Forum - View topicThe Perfect Insider (TV).
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CoreSignal
 Posts: 727 Location: California, USA |
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@Galap, I just meant to say it's hard to tell sometimes. People who are good are problem solving, abstract reasoning, pattern recognition etc. tend to be good at math. And agreed, strong rote skills doesn't imply high intelligence. Being good at long division or memorizing plug-and-chug formulas doesn't necessarily mean you're good at math.
I'm poor at math but I was able to follow your proof just from reading it carefully (and several times!). But yeah, unless it's revealed that Moe is secretly a genius mathematican, the fact that she figured it out that quickly is beyond average intelligence. The character bio in the previews says she's a first-year student and personally, the majority of college freshmen don't solve math problems as small talk, lol. |
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Gina Szanboti
Posts: 11340 |
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Thanks for all the clarifications and proofs! I know Sentai usually do their own tl for subs, but maybe someone should tweet them to be sure they know the difference between products and sums.
 I'd hate to see that error replicated.
Anyone have any insight into how "B and D are the same" yet? |
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meiam
Posts: 3442 |
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I got the feeling she was just remembering it from memory, the Saikawa really like her so he probably talked about this seven is lonely concept before. I'm sure there are other way you can calculated stuff and other number end up coming out as the lonely one, so to just immediately blurb it out mean you already know what answer the person is looking for. Not to say that Moe is stupid, she's probably above average (is she actually a university student or just hanging around?).
I definitely agree about the storyboard being impressive, making static shoot of people talking visually interesting is not easy. I guess they have the advantages of requiring few location, but its still great stuff. |
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Galap
Moderator
 Posts: 2354 |
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Well, I thought it was odd as well initially, but when I asked my friend he responded (and im qoting him exactly), "no: you don't have 2 7s."
as for the B and D thing, maybe its that lowercase "b" and "d" are geometrically identical but reflected? I can't get any deeper implications from that fact so I don't know. Last edited by Galap on Tue Oct 13, 2015 7:47 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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yuna49
 Posts: 3804 |
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B and D are 11 and 13 in hexadecimal or base 16, which uses 0-9 plus A-F to represent the digits from 0 to 15. They're both prime numbers like 7. My understanding is that the F in the title relates to 15, the largest digit in base 16. Early computers used base 8 because their hardware was limited to 8 bits per "byte" or character. In the late 1960's when the IBM 360 mainframe appeared, computers began using hexadecimal and still do today. Modern 64-bit or larger systems still use hex; they just have more digits. In the eight-bit days the character set of computers was limited to ASCII or extended ASCII character sets like the commonly used ISO-8859-1. Modern computers use various "Unicode" systems with up to four hex digits so they can represent characters in many more languages including Japanese. This page, like most modern websites, uses the UTF-8 variant of Unicode. Those gray window frames you see in the ED come from an old Unix desktop environment called Motif. I doubt it's used very much these days. Linux systems, for instance, use much more modern windowing environments, though the underlying technologies for drawing objects on the screen still have their roots in MIT X Windows as did Motif. |
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Gina Szanboti
Posts: 11340 |
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So what you're telling me is, this is going to be the nerdiest anime ever. :D Thanks! Good to have programming literate folks around to lead me by the hand.
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yuna49
Posts: 3804 |
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I find it remarkable that they think viewers would have a clue about things like hexadecimal without any explanation, yet it seems woven into the fabric of the story, at least for now.
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Gina Szanboti
Posts: 11340 |
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I expect it'll come up again with some explanation. If it does, hopefully the translators will be able to keep up this time.
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Galap
Moderator
Posts: 2354 |
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@Yuna49: You're right, that's probably what it is. Yet another really cool reference here.
