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Red Fox of Fire wrote:

What censorship? Soleil's conversation was altered to be less creepy, but still retains the same general concept. Face petting is still in the game, just restricted to married couples. Even for someone with a more flimsy idea of the word "censorship," none of the localization changes that I've seen in this game can be called censorship. Some news outlets overstated what the changes were, which caused some backlash, but the actual product is good.

People who say they won't buy the game for a reason like censorship either don't have their priorities straight or were probably looking for reasons to not buy the game in the first place.

Editing for content is censorship, and it is also localization.

Fans in the west are being denied content, because other fans might find it offensive. That is the very definition of censorship.

Just because censorship is not important to you, doesn't mean other fans who do think it is important, are just faking their interest in the game.

johnnysasaki wrote:

all this talk about Chun-Li makes me think about one thing:
Has anybody here ever seen Street Fighter 2 Animated Movie?I will feel like an old geezer sorrounded by kids if nobody here remembers it...

Street Fighter Animated Movie was one of my very first anime lol. The fights, especially Ryu vs Fei Long's still fresh in my mind. And yeah, perhaps Bengus had to pump out a lot of artwork in a short amount of time, but honestly, I've not been a fan of his art-style post MVC2 for a while now. His previous art style was godly.

TarsTarkas wrote:

Red Fox of Fire wrote:

What censorship? Soleil's conversation was altered to be less creepy, but still retains the same general concept. Face petting is still in the game, just restricted to married couples. Even for someone with a more flimsy idea of the word "censorship," none of the localization changes that I've seen in this game can be called censorship. Some news outlets overstated what the changes were, which caused some backlash, but the actual product is good.

People who say they won't buy the game for a reason like censorship either don't have their priorities straight or were probably looking for reasons to not buy the game in the first place.

Editing for content is censorship, and it is also localization.

Fans in the west are being denied content, because other fans might find it offensive. That is the very definition of censorship.

Just because censorship is not important to you, doesn't mean other fans who do think it is important, are just faking their interest in the game.

If you're going to stand on a slippery slope and claim that the very act of localization is analogous to censorship, you may as well outright claim "No game should ever be brought to the US and we should just import the Japanese version for the TRUE experience!".

It's Subs versus Dubs all over again, with the same ridiculous elitist attitudes towards publishers because they did stuff we don't like.

Levitz9 wrote:

If you're going to stand on a slippery slope and claim that the very act of localization is analogous to censorship, you may as well outright claim "No game should ever be brought to the US and we should just import the Japanese version for the TRUE experience!".

It's Subs versus Dubs all over again, with the same ridiculous elitist attitudes towards publishers because they did stuff we don't like.

I don't think that's what TarsTarkas meant because I have the same view. Not all localization is censorship, but localization is censorship when content is cut in order not to offend people which is the case here.

Also, LOL at the comment about Nintendo's changes being reasonable. Cutting bikinis that are no worse than what you see at the beach is reasonable now? I'll give the Soleil thing a pass. The silly face petting game is cut. No, it's not restricted to married couples. It's cut completely. What is still in is poking your spouse awake which isn't the same as the skinship minigame. The minigame is silly, but it's even sillier to cut it because the usual suspects were freaking out about it.

Nintendo's nearly dead to me because of their censorship-happy decisions lately. I'm questioning whether I even want to buy ANYTHING off of them anymore including consoles.

Levitz9 wrote:

Do people think Nintendo's Treehouse and Nintendo of Japan are completely different entities that have no common link, and that Treehouse just wants to ruin everything while the Pure, True Nintendo of Japan is some battered housewife?

Y-yes? Nintendo of Japan makes what they want and then NoA changes it when they release it in the west if it's too extreme for western audiences. Nintendo of Japan doesn't subscribe to the family friendly attitude Nintendo of America does. If they did then the games would't need to be censored in the first place, and they wouldn't do things like make anime figures or hire famous hentai artists to do artwork for Fire Emblem for promotion.

Levitz9 wrote:

Truth. I'd be surprised if there were more than thirty minutes of VO in Fates--and even then, a good sixty percent would just be grunts, yelps and screams. I won't say people shouldn't care about it, but it hardly seems like an essential element. Heck, even if what you want is "authenticity", it feels questionable: it's not like this is some bootleg of some other Fire Emblem: Fates.

Datamining has shown that less than half of the voiced dialog is being kept for the US version.

https://i.sli.mg/d41KJ3.jpg

So while there might be far less dialog in the American version, you can say this shouldn't be the case in the first place. Besides, would you rather have Miyuki Sawashiro, veteran seiyuu legend voicing Camilla, or someone's grandma?

Levitz9 wrote:

It's Subs versus Dubs all over again, with the same ridiculous elitist attitudes towards publishers because they did stuff we don't like.

It's more like Subs VS 4Kids dubs in this case. You're not defending an mediocre-but-passable average dub here, you're defending the kind of dubs that skip episodes, cut violence and fanservice, removed original music, and gets released as a dub-only English release.

