
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anyone know what the ending of Gantz was all about. I don't know what the hell it means. Was it pergatory for Kei and he's going to heaven? Or is it just meaningless BS?
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v1cious
 Posts: 6202 Location: Houston, TX |
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it's called running out out of material and throwing in a complete copout.
read the manga, it goes on past where the anime ends. |
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abunai
Old Regular
 Posts: 5463 Location: 露命 |
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Copout, yes. Running out of materia, no. The manga was far ahead of the anime, and there was plenty of material. It's obvious that the reason for the (execrable) series ending's deviation from the manga (from ep. 22) was that the show wasn't renewed for another season, so they had to wrap it up prematurely. The result was an abomination, I agree. - abunai |
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CyberViper
Posts: 218 Location: Matsumoto, Nagano Japan |
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I, for one, really enjoyed the ending. I liked how it just left everything open to interpretation without being simply inconclusive (with room for more).
The simple and straight answer i'd have to give is that the ending is whatever you think it is. It's really up to you what happened in the end. Think about it for a while and i'm sure you'll come up with a theory you feel suits it. |
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opaquescum
Posts: 235 |
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Even if the show was not renewed. The writers did a very nice job of wrapping it up. The ending connects in, and is not the usual stapple on happy ending bologna. The ending like the entire series requires you to connect alot of different peices together.
I can give you one answer, but I want you to think long and hard. Do you actually want this to be handed to you. It kind of defeats one of the strong points of the series. I also recommend anyone who did not get any bit of the ending to not read this spoiler watch the series again, and see if you can approach it from a fresh perspective. spoiler[ Kei is alive. I know your thinking cliff hanger ending its not. This is really a sign of sadism though. If you arent versed in the series enough to understand the mechanics here it is for you. Kei is on the display on Gantz ball. Yeah there are atleast two incarnations of Gantz maybe 3. Kei is still in color which identifies him as being on the boundry between life and death. You never see the ball click him to death, and the game clock is stopped. At this point you should understand all game rules have been lifted. The last arc alone displays this. For instance there are no aliens. Gantz is flinging out halucinations. Laying food out for people to eat, and has altered the physics even. No attack lag present. So by the time you get into the last arc its pretty apparant that the game deception is pretty much done for. Plus you are getting pretty continuous references to this all being a labyrinth a maze. You also get the point that gantz is takeing it out and kei. That the relationship has become almost head to head. Needless to say by the time you get to the train station kei has been deemed a winner. Based on his own personal growth at a person. We know that atleast 2 players in Gantz have been monitored outside of Gantz. The bike gang leader is one, and kei is the second. Kei is monitored by Gantz in the form of that same old women who asked him for directions. I know not everyone gets this. When you watch the series again this old women will definately change how you feal about the character Gantz. The other Gantz avatar maybe niche. Please forgive me if the spelling is wrong. I will not go into why I leave you to go pick that up for yourself. Anyway at this point Kei is in the train station reliveing his original final moments. This is sort of his way to come to terms with how he died the first time. We can only assume that as he runs down the tracks. That he has figured out what he and koto did. Was increadibly important. How it changed so many lives, and helped to make the bystanders better people. Either way at this point its clear he is in that place between life in death. After all he has a dead women on his back, and reviewing his life at the same time. He stops while running from the train to listen to what Gantz has to say and smiles. Now if he did not know before he does know now he has the choice. He has earned the right to make the choice he never got when he came to Gantz. Whether he wants to live or die. Does he want to go back to life or go to be with his friends. He has made the choice that he wants to live. This is why in that cliffhanger scene he turns around points his finger like a gun and says I am going to live. He has made his choice. Now you can how its not as much of a cliffhanger as some thought. After all if you watched the last 3 episodes you know he is determined to live. ] Well anyway thats how I saw it. I decided not to put in all the supporting details. I would rather not write a 20 paragraph post, and now that you know this explanation. You might have fun going through the series again. I know I probabally should not of posted this spoiler, but well I am kind of tired of the I did not get it crowd so I will trash it. Personally I think the OP atleast made somewhat of an effort whereas others probabally made none at all. |
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abunai
Old Regular
Posts: 5463 Location: 露命 |
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Well, opaquescum and CyberViper, I'm happy for you that you enjoyed the ending. But allow me for a moment to suggest that a different mechanism is at work:
Having invested all the time and effort to see the first 20-odd episodes of Gantz, episodes which are very fine indeed, is it possible that you are willing to engage in doublethink to justify to yourselves the tacked-on ending, just to avoid having to admit to yourselves that you had been cheated? I'm not saying that that is how it is -- I'm not a mind reader, and you could well be sincere. But I suspect that this is the same psychological mechanism that causes Neon Genesis Evangelion to have such single-mindedly devoted fans. That is, it is difficult to admit that all the effort that has gone before was a waste, because one has discovered that the climax is a letdown. Say, that's what keeps people in sects, too. It's the mechanism that keeps a scientologist paying thousands upon thousands of dollars, long after he has begun to suspect that it's useless. Because, after all, then he would have to admit that all those previous thousands were wasted, and that he'd been cheated. Hmm..... - abunai Don't get your panties in a twist - I'm sure you're sincere, I'm just pulling your leg. |
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maxxjulie
Posts: 192 |
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I did get that end of Eva Tv feeling watching the ending. The show was really about Kei killing aliens, fighting for his life, and trying to get laid. Underneath all of that you see him improving as a human being. The crap at the end just felt thrown in to make it seem more important than it really was. Just like the last episodes of Eva. I like the show but the ending was a letdown. What made it seem worse was I watched Gungrave before Gantz. Gungrave has the best last episode of any anime I've seen IMO.
