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The X Button - Vanishing Point


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Paiprince



Joined: 21 Dec 2013
Posts: 593
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 3:46 am Reply with quote
leafy sea dragon wrote:


We don't live in a free market. We live in a regulated market. Free markets would be stuff like the illegal drug trade or poaching.

Blockades are exceedingly rare nowadays (and generally aren't used except in wartime situations), but tariffs exist as an anti-monopolistic measure on a global scale: Different countries can produce the same goods at different prices (whether due to differences in local availability of raw materials, in price of labor, in business laws preventing particular methods of manufacture, in culture, or local economies--you can see the starkness in the prevalence of outsourcing), so as to protect a country from some other country that could otherwise run roughshod over the world in some particular industry (a major case being automobiles). Tariffs are also used to shield a country as it recovers economically by encouraging (but not requiring) a country's populace to buy domestically-produced goods, which was commonplace after World War II.


Now that's the extreme side of it. What I meant by free market is the benefit of products to come and go as they wish without restrictions. I know there's still some form of regulation in the form of MSRP's and ratings and what have you.

On the subject of tariffs, this is where I stand on the other side of the fence. I am an importer and tariffs are excess expense on my part as a consumer. Where does this taxation actually go? It certainly isn't benefiting the ordinary consumer, directly or indirectly. On a more global scale, it encourages protectionism and limits foreign investments that can benefit laggard economies. Protectionism has become one of the causes of inequality and strife worldwide by forcing natives to only buy "local" thus driving competition and quality down.

I'll leave it at this because I don't want to veer this into another tangent.
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Primus



Joined: 01 Mar 2006
Posts: 2761
Location: Toronto
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 4:42 am Reply with quote
Enner wrote:
It is important to keep in mind that there is still a lot of work and money to be done after that with an English dub, ratings submission, QA, packaging, shipping, and other stuff for a USA retail release. While some would like to discount the cost of full localization and release, I think reality vastly defers. Now maybe you can get away with a Japanese-voice-overs-only release for GameStop. I've been assuming that you can't get away with that with Best Buy, Target, Walmart, etc., though I would like to know if that isn't the case anymore.


The Dynasty Warriors games, which are from Koei Tecmo, don't get English dubs anymore and they don't see to have much of an issue getting retail support. Even if there were retail issues, it's 2015. It's not expensive to publish a game exclusively through the PlayStation Store. If they wanted to, they could even do a limited physical run through NIS America. Both of which are avenues Koei Tecmo's US branch has used in the past. The fact that DOAX3 isn't getting that much gives some credibility to their fears not being sales based.

Of course, this may be a long con marketing scheme. Only time will tell on that front.
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Manwards



Joined: 26 Jul 2009
Posts: 194
Location: Leicester, England
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 5:13 am Reply with quote
Deus257 wrote:
K-T will win in the end because they got free publicity and people will buy it, including my friend who still thinks he can get Leifang and Hitomi to kiss in the game even though I always tell him it will never happen.


Try telling him that Leifang isn't even in it this time. She wasn't popular enough to make the cut. If there was a mini-game where Marie-Rose and Honoka could get drunk and kiss, though... kyaaaaa~
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Lili-Hime



Joined: 05 Jun 2014
Posts: 569
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 5:42 am Reply with quote
It's kind of funny to see people claim women are a 'vocal minority' when we make up 51% of the population. Myself and other women are against actual censorship as much as the next person. Just because we'd like the culture to be a little more inclusive doesn't mean we're gonna play big sister and take all the booby games away.

The poster who said feminists are being used as a boogyman was right on. Especially in this case. Game companies give all sorts of dumb excuses not to release games..."Americans don't like anime games", "Americans only like 3D games", "Americans don't like RPGS", etc... Blaming feminists or western attitudes is a great way for them to divert fan's rage away from them and onto other people. Let's not also forget that apparently they've added a more loli looking character... and THAT is probably going to cause more backlash than anything. The west has a much lower tolerance for anything resembling sexualizing children* than Asian countries do.