And I really applaud this show for that. I know about hexadecimal (and in retrospect I might have thought of it briefly when they mentioned the B and D thing, but didn't think of them as being primes). I really like it when things insert a lot of 'advanced' or obscure information into themselves, for two reasons. Firstly, everything that's interesting is at least a couple steps removed from 'common knowledge', so in order to explore new or complicated ideas, you're going to have to play with things that not everyone knows about. Sometimes you can't put simply something that isn't simple. Second, it's a lot more rewarding if there's something I initially didn't get or understand. It adds rewatch value, and value to having discussions about it, if it has enough depths that it's 'bigger than one person', in that any individual will not get every aspect of it immediately. This thread is certainly the best series discussion thread I've seen in a while, and this is only after one episode! |
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Stark700
 Posts: 11762 Location: Earth |
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Episode 2:
I still find Magata to be an interesting character as if it's almost like she's testing Moe. Kinda expected mystery to develop on that island though despite the cherry atmosphere. It looks like a case is developing as well. Pacing felt somewhat slow but I liked the developing connection between Moe and Saikawa. I'm still quite curious about Magata though especially with that strange ending. The fact that she has isolated herself for 15 years makes me curious more about her past life. Also, 11 episodes for this show confirmed. Standard Noitamina I guess but with this pacing, I expect business to pick up more next time. |
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Alan45
 Village Elder Posts: 9835 Location: Virginia |
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@Stark700
I'm pretty sure she didn't isolate herself. Didn't she say to Moe that the isolation was not of her free will? Basically a rich person jail. I thought it was ludicrous that the large armed guard was afraid to open the door because she had previously murdered people. Even if she wanted to murder all the staff for locking her up for 15 years, where would she get the weapons and the strength to take out an armed guard? |
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DuskyPredator
 Posts: 15457 Location: Brisbane, Australia |
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Episode 2
Yeah, don't kid yourself, that Souhei is not the incredibly deep character he seems. "That kind of life is beautiful too." He has simply idolised this persona of a character who has become so separate from the masses that he assumes every part of her is an amazing existence, even her isolation which we know was not her choice. It was indeed an interesting scene where we saw parallels between Moe during the walk and Magata to how she was at 13. It showed a curiosity with the world, a desire to be seen more as an adult, and an actual rather foolish (there is probably a better word) act of seduction to get closer to the elder man. Souhei is annoying, but Moe too is annoying as a spoiled and childish girl trying to make herself look more mature, and being rather manipulative. But they both feel annoying for human reasons, it feels like fully realised part of characters. Souhei's introspective look at society might have a place, it is important to reflect on things, but it kind of feels like he is doing it more out of a case of feeling special in an almost chuunibyou way. Moe kind of reflects what really may have gone wrong with Magata, Moe actually shows signs of being quite intelligent, but it seems to have come with some level of isolation from some societal norms, and kind of makes them see things as a game. Magata is really kind of an odd duck so far, not for what type of character is, but it is odd to quite place what her character is. Does she fall on the Souhei side in looking down on the masses, or on the Moe side in curiosity. Or is there a third option. Would a 12 year old actually receive such a sentence for being convicted of murder? Is she actually dangerous beyond being pretty smart? |
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Keichitsu0305
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EP 1 & 2:
In terms of atmosphere, I'm totally sold on the show. But, I'm afraid its gonna fall on its face soon. There's something truly eerie in how Souhei idolizes Magata's isolation. Previously, he talked about how being around other people makes you behave stupider so you can "be on their level" yet, acts like a drooling fan on the possibility of meeting Magata. Now I'm more convinced that not only he's talking out of his butt, but that Souhei appears dissatisfied with something. For me, Moe is annoying only when she feigns ignorance like the yakisoba (she's a college student but never eaten the stuff even with friends???) or pretending to have a headache to get inside the building. The parallel conversations of Moe talking to Souhei along with a young Magata speaking to (whom I presume is) the director driving in the car, also comes off as creepy. Not in a sexual way like "Oh, the old dude is getting turned on by a 13 year old girl pretending to be an adult" but, that he appears to objectifying her in a way more common way where as Souhei and other scholars objectify her as a pure, holy intellect. Moe and Magata both talk about how they "want to see the ocean" which, if strictly symbolic, could mean they want to venture out into the world. For Moe, getting into Souhei's pants but, for Magata it might be more sinister like commiting an act that would appear undiginifed for her high status. ...or it could be a high brow metaphor for how otaku's ruin everything like Perfect Blue. IDK, I just want someone to die already. |
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Galap
Moderator
Posts: 2354 |
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One other thing I noticed in ep 1: When young Magata is asking about life and death, and she's looking at the christmas tree with flashing lights, and her (as of yet I believe unnamed) caretaker who I think is Moe's father says that 'it was always flashing between life and death', that's a reference to cells in conway's life and how the cells flicker between life and death, sometimes regularly, and sometimes chaotically depending on the pattern.