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AceRyonik
 Posts: 145 |
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The funny thing about the last game in the series is that the same damn thing happens to a different character in the manga, but people don't complain about that. But enough about that.
The reason I didn't like it was because it didn't make sense. It never explained why Gantz was out to get Kurono. One character says that, "Nobody EVER beats Gantz!" suggesting that Gantz was miffed at Kei for winning the games three times in a row. Excuse me, but Nishi had won WAY more games than Kei, and Gantz addresses him respectfully as "Mr. Nishi." The actions of Gantz didn't seem to follow any sort of logic in the last arc, which is why I disliked the end. |
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opaquescum
Posts: 235 |
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I think there are two factors alot of people ignore when it comes to gantz.
The first factor is it has no stand alone episodes. The beginning takes 4 episodes to settle out, and the end takes about six starting with the climax. Which my god is a very good climax that took guts. The second factor is the entire series was scripted in advance. All the story elements were decided ahead of time, and before you say manga. The series deviated from the manga in a number of different ways. So whether you like it or not the ending you got was the ending you were going to get even if they ran kei through a couple more gauntlets. They already had the tie ins in place. In other words the connections for the ending were built in to begin with. No happenstance they were thought out well in advance. This means you cannot really say well the last episode. You mean the last half dozen episodes. You cannot even say its tacked on, because it already existed. I agree with you I would have loved to see the series go on for another season or two, but it dosent change the fact that is what the ending was supposed to be. The ending in no way departs from the very nature of the series. I do not think I am brainwashed to try to make it something it is not. Maybe you are brainwashed to expect it to be something totally different from the rest of the series. A tacked on ending would have been a explicit ending with an indepth explanation, and a anticlimax. Both of which I must say were not how the series went about things. I am curious about that though. Why would anyone expect the last episode to be any different from the first episode, or the thirteenth or the twentieth. The only explanation I can come up with is that anyone who feals this strongly about it must have really loved Gantz. I do not know I liked the ending. It was emotionally charged came like a thunderclap and did not get bogged down. Which is what the series was like. Lets just hit you with a sledge hammer. |
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Maken Buster
 Posts: 104 |
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I came to a similar conclusion to that of opaquescum's, albeit not quite as deep
 .
Basically,spoiler[ he earns his freedom and gets brought back to "life", hence why we don't see anything/anyone when the train goes by after the credits. As for everyone else, tough luck, the game's not easy...the others in "the trio" came to terms with their setbacks (Katou's ability to pull the trigger to save himself and friends, Kishimoto's strictly relying on Katou and the others) before death. I do think Gantz purposely delayed the sending to let Katou and Mika die, though...he's just a jerk that way.] Last edited by Maken Buster on Fri Apr 21, 2006 6:53 am; edited 2 times in total |
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Kruszer
 Posts: 7983 Location: Minnesota, USA |
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I pretty much hated Gantz myself. Though it's mostly for the second season's wasted potential and the fact the only two characters that I liked were killed off. It's a series dripping with malice for humanity, and devoid of hope. I don't know, I just didn't like how it felt really. On top of that the main mystery is never explained and it's hard to care about a main character who's just a shallow jerk most of the time.
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Bearracuda
Posts: 1 |
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Regardless of the reasons Gantz ended, or why, I have to say I like the ending. It may not have remained consistant with the style or story of the rest of the series, but it still anchored on the deep psychological meaning beyond simply what you see, and that's why I liked the entire series anyway.