I don't see the big deal if people have issues with this. If someone doesn't mind all this then they're more than welcome to buy it, but it shouldn't be surprising when people do have issues with a company's practices and don't support it and to say they're just overreacting. You'd think an anime community of all things would know the frustration when a localization company botches something you like up.

Chester McCool wrote:

Besides, would you rather have Miyuki Sawashiro, veteran seiyuu legend voicing Camilla, or someone's grandma?

To add salt to the wound, it has been revealed that none of the English VAs for the Western debut of Fates had received any context of the characters they voiced thanks to a lax director.

strawberry-kun wrote:

Also, LOL at the comment about Nintendo's changes being reasonable. Cutting bikinis that are no worse than what you see at the beach is reasonable now?

talking about that, I have read that several bikini-like outfits got cut form the game, as in in japanese playthorugh the game shows 4 outfit options and the english one only shows the towel; has that been confirmed?

maximilianjenus wrote:

talking about that, I have read that several bikini-like outfits got cut form the game, as in in japanese playthorugh the game shows 4 outfit options and the english one only shows the towel; has that been confirmed?

The last I heard, some or all of them have been cut based on streams from GameSpot and Gamexplain. We don't know which since Nintendo is freaking horrible at communicating anything.

EDIT: After looking it up again, yep, it seems like all except the bath towel are confirmed out. Nintendo gonna Nintendo Rolling Eyes

Chester McCool wrote:

It's more like Subs VS 4Kids dubs in this case. You're not defending an mediocre-but-passable average dub here, you're defending the kind of dubs that skip episodes, cut violence and fanservice, removed original music, and gets released as a dub-only English release.

No levels were removed. No cutscenes were removed. No DLC is being barred from localization. No characters are removed. No bosses, weapons, only a few sprites, a few changed lines of dialogue, and a language track.

It'd be one thing if we were talking about something like Revelatons: Persona VS Persona: Be True To Your Mind, but jesus christ people, you really want to make this about "poor, victimized gamers" and "tyrannical" Nintendo. Hell, it'd be one thing if it was some other company licensing Fire Emblem: Fates, but this was all done by Nintendo to their own game under their own permission.

I give up, the mind of the constantly persecuted just boggles me. Maybe I'll go become a "real" gamer so I can pretend everyone is out to get me. 'scuse me, I gots Mountain Dew to chug.

Last edited by BadNewsBlues on Fri Feb 19, 2016 9:37 pm; edited 1 time in total

Renasviel wrote:

Also, and it seems people defending splitting this into three games have not considered this, what about the people who don't, shock horror, have a great internet connection? What about the ones who can't download games over the internet, either because of data restrictions or a poor connection, or those who have no internet connection at all?[

What about them?

Renasviel wrote:

So what? They'll have to pay full price for both Birthright and Conquest, and even then, they just aren't able to get access to the "true" path, Revelations. The full story just isn't accessible for them. They don't get a choice.

Each game is a full story on it's own and you're not mandated in anyway to get all three. Why people keep insisting upon this is a mystery to me. But it seems to me they're doing this simply because they're mad they can't get all the content at a price that ironically many of them don't even wanna spend.

Renasviel wrote:

Apparently, people who think that what Nintendo has done is fair don't care about these people.

Considering some of these people wind up making themselves come off as entitled, whiny, & stingy.....they're not really doing enough to make people empathize with them.

Renasviel wrote:

They agree that they deserve to be shafted to one side, unable to get the full experience.

They're choosing to shaft themselves either by being too cheap to spring for internet.......while allegedly having no internet access. Or because they want a game that's already cheap enough at 40 dollars to drop down even lower. Or because of some more ridiculous reason like the game's lack of dual audio or Nihon accurate script.

Renasviel wrote:

Even if each of the three games is 100 hours worth of content, it's considerably less than one game with 300 hours of content,

I'm not getting the logic here a game that clocks in at over 100 hours of gameplay is somehow worse off than a game that clocks in at over 300 hours gameplay?

This...this doesn't make sense. Incidentally more doesn't always equal better.

Renasviel wrote:

Nintendo have split the game up, to get as much money as possible.

Actually if Nintendo wanted to make the most money possible they could've chosen to sell each version of the game for 40 dollars instead of the actual 80 that people can spend if they want to own all three games.

Renasviel wrote:

and people think that just because each of the three may be long by themselves, it's totally fine.

Ummmm yeah because not everyone is going to buy all three or if they happen to get the special edition play through all three.

Renasviel wrote:

I'm getting 100 hours out of each game so it's more than enough", but that ignores the fact that this should be a 300 hour game that Nintendo have chosen to milk out and squeeze the fanbase to make them pay at least double for the whole lot.

I'm confused you said that the length of the game doesn't matter but then try to argue that the game not being 300 hours do to it being split into and sold as three separate game's is an issue.

Renasviel wrote:

I just hope people defending Nintendo's decision for this come to realise that it affects more than just outside of your own little bubble.

It affects a very small group of people within a fanbase that's considerably smaller than that of Nintendo's other ips.