Also being alarmist about censorship is downright silly. It's not censorship, you can buy the game or watch it streamed or w/e you want. You just have to buy it online instead of walking into Wal Mart. Having to pay extra for shipping or import costs or w/e =/= censorship. It's not like Obama's going to come to your house and snap the disc in half. Criticism is not suppression or censorship. You may as well say critics are 'censoring' Adam Sandler by giving his movies bad reviews due to the immature humor

*Or prepubscent adolescents, w/e. Making a character 18 or a 1000 year old vampire/demon doesn't change the fact they look 11.
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Rensie



Joined: 02 Sep 2011
Posts: 251
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 6:35 am Reply with quote
Lili-Hime wrote:
Also being alarmist about censorship is downright silly. It's not censorship, you can buy the game or watch it streamed or w/e you want. You just have to buy it online instead of walking into Wal Mart. Having to pay extra for shipping or import costs or w/e =/= censorship. It's not like Obama's going to come to your house and snap the disc in half. Criticism is not suppression or censorship. You may as well say critics are 'censoring' Adam Sandler by giving his movies bad reviews due to the immature humor

*Or prepubscent adolescents, w/e. Making a character 18 or a 1000 year old vampire/demon doesn't change the fact they look 11.


And also don't change the fact that these "characters" are fictional, non-existent, and don't resemble at all a human being in the first place, amirite?
Polygons and bitmaps cgi generated images don't have any human rights, therefore you can sexualize inanimate objects as much as you want.
Anime style in particular, is far from resemble a real human being since is very stylized and disproportioned art. Unless you are one of these twisted people who think that fiction = reality.

You lose all your credibility whit this silly and redundant argoument, expecially because nobody force you to support or buy these games, and your life wont never change if these "sexualized" games exist or not.

I still think that people like you that care too much what other people create or play (at their home), people who care about social justice, internet trolls, crusaders, whatever, are the main cause of the increase of censorship in anime and jrpg games.
And this derail attention from matters where real people should be protected to fictional and futile media that hurt no one but entertain a niche of players. It also force everyone into the same midset where few people dictate what other can or not see.
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SHD



Joined: 05 Apr 2015
Posts: 1752
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 7:32 am Reply with quote
Rensie wrote:
And also don't change the fact that these "characters" are fictional, non-existent, and don't resemble at all a human being in the first place, amirite?

Also don't change the fact that these works are both byproducts and perpetuations of a culture and certain attitudes that very much exist in real life and have an effect on real people.

Seriously, stop creating strawmen. It's not the fictional characters and polygon constructs that people are worried about.

Rensie wrote:
I still think that people like you that care too much what other people create or play (at their home), people I disagree with politically, internet trolls, crusaders, whatever, are the main cause of the increase of censorship in anime and jrpg games.

Yeah, god forbid that, ah, a woman might watch a mainstream anime or play a game, and not be exposed to constant pandering to male viewers and female characters being used for fanservice.

Rensie wrote:
And this derail attention from matters where real people should be protected to fictional and futile media that hurt no one but entertain a niche of players. It also force everyone into the same midset where few people dictate what other can or not see.

It's so funny that every time someone challenges the kind of view that people like you have, it's "derailing attention from really important things". Apparently the really important things are "everything that doesn't directly affect our privileges."
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meiam



Joined: 23 Jun 2013
Posts: 3442
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 9:21 am Reply with quote
Paiprince wrote:
Chagen46 wrote:
WEL wrote:


the fact that this forum itself is programmed to replace "a person I disagree with politically" to "a person I disagree with", it's prove enough of how cancerous they are to every and any community.


It's filtered because it has lost all meaning and is now used solely by reactionaries like you as a snarl word for anyone left of Hitler.

You made your bed, now lie in it.