I'm going to explain the gantz ending, but first, I need to share a few conclusions I came to throughout the series that leads me to my theory on the show's ending: spoiler[1: Gantz was created by, and works for, a higher power. He has a job, he has great abilities, he's part computer, and he goes and gathers people to eliminate aliens in a highly developed, organized manner. So it's most likely that some species, maybe aliens, maybe the government, who it is doesn't matter, created Gantz. What matters is that Gantz is following orders. However, whoever they are, they're the ones receiving any aliens "sent" by the triangle gun. 2: Gantz is a person. Maybe not in the literal sense, because the creepy guy poked his ear and stuff showed up on screen, so he could be a cyborg, but he has a brain. Gantz has a sense of humor, and there was a person inside the ball, the other reason I think Gantz is a person is the ending, which I'll explain to you in a moment. 3: The old lady asking for directions is the physical representation of Gantz. For short, she is gantz. The creepy dude said Kei was scanned before he got teleported to the apartment, and he recalled that old lady specifically. So I think the old lady is either an illusion or some piece of equipment gantz sends out to scan each person when they're about to die so he can, quote unquote, "fax" them into the apartment. Now, the ending. When Kei was first faxed in, or perhaps over time as kei completed missions, Gantz came to respect Kei. Whether it was his determination, his will to live, or simply his attitude, Gantz felt Kei wasn't just another person to kill aliens. So, when Kei told the old lady (AKA Gantz) to screw off, and figure it out on her own, Gantz came to the realization that he doesn't specifically need directions. He can think for himself. He has a free will. (this, btw, is the third reason I believe Gantz is a person) And so, Gantz decided not to follow orders. He wanted to be destroyed, he didn't want to continue making people hunt aliens. The reason could be that he feels sickened by the way he lives, stuck inside a ball, with nothing to do but what he's told. Perhaps the reason is because so many people died because of what he asked them to go out and do. The reason Gantz decided not to follow orders doesn't really matter, what does matter is what he decided to do after that. Gantz felt the need to end the meaningless cycle of death, and so, when everyone showed up, he told them to hunt Kei. He knew that by doing this, everyone would be confused, they'd conflict, they wouldn't trust each other. But most importantly, Kei would get pissed at him and try to kill him. He knew that Kei probably partly blamed Gantz for his friends dying, because of what Gantz had put them through, and by targeting Kei, he knew he could convince kei to attack him. That is the story of the ending. That is what happened, Gantz convinced Kei to end his existance. I don't know if Kei is alive, there are several possibilities and no way to divine which one was true. Kei could've been dead from the moment Gantz picked him up for the missions, and since Gantz was dead at the end, he could no longer "fax" Kei to keep him alive. Another possibility is that kei barely survived the train, and was in the hospital, and the entire series was simply a "dream" of sorts. The third possiblity is that once Kei defeated Gantz by standing up to the train (don't ask me how the fk he killed Gantz by going all spike on the train, I don't know) he simply survived, and was standing in the real world. The fourth possibility, and the one I liked the least, is that when Kei defeated Gantz, he got hit by the train again and really did die this time. As for the 2 psycho killers being part of that, I don't believe they were there because of Gantz's doing, Gantz just picked up people about to die as he always does. However, they did have a purpose, and that purpose was to destroy the remainder of Kei's hope, and cement his determination to kill Gantz. By killing everyone else, the killers removed the possibility of everyone simply working together, and not doing anything about Gantz's orders, leaving Kei with no option but to face and destroy Gantz. On a completely unrelated note, you may also be wondering whether or not Kei was dead, that answer is simple and complicated at the same time. Kei died. But before Kei died, Gantz faxed him into the apartment. So kei's original body died, but a 100% complete and exact replica of Kei lived on. The replica was created by Gantz in the apartment. So yes, Kei was alive, but every time Gantz "faxed" Kei somewhere, it destroyed his current body, and created a new one where Kei was being "faxed" to. So in a way, Kei was still alive, but had died like, 7 or 8 times. It's a pretty ridiculous concept to grasp, but if you have the imagination to do it, it makes sense. The prestige had a situation similar to this, if you've seen that movie. Great movie.] |
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doctordoom85
 Posts: 2093 |
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I really wish Madhouse had been chosen to animate Gantz instead. If they had handled it like Black Lagoon, they could've done several 12-episode seasons with great pacing, and probably gotten further in the manga than Gonzo did. The filler ending wasn't just awful by how poorly written and executed it was, it was also that bitter realization that the truly great stuff yet to come would never the light of animation day.
Gantz Abridged said it best at the end of episode 22 (last canon episode): Kei Kurono: Hey everyone, this is Kei Kurono! Well, that whole experience sure did suck, and there are some hard times coming up too, but I'm not going to let that stop me! Coming up in Gantz Abridged, I'm going to spoiler[redeem my humanity through the love of a good woman with normal-sized boobs! I'll train a bunch of psychics and super-models and street fighters into an elite team of bad asses that can handle anything Gantz can throw at us! And God willing, I might even find a way to see some of my old friends again!] It's going to be a wild ride, so don't miss it! Gantz: Not happening, dip*censored*. Kurono: What?! Why not?! Gantz: Because the rest of the show is filler. Cue Darth Vader big "NNNNNNNOOOOOOO!!!" Though TBH, it's not too surprising, I'm having trouble imagining a network airing the episodes where spoiler[psychotic Izumi goes on a shooting rampage in a shopping district.] |
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Kruszer
Posts: 7983 Location: Minnesota, USA |
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Did the Gantz abridged people ever make "the filler chronicles?" Because I have to say that was so hilariously awesome and brilliant.
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doctordoom85
Posts: 2093 |
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Last time I checked, Filler Chronicles hasn't started, though he did do an audio commentary on episode 1, giving some cool info on the abridged series' production (for example, that awesome abridged theme opening? You'd be shocked how quickly it was made). And I notice you were disappointed that the Gantz anime lacked answers, the manga just started last week a big "three weeks in a row" of chapters focused entirely on providing answers. And while a good deal of humanity is still portrayed rather darkly in the manga past where the anime leaves off, a developed Kurono (arguably the best element of the manga that the anime didn't get to) and certain other characters do show that there are some good people out there. |
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