Mr. Oshawott wrote:

To add salt to the wound, it has been revealed that none of the English VAs for the Western debut of Fates had received any context of the characters they voiced thanks to a lax director.

Seems to be some conflicting info
http://nichegamer.com/2016/02/nintendo-gives-practically-no-information-to-english-voice-actors/

I'd also not give these "Torrential Downpour" folks any recognition if I were you.

BadNewsBlues wrote:

Renasviel wrote:

First off, some people like dual audio. It was in Awakening, it should be in here. If you don't care for it then fine, but it's a preference, and you don't get to say what people should have a preference for or not. At the end of the day, it's up to the people buying the game, not you, so get over yourselves.

Next, what's this about the special edition containing all the games on one cartridge? So this shows that all 3 could fit in one, so again, Nintendo have literally just split the game three ways and sold it as 3 separate games rather than release it as one large game. People saying that the special edition is "fantastic value for money" are missing the point, Nintendo have chosen to make more money out of their customers when it could be all one game. They are as bad as EA and Capcom and whatever nowadays, and that's just sad.

Yeah because everyone has a total of 120 hours or more to diperse across three games.

Uh, no? If people were short on time, it's probably not one of the games you would play? I don't see what that has to do with splitting the game up into 3 as opposed to leaving it in 1, like at all.

If it was in 3 or in 1, you can, if you want, play it in short bursts, just like you can if it's split across 3. What was your point here again?

Last edited by BadNewsBlues on Fri Feb 19, 2016 10:07 pm; edited 1 time in total

Renasviel wrote:

Uh, no? If people were short on time, it's probably not one of the games you would play?

They can play them at least when they're not at work, school, or hanging out with their friends and family. The point was is that you're making it seem like everyone should be upset at the fact that they can't play through all three games at the same time do to being split up when most of them likely wouldn't be able to invest 100 to 300 hours into one of these game let alone the crazy amount they'd have to invest for all three for the reason(s) I already mentioned.

BadNewsBlues wrote:

Renasviel wrote:

Uh, no? If people were short on time, it's probably not one of the games you would play?

They can play them at least when they're not at work, school, or hanging out with their friends and family. The point was is that you're making it seem like everyone buying this game should be upset at the fact that they can't play through all three games at the same time when most of them likely wouldn't be able to invest that much time into one let alone all three games for the reason(s) I already mentioned.

People should be upset at the fact that what really should be one game is split into three, yes. No one said anything about them all being played at the same time. Indeed, chances are, you'll be going through it, one route at a time. Having all 3 routes in one game or having all 3 routes each in separate games doesn't really change that. If these games are as stand alone as we are to believe, then surely, if someone is lacking for time, they'd be able to make their way through each route, slowly, and not end up forgetting where they are in terms of the actual story. I'm not saying that they should be played all the time until 300 hours have been sunk into it. I'm saying it should all be released as one game. Again, nothing you've said shows why splitting it into three games is a benefit here.

Renasviel wrote:

If these games are as stand alone as we are to believe, then surely, if someone is lacking for time, they'd be able to make their way through each route, slowly, and not end up forgetting where they are in terms of the actual story.

Things happen though players lose interest after awhile or their game's get stolen or lost, or the save data gets corrupted. Not something you wanna have happen in an RPG much less a tactical RPG like Fire Emblem.

Renasviel wrote:

I'm not saying that they should be played all the time until 300 hours have been sunk into it. I'm saying it should all be released as one game. Again, nothing you've said shows why splitting it into three games is a benefit here.

By the same token though splitting the games isn't really a negative either.

Red Fox of Fire wrote:

Paiprince wrote:

Compared to Awakening, no not really. Censorship wise of course, both localized scripts are on the same level of taking literary liberties.

What censorship? Soleil's conversation was altered to be less creepy, but still retains the same general concept. Face petting is still in the game, just restricted to married couples. Even for someone with a more flimsy idea of the word "censorship," none of the localization changes that I've seen in this game can be called censorship. Some news outlets overstated what the changes were, which caused some backlash, but the actual product is good.

People who say they won't buy the game for a reason like censorship either don't have their priorities straight or were probably looking for reasons to not buy the game in the first place.

Yeah, because distilling it to make it "Western palatable" is so much better right? Sorry, but I'm not just going to accept this. Who are they to decide to what degree we are to be exposed to these elements? What are they trying to accomplish? NoA and Treehouse should be aware by now who buys these games. Sure, there are going to be those who'll cry foul over the intimacy mechanics, but most won't care. They're trying to make a big deal out of this while angering purists who just so happens make up a majority of the buyers.

You know what hurts even more? I can't just import the JP version unless I buy another handheld. They sure got me and several others by the balls here.

Levitz9 wrote:

I give up, the mind of the constantly persecuted just boggles me. Maybe I'll go become a "real" gamer so I can pretend everyone is out to get me. 'scuse me, I gots Mountain Dew to chug.

Mutual feeling towards those who are so easily pleased. If the haphazardly dub wasn't red flaggy enough for you, then you're in your own delusional world.

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