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The Fate Of The Filler


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animalia555



Joined: 12 Jun 2004
Posts: 467
PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2006 5:02 pm Reply with quote
I know there are lots of threads out there bashing the current filler episodes in Naruto, and Bleach, so here is something slightly different. Who else is worried that the current filler trends will end up cancelling the shows just like Rurouni Kenshin was cancelled?

Last edited by animalia555 on Sat Jul 01, 2006 4:53 pm; edited 5 times in total
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Deltakiral



Joined: 07 Oct 2004
Posts: 3338
Location: Glendora, CA (Avatar Hei from Darker than BLACK)
PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2006 5:46 pm Reply with quote
animalia555 wrote:
I know there are lots of threads out there bashing the current filler episodes in Naruto, and Bleach, so here is something slightly different. Who else is worried that the current filler trends will end up cancelling the shows just like Rurouni Kenshin was cancelled?

With shows like Naruto and Bleach they are so popular that I wouldn't worry too much. From what I hear Bleach's filler aren't really all that bad, as for Naruto is so damn popular that I hardly have to worry about that show.

Kenshin is a special thing, when the Kyoto arc concluded we knew that there was going to be some sort of filler. The problem was that the fillers were so bad that people stopped watching, and when people stop watching and when show get bad rating no wants to advertise. No advertisement means no more show, not really a problem with Naruto it's still extremely popular.
Till next time,

Delta Kiral
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Code001



Joined: 07 May 2006
Posts: 60
Location: USA
PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2006 5:56 pm Reply with quote
I don't understand why we need filler unless the producers are just greedy (and I assume all of them are....). Is it really that hard to simply stop the series and then start over where it left off?
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Deltakiral



Joined: 07 Oct 2004
Posts: 3338
Location: Glendora, CA (Avatar Hei from Darker than BLACK)
PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2006 6:07 pm Reply with quote
Code001 wrote:
Is it really that hard to simply stop the series and then start over where it left off?
Well yes if a series stop because there is no new Manga to adapt I doubt they will ever come back to the series. Reasons being that company (That is handling the adaptation.) will probably have to go to work on another series to make money. There are a few series that did do it a different way, Hunter X hunter stop production and had OAV to complete the manga.
Till next time,

Delta Kiral
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halochief_90



Joined: 06 Feb 2006
Posts: 466
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2006 8:32 pm Reply with quote
I'm worried that Case Closed will get cancelled off YTV just like off Cartoon Network; the entire series is basically filler (awesome filler at that)! That show, unlike hits like Naruto, already doesn't get many viewers. Hopefully YTV is getting a good deal on the show so they can continue airing it no matter how bad it fairs.

In the case of Naruto, not like it's a huge problem for them, but the developers should stop playing that on the next Naruto episode at the end of each episode. Then people won't be able to tell when a filler is coming (I'm only watching the show on YTV, so I don't have the current "filler problem")!
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DuelLadyS



Joined: 17 Mar 2006
Posts: 1705
Location: WA state
PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2006 8:47 pm Reply with quote
Code001 wrote:
I don't understand why we need filler unless the producers are just greedy (and I assume all of them are....). Is it really that hard to simply stop the series and then start over where it left off?


Becuase, quite simply, many of us are fickle and impaitent. Stop a show and/or flip to reruns for awhile, and your viewership gets bored and moves on to new programming "For awhile." Which results in people not coming back to the show for not knowing when the new episodes start. Example: I used to Watch Queer Eye for the Straight Guy religously. Then they pulled/moved it for a little while. I lost track of it until 2 weeks ago- and even now, I don't care enough anymore to make it a point to watch it again.

Filler helps keep people watching- if for nothing other than checking every week to see if it's still filler.You still remember it's on, and you'll resume your viewing habits when the episodes sway to your liking again. That's their evil plan. Very Happy
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omnistry



Joined: 03 Mar 2005
Posts: 1015
PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2006 9:24 pm Reply with quote
I think there are some great filler episodes out there. One that comes to mind is the spoiler[baseball episode] in Samurai Champloo. Not only was it the best episode in the entire series [opinion] but possibly the best of all fillers of any anime [another opinion]. When spoiler[all the teammates from both sides start dying] the laughs are rollin'.

I guess it depends on the show. Some fillers can feel long; whether others are even better than the actual storyline.
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Deltakiral



Joined: 07 Oct 2004
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Location: Glendora, CA (Avatar Hei from Darker than BLACK)
PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2006 9:55 pm Reply with quote
omnistry wrote:
I think there are some great filler episodes out there. One that comes to mind is the spoiler[baseball episode] in Samurai Champloo. Not only was it the best episode in the entire series [opinion] but possibly the best of all fillers of any anime [another opinion]. When spoiler[all the teammates from both sides start dying] the laughs are rollin'.