Mods, better put Chagen on the watch list too. He's trying to instigate something. Smile


You know that's not going to happen, just like you apparently made your bed, it's pretty clear the mod have made there's too and are coming hard on one side of the discussion. Rolling Eyes
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Rensie



Joined: 02 Sep 2011
Posts: 251
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 9:38 am Reply with quote
SHD wrote:
Also don't change the fact that these works are both byproducts and perpetuations of a culture and certain attitudes that very much exist in real life and have an effect on real people.


Just speculations created to bash anime, manga and games, the new easy scapegoat to sanitize the world, or maybe you are one of the people who believe that GTA, CoD and Quake are responsible of the school assaults in some us states?

Quote:
Seriously, stop creating strawmen. It's not the fictional characters and polygon constructs that people are worried about.


How not? If you consider these polygons not real then what the original creator let them do isn't real too.

Quote:
Yeah, god forbid that, ah, a woman might watch a mainstream anime or play a game, and not be exposed to constant pandering to male viewers and female characters being used for fanservice.


Nothing wrong with it, games are art, art can be sexist and objectify polygons and fictional characters too because they are, well, inanimate objects.

If a woman don't like it nobody force her to play or watch it, she have the freedom to play or watch something else, there are several games and anime for every taste.

These sexy games are a niche even in asia, so why you care about a niche? Why you want deny these games to people who enjoy them?

Quote:
It's so funny that every time someone challenges the kind of view that people like you have, it's "derailing attention from really important things". Apparently the really important things are "everything that doesn't directly affect our privileges."


And yours, since you have the freedom, like i have, to not watch or play what we don't like or like without forcing censorship or alterations to the original concept. Live your life and let me live mine.
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Souther



Joined: 22 Feb 2015
Posts: 602
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 10:05 am Reply with quote
whiskeyii wrote:


I admit, DLC is an issue I'd have never thought of. In that case, I guess you'd have to hope for something like DOA5's Last Round where the DLC comes bundled with the main game. Though, to be fair, I can't tell if Last Round was spurred on by surprisingly good sales or what; I'm way outside of fighting game communities. But it sounds like a rough equivalent of triple-A company "Game of the Year" editions for games that sell very well.


Well, it's a well-known fighting game series with a loyal fanbase, including a competitive scene (online and offline, and on consoles/arcades, etc.) that'll support the game through tournaments and streams long-term. So it's a good idea to release balance patches/installments with new content to keep them playing and spending more.

As for DOAXV3, I've not see its fans or detractors making much noise about it until now. Whether Tecmo thought it was down to current trends and tastes in the Western market or not, they felt the demand wasn't there either way, unlike DOA5. IMO, I think it's because they have more to work with when it comes to DOA5, compared to DOAXV, due to the reasons I put up above. Someone mentioned Dragon's Crown, it may have gotten some notice due to the controversy, but it's also an incredibly fun and gorgeous game with a lot of longevity plus multiplayer. I miss that game, I want a sequel.
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Rensie



Joined: 02 Sep 2011
Posts: 251
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 10:30 am Reply with quote
Dragon Crown as long as Odin Sphere are my preferred Vanillaware games.
Can't wait to buy Odin Sphere HD pc version, hopefully they will consider Dragon Crown as well.
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Rivailloli



Joined: 05 Jun 2013
Posts: 562
Location: Virginia
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 10:37 am Reply with quote
I had never even heard of this Dead or Alive stuff until this "controversy" happened. People I knew were suddenly fans of this series and loved every installment or something after this. I find it rather amusing.

Either way, I don't care really. The company decided not to bring it over. End of discussion. You want it? Import it. I've had to do that for BL games. You don't see me crying about companies 'censoring' them by not bringing them over.

Rensie wrote:


And also don't change the fact that these "characters" are fictional, non-existent, and don't resemble at all a human being in the first place, amirite?
Polygons and bitmaps cgi generated images don't have any human rights, therefore you can sexualize inanimate objects as much as you want.
Anime style in particular, is far from resemble a real human being since is very stylized and disproportioned art. Unless you are one of these twisted people who think that fiction = reality.

You lose all your credibility whit this silly and redundant argoument, expecially because nobody force you to support or buy these games, and your life wont never change if these "sexualized" games exist or not.

