Forum - View topicREVIEW: Attack on Titan episodes 1-5 (English Dub)
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whiskeyii
 Posts: 2245 |
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I wonder if the shift in writing voice stood out as much as it did because JO watched it all in one go? Maybe with Toonami's weekly airings, that particular issue won't be quite as blatant (fingers crossed); at least until June anyway. But yeah, Eren's "dream" quote sounds very, very weird coming out of his mouth, especially since the "grim reminder" line rewrite ties in much better thematically with Eren's "we need to go outside and LIVE, dammit!" mentality. |
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SouthPacific
Posts: 689 |
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Reading the review, and then seeing the A-... Looks like someone is afraid of making (some) people upset!
spoiler[A- should be regarded as a fantastic dub, I mean, it's one step away from being top grade  ]
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whiskeyii
Posts: 2245 |
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I don't know about that, it seems like the minuses are kind of along the "your mileage may vary" type. − Little Eren isn't really convincing, adaptive script betrays character intent occasionally Most of the fans on this site *know* English VAs aren't really known for doing child voices well. Unless it's ear-bleedingly awful, people just kind of shrug it off; it's really only a major hindrance to the new folks who don't know the voice changes later on and are turned away by the child voice. The adaptive script may bother some people more than others, as shown in this very thread. Though personally, the grade itself isn't worth nearly as much as the meticulousness of the whys and hows of the review, in my opinion. ^^; |
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JacobC
ANN Contributor
 Posts: 3728 Location: SoCal |
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Well, it is a real good dub, but the "Overall (dub)" or "Overall (sub)" scores are grading the show itself on the whole. There is no score for "just the acting." If there was, it'd be an A, not an A-, but the A- is reflective of the show itself. (And the - is mostly due to Attack on Titan's melodramatic ham-chewing alongside some real production limitations that affect the pacing, etc.) I love the show, but I'm still kind of a tough critic. As and A+s should be rare things. (AND A-s! A- is really good!) Also yes, why do people focus on single numbers and letters when there's 2,500 words that explain my stance much better? Ah, the curse of ratings systems. |
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Engineering Nerd
 Posts: 898 Location: Southern California |
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There are always people who choose to just skim the scores then making the comment, not saying if that's disrespectful (to the reviewer) or simply lazy; if that's what they choose to do, so be it. I just hope the reviewers from ANN know that there are way more people who choose to read the actual reviews than just being fixated on the scores. There might be disagreements due to tastes or different frames of references, but personally I love reading different opinions provided with credible reasons. |
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clipeuh
 Posts: 117 |
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I felt like your analysis of the new dub lines was very insightful. I don't have a particularly strong opinion about rewriting lines but now I understand a bit more why some people can have concerns. Great review Hope!
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Hellwarden
Posts: 321 |
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It's probably more along the lines of this... Animators-"okay, we need more time and money for the show, it's not ready. It looks pretty rough. Some scenes we didn't even have time to anim-" Financiers-"No. Air it now, or you're fired." |
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Just-another-face
Posts: 324 |
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That's not true in the least, there are plenty of English VAs good at child voices. On the flip side, there's always the problem where Japanese VAs make little boys sound too girly at times (and I have heard this happen before). |
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Gasero
 Posts: 939 Location: USA |
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I don't think I will like those changed lines in the dub, Seems like they could have localized the dialog without changing the the intent of the character.
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ikillchicken
 Posts: 7272 Location: Vancouver |
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Seriously? They changed "That day, humanity received a grim reminder..." What a completely moronic thing to do. That line is iconic.
