Forum - View topicREVIEW: Terra Formars GN 1
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blake.okafor
Posts: 8 |
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I'm not even perfectly sure what the point of your point was besides invalid passive aggressive jabs at me. You didn't really have any rebuttals to anything I said so whatever. Can't argue with that which isn't an argument But it seems like you think the roaches are racist too? 
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ChibiKangaroo
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Yes, I know, everyone becomes "black" on the internet when they want to make an argument about how racism is completely gone from the world, civil rights activists are evil, and people are just too sensitive about racial problems. Thank you, guy who just joined the forum today to pronounce his ethnicity and argue against racial tolerance. Thank you. You have saved us all. |
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Fedora-san
 Posts: 464 |
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It really says a lot when claims about identity are met with such paranoia and distrust. Makes any attempt at discussion pointless quite frankly.
You shifted the goalpost, actually. DavetheUsher was clearly talking about animation, yet the only animation example you listed was a preschool show. No, sorry, a preschool doesn't count as a 'very well developed black character' no matter how hard you try to stretch it. The original claim was about animation. Which given America's stance on being primarily for kids and comedy, makes sense that there's more fear of toes being stepped on. Disney's controversy would never have happened if it was another trashy live-action movie like Soul Plane. The fact it was animation was the primary issue. In that regard, could you even name 5 well developed black characters in currently airing American cartoons? If you truly have to spend literal days thinking up a list, that actually illustrates the problem already. You have confidence it's not a problem, so a low number like 5 should be a piece of cake to list.
Always classy to see someone resort to using a current events tragedy as an analogy to a pointless comic book or cartoon to sound witty on the internet, usually in the same break as trying to be socially sensitive as well, ironically enough.. We can always count on people doing that, at least. |
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blake.okafor
Posts: 8 |
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Well no, I was black at birth. I mean you can look me up on facebook I have a green rose as a profile pic but I do have fabulous pics of myself. Anyways your cynism doesn't invalidate the truth. When did I ever even imply any of those things you accused me of? I don't believe a person's race makes them more or less qualified to discuss race like a lot of blacks apparently do,but with this whole terra formars things is that all the people calling it racist are white, or at least not black. The whole things stinks of white guilt,but I could be wrong, care to argue my points, answer my questions instead of trying to invalidate my race? By the way, I'm not arguing against racial tolreance as that isn't the issue here. I'm arguing against idiots and their misconceptions. My join date is irrevalnt |
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ChibiKangaroo
Posts: 2941 |
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It's not paranoia and distrust. It is knowledge about how internet trolling works. Exhibit A is the follow-up post by blake that comes right below yours.
Why in the world would I want to go neck deep into the game being played there, when we are supposed to be talking about Terra Formars? If people want to discuss what's happening in that story and whether or not the character in that story have racially offensive appearances, that's one thing, but there are people looking for any opportunity to go off on these tangential rants about "white guilt" and "white liberals" and the like. They feel like the best way to do that is by announcing themself "as a black person," and then going on their rant. This is the second person to do so in this very thread. So yea, it certainly makes sense why I give no credit to anyone who comes in and announces that "As X ethnicity, I say this!!" because it is not something that will be verified, it's not something that ultimately means anything (unless you assume that one person of a certain ethnicity can automatically speak for all such people), and it is usually a trick where someone uses it as a precursor to go into some kind of tangential rant. Personally, I find such a belittling of ethnic identity to a cheap trolling tactic to be highly offensive.
Yes it would. Lol. Try Rotten Tomatoes before you make such a silly claim. The very first critical review of Soul Plane listed on that site, by Scott Foundas of LA Weekly sums it up thusly:
And no, I am not going to spend a bunch more time finding examples of characters for you because you aren't going to appreciate that effort when I do. You'll complain about something else, or try to somehow reject those characters. Like I said, expending that kind of effort for people on an internet forum is a waste because they won't appreciate the effort. |
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blake.okafor
Posts: 8 |
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Calling people a troll when you have no proof of that is just lazy argumentation to dismiss someone you don't want to argue with, how intellucally lazy. Since when is it trolling to defend myself from having my race invalidated or words put into my mouth?
Ummm. You're the one that said I wasn't black all I was trying to do is prove you wrong. Not sure what you bold some of those parts for. But usually the people who say I'm not black online are just those who have no argument. I have provided a way for you to prove it for yourself and you have refused so your accusations are invalid if you aren't even going to look into it. Did you ever think that many blacks have legitamte complaints about some white liberals? Certainly I could be a troll but don't you dare tell me I'm not black. You're laziness and fear of being wrong don't make me less black. I'm even going to go out of my way to post this: https://www.facebook.com/blake.okafor#!/photo.php?fbid=411421945558176&set=pb.100000711217191.-2207520000.1409170727.&type=3&theater Aian't I just the dantiest? The reason why these white liberals are mentioned so much is because often times they are the ones saying stupid shit like this is racist, so it isn't a tangent, rather a subnet of the discussion as the implcations are relavent IMO. But don't get me wrong, black libreals are pretty bad too, and this is coming from a libreal myself. These days it's gotten to a point when the people who try to posit themselves as open mineded are the most closed minded of all. The reason why I stated I was black was to add to my observations and then conclude the following implcations that all this hoopla is probably not by blacks but by whites. Judging by you're distate for the terms I'm going to assume you're white, unless you can tell me otherwise? Unlike you I'm willing to take your word for it. So tell me, why do whites feel the need to be offended by something apparently targeting blacks that doesn't even seem to offend any of them? And also I have been trying to discuss the formars appreance. I asked which looks more similar to the formars, the pictures you posted or the ones of Homo Erectus. |
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Zac
ANN Executive Editor
 Posts: 7912 Location: Anime News Network Technodrome |
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I don't think you get to accuse people of being close-minded when you're literally calling everyone who sees any sort of racist caricature in these illustrations stupid, seeing something that isn't there.