I still think that people like you that care too much what other people create or play (at their home), people I disagree with politically, internet trolls, crusaders, whatever, are the main cause of the increase of censorship in anime and jrpg games.
And this derail attention from matters where real people should be protected to fictional and futile media that hurt no one but entertain a niche of players. It also force everyone into the same midset where few people dictate what other can or not see.


What are you even going on about? This literally has nothing to do with what lili-hime was saying. Like I know reading is hard, but come on man. Take a minute to reflect on it before you go off on a tangent that is non-existent in the other person's post.
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Mr.Shonen



Joined: 13 Aug 2006
Posts: 269
Location: Brooklyn, NY
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 10:41 am Reply with quote
mewpudding101 wrote:
I'm really sick of people labeling women as "social justice warriors" and "moral warriors" and "feminazis" and putting the blame of anything in the industry on them. It's really toxic.

I'm absolutely for women's rights in video gaming, as a gamer since youth. I can even be called a feminist. But that doesn't mean I'm going to take all your happiness eat your children or something. Throwing the blame on a group of people who aren't even an organization like this is really childish and pretty disheartening. Makes me sad to work in the video game industry and be thought of like this.


Uh huh. But when it's on the flip side, it's okay to throw around misogynistic M.R.A. neckbeard man children and use it as ammo in the blame game about the lack of diversity/female players in gaming.
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whiskeyii



Joined: 29 May 2013
Posts: 2245
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 11:20 am Reply with quote
Mr.Shonen wrote:

Uh huh. But when it's on the flip side, it's okay to throw around misogynistic M.R.A. neckbeard man children and use it as ammo in the blame game about the lack of diversity/female players in gaming.


Do folks outside of sensationalist media still do this? It's hard for me to remember how folks outside the gaming industry view gamers by and large.

There have been a lot more articles lately that point to reluctant publishers with an old-fashioned mindset as the real culprits behind this issue. The Last of Us, Bioshock Infinite, and Remember Me all spring to mind as easy examples of this, and I can only imagine how much more of it goes on behind the scenes that's just never outwardly addressed.
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ValwinZ



Joined: 27 Nov 2015
Posts: 5
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 11:59 am Reply with quote
SHD wrote:

Yeah, god forbid that, ah, a woman might watch a mainstream anime or play a game, and not be exposed to constant pandering to male viewers and female characters being used for fanservice.


Well that Woman should learn how to pick anime and stop trying to ruin it for everyone else I dont like certain types of things so i dont watch then. is simple.

Censorship is bad no matter how small it is it implies with need someone to filter things for us. that's never good.

Somehow in the west extreme violence is ok but somehow a fictional character using a bikini is bad we should question why this is

and to say that a certain warrior group is not real is a plain lie.
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leafy sea dragon



Joined: 27 Oct 2009
Posts: 7163
Location: Another Kingdom
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 12:51 pm Reply with quote
whiskeyii wrote:
Do folks outside of sensationalist media still do this? It's hard for me to remember how folks outside the gaming industry view gamers by and large.


As I am a gamer who knows very few other gamers offline, I've met enough non-gamers to get an overall impression. It got a lot more complicated after the Wii though, as everyone knows the Wii is a video game system.

When talking about non-Nintendo systems, the most common stereotypes of video gamers I see, depending on the location, is either the high-school or college-age dudebro who subsists on pizza, Mountain Dew, and marijuana; or children and tweens looking to find the next gorefest. Both of these stereotypes, in turn, stereotype video games by their violence, not their sexual content. For a video game to be sexually suggestive the way the DOAX games have been is largely unheard of (barring Lara Croft). The neckbeards, manchildren, and such are more closely associated with comic books, science fiction, and figurine-based tabletop gaming.

In other word, the public perception of these people is strongly influenced by how they're depicted in mass media (with that video gamer stereotype based on how they're depicted in video game commercials...and commercials for food and drink aimed at video gamers).
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