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FlamingFirewire
 Posts: 461 |
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The only great child voices I've heard in English dubs are Kamichu and R.O.D. -The TV- - and that's primarily because New Generation Pictures used actual children in line with the character ages in those shows (more so with Taliesin Jaffe in R.O.D. -The TV-). New Generation Pictures is pretty renowned for being great at what they do, but R.O.D. -The TV- was stand-out amazing with what Taliesin Jaffe pulled off with child voice actors. Just listening to the commentary with him and the main cast really goes to show how much work it requires to get things like that done - it's too bad it's so uncommon/rare to have child voice actors in general. |
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12skippy21
 Posts: 785 Location: York, England |
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The comment above pretty much sums up my feelings on the matter, how many of us are going to buy this show regardless of the quality of the dub. The one thing I tend to like with dubs is that a good dub will set it a apart almost as a seperate show. I have never particularly liked a literial translation for the dub, overwise you might as a well watch the sub. I think it is because as a language Japanese is quite uniform as due to its culture it is quite ingrained to speak specific ways at specific times while English has a lot of capability to be more all over the place. While Attack on Titan really negates my above argument due to its subject matter, a clean dub just would not have worked. As Hope said in her very good review. I think this dub will stand up for its grittiness, the places where words are barely spoken as it is the anger in those scenes that set the show up to be different from your usual anime fare. That is also why the dub to Higurashi, the only dub I have really hated, fails as the laughter scenes come of has comedic. While I know this show was really only reviewed for its dub because it is assumed we all know the story material it would be good to see this level of detail in the dub section of future reviews, the sentence comparisons are useful. |
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dtm42
Posts: 14084 Location: currently stalking my waifu |
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I get where you're coming from. I absolutely do agree with you that English dubs shouldn't just change personalities willy nilly. I hated the personality changes in Death Note and Code Geass: Lelouch of the Rebellion, as I have made very clear in the past. When watching the dub, the audience should get the same experience (or as close as possible) as the original Japanese audience got. But like I said, in this case I'm conflicted. There's a saying "if it ain't broke then don't fix it" . . . but what if you think it's broken in the first place? I hated Eren for almost the entire first season, and I couldn't really empathise with Mikasa because she displayed too little emotion and agency (if that's the right word). The changes to them both - just based on the examples that Hope gave - do sound like improvements to me. So the real question is, is it ever alright for an English dub to change the personality of a character, even if it was (arguably) for the better? I don't know, which is why I'm confused. I don't profess to have the answer.
Please don't use strawmans. That's not why I like the changes at all; I don't even really dig the Joss Whedon quippy dialogue. I like the changes to Eren and Mikasa - the way that you described them in your review - because they made the characters more palatable (in the case of Eren, whom I found was totally unlikeable in Japanese for most of the show) and more sympathetic (in Mikasa's case, because she actually has a personality now).
This reminds me of the arguments that Dragonball Z fans have been having for years and years. The various English dubs changed Goku's personality from a war-loving man-child (with a high-pitched woman's voice) to more of the traditional American comic book hero who - in a male voice - makes big speeches about freedom and justice. Fans of the original Japanese dub hate the changes because they feel it crapped all over the jokey and adventurous tone of the original Dragonball. On the other hand, fans of the English dubs (such as myself) liked how adult Goku sounded mature and intelligent, which made sense given the more action-orientated and epic/high-stakes storylines in Dragonball Z. Anyway, as much as Eren is different, I personally don't think the changes are out of place.
I partially agree with you on this. I don't mind a bit of whininess, so long as someone isn't whiny and aggro. While with the recon corps he mellowed out just a touch, to the point where I could tolerate him. Levi was a good influence on him.
No and no. He can still kill the titans spoiler[as a titan,] there is no contradiction there. Heck, realistically he's one of the absolute few who can even take on a spoiler[human-form titan.] Without him and his spoiler[transformation] humanity is doomed. The right option is to fight as spoiler[a titan.]
The story may be dark shounen but it is still shounen. Young Regular Teenage Orphan Boy(TM) wants to Get Stronger(TM) by using his Hidden Power(TM) in order to defeat Evil Monsters(TM) who killed his family and in the process Save Humanity(TM). He is helped by his Weak But Brainy Sidekick(TM) and The Beautiful Yet Fearsome Chick(TM). It's pretty classic stuff. The real genius was making the tone darker; apparently the manga-ka was heavily bullied as a kid and he channels those feelings of rage and helplessness in his work. Also clever was coming up with a memorable twist on the standard Fortress City(TM) idea that is seen works like Neon Genesis Evangelion and whatnot.
Maybe a bit more training would have been good, but not a full cour of it. We learned a lot about the personalities of the characters and the bonds between them just in the two training episodes we got and in the way they handled themselves at the first battle.
Question; do powers always need to be carefully foreshadowed? The fact that Eren is spoiler[a titan] came as a huge plot twist, a game-changer. The shock value - he spoiler[seemingly dies, then comes back to life] - was really powerful. I wonder if it would have had the same impact had it been foreshadowed. |
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TheAncientOne
 Posts: 1871 Location: USA (mid-south) |
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The "opening" being referred to isn't the OP, but the "That day, humanity received a grim reminder... of the terror of being ruled by Them... of the humiliation of being kept in a cage." line. |
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Knoepfchen
 Posts: 698 |
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I think I am not fan enough to watch the show again anytime soon, subbed or dubbed. It was a fun and, sometimes, thrilling ride,but what started out incredibly strong got so off pace that I had to remind myself every week I was still interested enough to continue watching in the end.
But as I felt the characters (except for Armin and Jean who actually got some sort of development in contrast to everyone else) were one of the show's weaker points, the changes they made in the dub sound rather interesting, even though they now all do sound the same in the given lines (and I do believe that characters' identities should be respected in a dub). But if Mikasa now gets to have a personality, even if it's not a very unique one, good for her. |
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