I've heard many black fans comment on how the cockroach stuff in Terra Formars was "hilariously racist" (according to one) and "obviously these are supposed to be black people" (according to another). That doesn't prove anything one way or another, but it doesn't make you the open-minded one to try and shut down and silence any interpretation you don't like. Complaining about "liberals!!" just makes it seem transparently obvious that your beef is rooted in the generic conservative boogeyman about "stupid PC liberals ruining everything!" and you're using this as an opportunity to rail against that rather than making good faith arguments that Terra Formars has absolutely nothing in it that can or should be interpreted as even unintentionally racist. This conversation has been going in circles anyway for the last several pages. You and Chibikangaroo aren't going to see eye to eye so maybe it's time to walk away. |
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ChibiKangaroo
Posts: 2941 |
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You're the one putting it forth as an argument. Your race isn't an argument, and other people's race isn't an argument. I personally am offended when people try to use it in that way, and that's one of the reasons I don't trust such pronouncements. I bolded the parts where you are trying to bait me into some kind of debate about whether or not people of certain ethnic groups can make an argument on the issue of race, and whether their race makes their argument more or less important. That is also offensive to me.
I don't doubt that, but this is not the place for such an argument. The place for that would be a political debate or political forum, not a discussion about the appearance of certain characters in a manga or anime. Like I said, you trying to distract the discussion into that topic is simply trolling. That's exactly what trolling is, you distract the discussion off from the topic by dragging people into some extraneous and likely inflammatory war of words over unrelated things.
I really don't care if you are or aren't. Like I said before, I don't give any credit to such proclamations because they are meaningless and usually are being used for trolling. If you really are, good for you. Do you really think that changes anything about Terra Formars, the topic that was up for discussion? No, the only reason it is relevant for you right now is because you want to go on a political rant.
And how do you know whether anyone in this discussion is a "white liberal?" You don't. Again, you are just trolling, distracting the discussion away from the topic and into a political rant.
Again, weren't we supposed to be talking about Terra Formars? How many times are you going to make this about the ethnicity of the reviewer or the posters, when you know nothing about any of those people, including me? You've just proved so many times why I don't like it when people try to make these "As a XXX person, I say this!!" because it is is an attempt to move the conversation away from the topic at hand and into focus on people's ethnicity and who can say what. I don't do that, and I never will.
Yea, you are right. There's probably not too much more to discuss about this manga/anime. I have a sense that this is going to just continue to shift toward a political debate, so I think I will leave it here. Perhaps we will have another discussion about the actual show in the anime's thread, though judging by how bare it is I don't think a lot of people watched the OVA. (And I agree with someone else who said, whether it is racially offensive or not, it is just BAD as an anime lol). |
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blake.okafor
Posts: 8 |
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Being open minded doesn't mean I'm open to everything nor does it mean I can't call BS when I see it.
Very well then, that invalidates my "no blacks are offended" comment, but validates why I say said people are stupid. The latter quote is just presumptuous as if the person knows what they author meant. Putting words in people's mouth essentially.
Well they kinda do... like this series.
I thought I did already, but ok let me try again. Reasons why it isn't racist at all 1. It isn't based on blacks as said before they are based on early man(Homoe erectus), which they look undeniably similar to as opposed to apparent caricatures of blacks or minstrel shows. 2.The fact that racists from back in the day and the author probably were both inspired to use early man doesn't vicariously make the formars racist. That's just guilt by association. 3. This is coming from japan, I don't think they have anything against blacks in particular so to make a series making fun of them would just be odd no? It's rather ethnocentric to insist that a person across the world meant something completely different from where it is when there is so much context that needs to be added.
Fine if the whole white liberal thing really bothers you that much I'll just drop it. I do actually want to debate the topic so let me start over, I guess I did go off topic into a little rant but that was only because there were implcations to it all but I digress. Refer to the above on why they aren't racist. Also which of the latter 2 pics looks most like the first? https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&docid=KJ66FitqbY3VbM&tbnid=DD2AO5bo0LjLVM:&ved=0CAUQjRw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fkissmanga.com%2FManga%2FTerra-ForMars%2FCh-000--Prequel-%3Fid%3D135621&ei=X1n-U5jZEIWZyATwjYHQCw&bvm=bv.74035653,d.aWw&psig=AFQjCNFRsBsEqNbLWXD_uImwPeaPg2wUSg&ust=1409264347603887 https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQnAgFXIXv6Ca7gDZmMtByIQNrJcwsg77YmPIvghqucZUoUEtsEGQ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homo_erectus#mediaviewer/File:Homo_erectus_new.JPG That might be a bit of a loaded example but those pics were after extensive searching. If you have a pic of any western caricature that resembles the formars as much as Homo Erectus I'd like to see it. |
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blake.okafor
Posts: 8 |
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SO I take it that that it's for a fact not racist?
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