Another general thing, in the ED, one image used is that of a set of objects arranged at the intersection of two consecutive Fibonacci numbers of spirals, like plants evolved this pattern for maximal packing: 
So Episode 2: I think there's more to that doll thing than meets the eye. Also with Magata as a general statement. Since no one has seen her for 15 years, that's the perfect setup for something to be going on, like it was never her in there, or maybe she is (wild guess) some kind of AI that the real Magata created, and the real Magata is what the AI calls the 'doll' that killed the parents. It's clear to me that something is going on. Why the 'doll' on a robotic cart? Complete with flashing lights? That whole scene and imagery was pretty cool, but it also made me laugh. Nishinosono's weird duplicity is interesting. I somehow don't think she's faking her shelteredness and naiivete about food and stuff like that-- I somehow doubt for example she brought all that luggage just to troll everyone. Then again maybe she did, and maybe she is faking the shelteredness as well. She's clearly very smart and knowledgeable in other ways. I'm not sure yet. There's clearly more to her than meets the eye. Her being so hell bent on going into that lab and talk to Magata is definitely more than her just trying to impress Sohei. I'm not sure that that's young Magata we're seeing. Didn't the show mention she had a younger sister? That may have been the lab director going to get her? That was a really strange parallel in the conversation, between Nishinosono and young Magata/Magata's sister. It's clear that while they were saying the same thing, they were doing so for different reasons. And not. They were both genuinely curious about seeing the sea and in general wanting to have experiences, but they also had ulterior motives, in that they wanted to become more adult It's interesting that they're trying to do so not just by doing 'adult' things like smoking and drinking, but also by simply gaining experiences, since to me the main difference between children and adults is basically the amount of experiences that person has had. Them wanting to drink and smoke to look adult is childish, but wanting to accumulate experiences and memories, like of looking up at a train bridge from below, is actually very wise. But their motives are also different. Nishinosono wants to get with Souhei, and I'm not sure what Magata/Magata's sister wants. She seems to want to get with her companion as well, but that seems like a different kind of thing, and there's more to it than that. While I don't agree with some of Souhei's philosophy, I have to say I think he's a lot 'deeper' than people are giving him credit for. He knows what he's interested in, and he only wants to engage in things that interest him. There's a lot of stuff that he really doesn't care about, and for him not caring about something is a strong statement. I can understand that, and even get behind it to some extent. And I know what he means when he says 'that kind of life is beautiful'. I'm not sure I agree, but I definitely understand. There is some elegence in being unfettered with base interactions with other people and being free to think about and pursue whatever you want intellectually. I don't think we're supposed to be a priori agreeing or disagreeing completely with the worldviews of any of the characters at this point. I for one am content to sit back and make my own judgments based on how things play out. They all seem to have their strengths and their shortcomings to me at this point. So that brings us to the big question: what exactly do they research here on this island? It seems like there was an implication it was some kind of computer science. Heavy security and seclusion for just that. Again seems to me that there's a lot more going on here than there might naiively seem. |
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vonPeterhof
Posts: 729 |
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Anyway, I was also thinking about Magata's sister and that the scenes in the car might have actually been showing her and not Magata in the past, but the final narration by the older guy made me doubt that. It sounded like he was reflecting on events that had happened long ago and had already produced regrettable results. But then, for all we know this could be intentionally misleading framing, so we'll just have to wait and see. |
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