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Answerman - What's Wrong With Fan Translations?

On the topic of memes and pop culture references, sometimes they have to be interchanged to make sense to an audience. Translation notes are not an option in most anime and games. For example... "I'm a Downtown Napoleon." Makes no sense, right? But if you read into the Japanese culture clues (which even many of my Japanese friends didn't get), Downtown Napoleon is a brand of sake that's cheap, strong, and common. By replacing this in a joke with something like, Jack Daniels (cheap, common, strong), you're able to connect with an audience of a different culture.

The series itself is from the early 90s, but the DVD release in question is from 2013.

'Downtown Napoleon' is an 'English translation' (jokingly done by Japanese people) of the catchphrase 'Shitamachi no Napoléon' printed by the Sanwa Shurui company on the labels of some of their liquors.

Speaking of references, what about subtle puns and hints that are always in Japanese character names? For instance, Mikuru's (from Haruhi) name uses the alternate pronunciation of the kanji for 'future' (mirai), alluding to her true identity as a time traveler. Japanese audiences would pick up on this fact. Should she be named "Future"?

As for insert songs not getting translated? That I see as a whole separate (if related) issue, and I'd agree that it is a more common problem. Of course, some of those insert songs have lyrics so lame that they are probably better off not being translated. . .

hyojodoji wrote:

'Downtown Napoleon' is an 'English translation' (jokingly done by Japanese people) of the catchphrase 'Shitamachi no Napoléon' printed by the Sanwa Shurui company on the labels of some of their liquors.

Cool story. (Being totally serious)

^^ I actually kind of liked the "Just because you're correct doesn't mean you're right" line because it's wordplay on the shades of meaning each of the words can carry. Practically or objectively correct and morally right aren't always the same. And this discussion, as you suggested, is also a prime example - just because it's a correct translation doesn't mean it's the right translation. So that line to me was actually food for thought about what he was saying so succinctly.

The lovely folks at Sparkler Monthly just did a podcast that includes a bit of discussion on this subject. Most of the panelists were current or former manga editors who heard their share of complaints. My favorite was that the official translation flowed too easily. Somebody actually thought that human beings speaking should be stilted and awkward, because translation or whatever.

That, or they were grasping at straws to justify their piracy, which is another, entirely separate discussion.

This was a thing? Seriously? How did that happen?

@WingKing

I'm not sure who actually listens to those vinyl albums they are selling now, but I seriously doubt it is people who had to deal with those things back in the day. When CDs became affordable, I couldn't wait to replace as much of my collection as possible. The only difference I ever heard between digital and analog was the absence of pops, clicks and hiss on the digital side. The only advantage to vinyl albums is the size of the cover art.

Since we're talking about fan translations, I'll just leave this here. http://onepiece.wikia.com/wiki/User%3AKaido_King_of_the_Beasts/Hall_of_Mangapanda

I have my own preferences and extensive thoughts on the issue, but perhaps I'll save those for another time. Right now, it seems that the fansubs and official subs are swapping roles - with fansubs becoming more liberal and official subs becoming more literal. (I love how the dub of Beyond the Boundary kept the term "Youmu" when fansubs were making every excuse to sub it.)

The column made a really big point about the advantages of the professional translators, but I think it ignored a very important advantage 'some' fan translators have: they are fans.

What I mean is that context is incredibly important when trying to translate something. Being very familiar with a work in advance can clue you in to what a line is really saying. Considering how many series coming out are either adaptions of LN / manga or sequels / spinoffs, I don't think that advantage should be ignored.

The only issue I ever tend to have with official translations is when they get rid of "-san" and the like. There are times when the "onee-chan" thing comes up, but I'd say it reads more awkwardly if they keep in "big sister" than just having the sister's name.

I don't know many English speakers that refer to their sibling that way, beyond the first time you meet their sibling(s).

Absolutely. I see a lot of comments about translations treating it almost like a math equation where they see X, think X=Y, and any answer but Y is wrong. However, like you said, it is really more like creative writing.

Not to get too far on a tangent, but this topic, I believe, is an extension of the prevailing anti-professional culture that is growing in western, particularly American, culture at the moment. It is the basic idea that anyone that has "professional" as a title is somehow inherently corrupted or discourteous or uninformed relative to the layman. I won't speculate on motivations, but I would say it isn't only in the question of fan subs vs pro subs. This is just the latest (relatively speaking) in a growing minutia of layman who decry so-called experts.

Though I just hate seeing stuff localised to the point that its Japaneseness is all filled off. Its especially true of shows that are set in Japan or about Japanese people. Dropping how people greet each other and what things/people are called are important there.

I don't want to see kotatsu simply called heaters. Or foods all renamed to something non Japanese.

Being somewhat new to anime/manga I feel like disputing the whole 'it makes it easier for newbies' argument. I certainly didn't find the use of Japanese terms a barrier, if anything it got me more interested and led me down the rabbit hole of reading books about Japan.

In my opinion another reason that fans complain about the official translations is that they're just out there looking for a fight, whether they are having a bad day or they think that their intellect is superior to the professionals they are just asking for trouble.

I can understand wanting to play it safe, but are they that alien though? Hollywood movies always feel the need to make every Japanese character ever, refer to others with honorifics. "Wax on, wax off, Danniel-san!" As annoying and racist as that is, it shows that people aren't beyond understanding what it means.

But, with regard to your point of people not understanding what it means, why are you leaving kotatsu in? It can be translated as "heated table". I would argue that dish names like onigiri are culture specific too. Besides, they do get used in the English language (in restaurants and such). Heck, there was a Food Network segment about spam musubi. What about takoyaki? Okonomiyaki? Pocari Sweat? Calpis? No one outside of Japan will know what these are, but do you need to translate/localize them? A quick Google search will tell you that takoyaki are octopus balls and that Calpis is a of brand carbonated soft drink.

Take a look at British shows. Do they change ‘torch’ to ‘flashlight’ or ‘car park’ to ‘parking lot’ or ‘bangers and mash’ to ‘sausages and mashed potatoes’? Nope. Yes, you could make the argument that it’s still English, but people outside the UK get stumped by the colloquialisms and cultural references all the same. Wanna enjoy them to the fullest? Tough luck, you gotta get yourself immersed in the culture. Yet, when it comes to other languages, we feel the need to spoon-feed the viewer by transforming everything into something familiar and relatable.

Part of the problem is that since translation is their hobby they seem to like to talk about the Encoding, File Size, how the other groups name their file, quality of certain translated lines, and etc. its nice talking about what you like, but that takes up time they could be talking about the show itself.

"My balls aren't here" = R1 script

I take it the thumbnail for the article came from an actual fan translation? If so, it's both funny and cringey at the same time.

SilverTalon01 wrote:

Cool story. (Being totally serious)

In the example I was giving, I translated Downtown Napoleon on my own, but in the original Japanese script, it was just "Shitamachi Napoelon." So no, that's not a joke on the Japanese side of things...

I've met people who listen to vinyls FOR the pops, clicks, and hisses.

I'd guess it's pretty similar to how some people like watching silent films [...].