Umm those weren't actually fillers. Fillers are when the Anime goes astray from the manga. And since the anime was an original production i.e. it wasn't development from a manga. The manga was made after the series. I think more or less it's just off topic I guess, I am not sure of the word. But what that episode is an episode that doesn't contribute to the main arc of the series. Although you are right it is a great episode.
Till next time,

Delta Kiral

Edit: It doesn't necessarily have to be a Manga, it could be a novel or whatever the source for the Anime is.


Last edited by Deltakiral on Wed Jun 28, 2006 10:01 pm; edited 1 time in total
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halochief_90



Joined: 06 Feb 2006
Posts: 466
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2006 9:56 pm Reply with quote
omnistry wrote:
I think there are some great filler episodes out there. One that comes to mind is the spoiler[baseball episode] in Samurai Champloo. Not only was it the best episode in the entire series [opinion] but possibly the best of all fillers of any anime [another opinion]. When spoiler[all the teammates from both sides start dying] the laughs are rollin'.

I guess it depends on the show. Some fillers can feel long; whether others are even better than the actual storyline.
Agreed. Some fillers can be funny and offer really good side stories, I think Inuyasha does that best (the sidestories can sometimes feel less filler than non-filler episodes in that show. Yeah, the slow story development). Regardless, most of the time they are extremely annoying and only make you cross your fingers and say; "Now next time there for sure isn't going be a filler. Next time..."

Edit:I was typing this before Delta Kiral made his point of episodes going astray from the manga. I've never watched Shamploo, and I don't read manga so I don't know whether the Inuyasha episodes I was meaning were in the manga either (Naginata of Kencone, Moroku's Master's Last Banquet). Which brings up another question; how do you know for sure what a filler is when you watch it?
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animalia555



Joined: 12 Jun 2004
Posts: 467
PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2006 10:36 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
Moroku's Master's Last Banquet
is MOSTLY fillar the parts with Kagura and the baby are cannon and I think that is what makes that episode so interesting, the mixture of serious cannon with humorus filler.


Last edited by animalia555 on Fri Jun 30, 2006 5:20 pm; edited 2 times in total
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HitokiriShadow



Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 6251
PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2006 10:46 pm Reply with quote
Deltakiral wrote:

Umm those weren't actually fillers. Fillers are when the Anime goes astray from the manga. And since the anime was an original production i.e. it wasn't development from a manga. The manga was made after the series. I think more or less it's just off topic I guess, I am not sure of the word. But what that episode is an episode that doesn't contribute to the main arc of the series. Although you are right it is a great episode.
Till next time,

Delta Kiral

Edit: It doesn't necessarily have to be a Manga, it could be a novel or whatever the source for the Anime is.


That is only one definition of filler. Filler can also refer to episodes that don't relate to the main plot and are just there so that a series hits its predetermined episode count. This is the applicable definition in anime that are original creations and are not based on manga/novels/games/whatever, such as Samurai Champloo.
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IchigoK90



Joined: 13 Aug 2005
Posts: 1634
Location: Scarborough, Ontario
PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2006 11:57 pm Reply with quote
halochief_90 wrote:
I'm worried that Case Closed will get cancelled off YTV just like off Cartoon Network; the entire series is basically filler (awesome filler at that)! That show, unlike hits like Naruto, already doesn't get many viewers. Hopefully YTV is getting a good deal on the show so they can continue airing it no matter how bad it fairs.


I wouldn't call Case Closed a series filled with filler just that Case Closed is more of an episodic series. Samurai Champloo, Cowboy Bebop and Master Keaton are also examples of episodic series.

Deltakiral wrote:
Umm those weren't actually fillers. Fillers are when the Anime goes astray from the manga. And since the anime was an original production i.e. it wasn't development from a manga. The manga was made after the series. I think more or less it's just off topic I guess, I am not sure of the word. But what that episode is an episode that doesn't contribute to the main arc of the series. Although you are right it is a great episode.
Till next time,

Delta Kiral

Edit: It doesn't necessarily have to be a Manga, it could be a novel or whatever the source for the Anime is.



HitokiriShadow wrote:
That is only one definition of filler. Filler can also refer to episodes that don't relate to the main plot and are just there so that a series hits its predetermined episode count. This is the applicable definition in anime that are original creations and are not based on manga/novels/games/whatever, such as Samurai Champloo.


Again what you two are referring to are episodic series.

"Believe it!"

- IchigoK90
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Fullerific



Joined: 18 Apr 2004
Posts: 7
PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2006 12:09 am Reply with quote
animalia555 wrote:
I know there are lots of threads out there bashing the current filler episodes in Naruto, and Bleach, so here is something slightly different. Who else is worried that the current filler trends will end up cancelling the shows just like Rurouni Kenshin was cancelled?


I admit I have thought about that as well. Naruto is pushing it's luck because it's been over a year now. Even hardcore fans in Japan will lose intrest over a long period of time. I can't see Naruto fillers being any better than the Kenshin fillers.

I might assume they have started working the canon episodes, and are waiting to air them until the manga shows a spot where they can stop and do another filler arc without ruining the pace. The first part of Naruto offered that after the chunin exam and especially after naruto vs sasuke. I don't think there has been a break like that in the manga yet. So they could be gunshy.

I didn't want to make another thread, so I thought I would piggyback this one.

What do you think is the best filler you've seen? I've heard after a certain point PoT strays from the manga and goes it's own route. If that's so, if it was before the american invitational, then I will say PoT's filler was the best, with second being Full Metal Alchemist. It's a shame they didn't wait to do FMA and let it go a bit because what's going on in the manga is pretty good.
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HitokiriShadow



Joined: 09 May 2005
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2006 12:27 am Reply with quote
IchigoK90 wrote:

I wouldn't call Case Closed a series filled with filler just that Case Closed is more of an episodic series. Samurai Champloo, Cowboy Bebop and Master Keaton are also examples of episodic series.

Again what you two are referring to are episodic series.

"Believe it!"

- IchigoK90


I haven't watched Samurai Champloo, so I don't know much about it. It probably is an episodic series, knowing the director.

However, my second/alternate definition is still true. A series can be very plot driven and have an ongoing story (that isn't episodic), but not quite enough for the predetermined episode count and so they toss in a couple of filler episodes.
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Kidder



Joined: 15 May 2006
Posts: 188
Location: Bat country! >.<
PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2006 1:13 am Reply with quote
animalia555 wrote:
I know there are lots of threads out there bashing the current filler episodes in Naruto, and Bleach, so here is something slightly different. Who else is worried that the current filler trends will end up cancelling the shows just like Rurouni Kenshin was cancelled?


Like Delta said, Rurouni Kenshin is a fairly special case. The producers decided to create their own story and the anime diverged from the manga story. Essentially they weren't fillers because I believe the anime producers did not intend to return to the manga arc, thus effectively killing the series.

Naruto and Bleach appear to have a much bigger and more established fanbase inside and outside of Japan. Of course there is a possibility the show may end up being cancelled but I have a feeling that there are so many people following these shows religiously, just waiting for the anime to return to the proper story, that even churning out so many craptacular filler episodes won't lower the TV ratings in Japan by much. Also I'm assuming that a good portion of the fans in Japan are kids so they're just happy to see their favourite characters on screen every week (how else is Pokemon STILL running Anime smile + sweatdrop ).

One Piece is a pretty good example of how to keep a show running for a LONG time. One Piece is close to reaching 300 episodes and is still going very strong. The anime is based on the manga and follows it pretty accurately. The fillers are done so well that you don't actually notice they're fillers. They know how to make funny and amusing fillers that don't feel like they're going too long (a very important factor) and often features side-characters as opposed to the Straw-Hat crew.

That's probably where Naruto has gone wrong. The show has plenty of potential for comedy and crazy ninja hijinks but every single episode has Naruto! It may actually be more watchable if we saw more of the other ninjas without Naruto, doing random missions or getting up to silly ninja mischief. The short episodic filler eps is a better idea than one long filler arc comprised of several episodes.

I've said in previous posts that the Bleach anime fillers are actually quite relevant and important in terms of character development. The manga is extremely fast-paced so there isn't a great deal of character development. I won't post any big spoilers but I will say spoiler[Ishida makes a big decision later on because of the loss of his powers, but the manga doesn't look more deeply as to why Ishida would make this choice]. Unfortunately, they've really dragged the whole Bountou arc out. It was watchable at first, but then they started bringing in almost all the Soul Society characters. Again, they might have much more enjoyable to watch and amusing if they showed less of the main characters and more of the side-characters.

So..... after my long rambling post about fillers I still haven't really answered your question Anime smile + sweatdrop the answer is "no, Naruto and Bleach will probably not be cancelled in the near future". As long as their TV ratings stay high in Japan (and they probably will, despite the fillers) then the studios will keep making new eps. Remember, TV ratings in Japan are what keeps an anime show running.
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