Forum - View topic
The Mike Toole Show - Grudge Match


Goto page 1, 2  Next

Note: this is the discussion thread for this article

Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
John Thacker



Joined: 28 Oct 2013
Posts: 532
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2016 12:29 pm Reply with quote
For team ups, there's always the Super Robot Wars games.

One amazing one was Scramble Wars , which was basically Wacky Races with Gall Force, Bubblegum Crisis, and Genesis Survivor Gaiarth characters. Animeigo released that as part of "SD Double Feature" with Ten Little Gall Force.

Mahou tsukai tai vs. Shamanic Princess was a short extra given to people who bought all the OVAs of Shamanic Princess, and is pretty wacky.

Recently there have been some TV crossover episodes, especially within Jump properties. Toriko started this way, with a visit from the One Piece Straw Hat Pirates, and a few other crossover episodes also happened. I can also think of Yatterman Night (with Speed Racer) and Tokyo ESP (with Ga Rei) as having this kind of cameo, which isn't quite a real team up in my opinion. Older ones include Yawara and her grandfather in Project Ako, Nuku Nuku in Geobreeders, Arale and Dr. Slump in DragonBall, even going to watch the Touch movie inside the Kimagure Orange Road movie.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
AkaRed



Joined: 13 Jan 2016
Posts: 187
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2016 1:29 pm Reply with quote
No comment on the One Piece x Toriko x Dragon Ball crossover ?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
penguintruth



Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Posts: 7384
Location: Penguinopolis
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2016 1:57 pm Reply with quote
I hate team ups of characters who exist in completely different worlds. It was one of the many, many reasons Lupin vs Conan was both unnecessary and terrible (not to mention creatively bankrupt). At least Batman and Superman have shared the same universe for decades, if not always the same exact corner of it. Who was actually asking for some of these other team ups/matches? I'm not looking for the Bebop crew versus the Outlaw Star crew or Friend Meets Johan, why should I want Cyborg 009 vs Devilman? Some crossovers are just completely transparent and overreaching gimmicks.

Lupin didn't have a theatrical movie for 17 years, and the first movie he got after that was a crossover that's a sequel to the same crossover from a terrible TV special? TMS can be such a shit show at times.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address My Anime My Manga
residentgrigo



Joined: 23 Dec 2007
Posts: 1366
Location: Germany
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2016 2:21 pm Reply with quote
Hulk Vs Wolverine (the Thor segment is forgettable) is the best team up on the list. Or the only truly good one? The V is indeed a court case thing. Bruce and Clark shared a bed when they first met on a cruse and Superman/Batman Annual #1 retold that story very well, so the devoice joke isn´t far off Wink . That annual even featured Deadpool in a way.
Bruce and Dick also slept in the same bed during the 50s but me and DC have moved on from that... Below is my amazon/Imdb review for BvS. I saw it twice and learned how to read German (i am an immigrant) with Batman and JLA comics in the 90s:

People fear what they don't understand
I consider Sucker Puch to be Snyder's only bad film, view the Ultimate Cut of Watchmen as one of the best adaptations of all time and adore the source material, so this film is tailor made for me. Especially due to my love for the utterly daring and highly polarizing Man of Steel. I also understand where some (but not all!) of the mixed reviews are coming from but share few of their opinions.
First with the bad:
The film has a few rather weird editing choices and some scenes, as the juicy Justice League montage, need to be placed differently. The film is also too short despite being 2,5 hours long.
I also expected a longer final battle, a proper introduction to Batman's power suit, a stronger acknowledgement of how much carnage the 2 cities undergo at the end and less cutaways from the constant violence in general. There is also 1 scene of Superman in peril too many towards the end but i won't go into spoilers. Some of these issues should be fixed with the longer/R-rated Director's cut and i would have preferred more Darkseide teasers. None of these complains took away from my enjoyment and i was BLOWN AWAY by everything else. The film features top of the line directing and the best score Hans Zimmer/Junkie XL ever composed. The well constructed script explained all the clashing ideologies very well and is downright Nolan-esque, due to the continues involvement of mastermind David S. Goyer. Every single performance is some of the finest acting the A-level cast put on film. Especially Jesse Eisenberg. His psychotic and utterly unhinged Lex Luthor outshines even Heath Ledger. Gal Gadot is another standout and shows how well cast and though out the whole DCU truly is. Now to the titular heroes:
Ben Affleck matches Christian Bale and Kevin Konroy as being a definitive take on the character but don't expect him to be "likable". His version is a Frank Miller Batman gone too far and the film is a clear redemption arc for the bitter warrior. Some will be turned off by his high body count and his deeply flawed tunnel vision but that is the whole point of the film and especially the ending.
Henry Cavill's Superman is again on point and presents a tragic take on John Byrne's and more importantly Dan Jurgens' iconic version. I now repeatedly mentioned the source material but this film is an adaptation first and foremost, unlike the MCU competition. I am also a fan of their highly different films and they constantly veer off the source material but back on track. The mentioned creators (and many more) are proudly listed in the credits and produced some of the most iconic and bestselling comics of all time. I highly suggest to look them up, after digesting this monumental epos, and the film adapted way more of The Dark Knight Returns than i ever expected. This brings me to the film's one glaring and fascinating "problem". The films should be near incomprehensible to non-comic readers and may be the first 200+ million film that goes out it's way to target an adult and comic literate audience! Young children, family audiences and casual fans are destined to hate this film and i am not even sure if i can call it a "mainstream" movie. The pacing is more comparable to a cerebral thriller and the whole product is a blatant deconstruction of messianic ideals, which will offend many on principle alone. A true Twilight of the Superheroes if you want. The best cinematic comparison i can make is the equally busy and enjoyable The Dark Knight Rises, which managed to forgo this film's troubling reception due to the lack of fantastic elements. I further believe that all 3 of Zack Snyder's current Superhero adaptations got unfair scrutiny because they dared to go beyond preconceived notions of what a big budget comic adaptation should be and hope that a future generations will reassess them and join me in the sun.
I can only conclude that i view the film as a complete and utter creative successes, despite a few sharp edges here and there. I also hope that this daring film will lead to more creativity and equal risks down the line, from all competitors on the market. The DCU weight on the right shoulders and it's future is now in the hands of the fans, as never before. The film often asks if there must be a Superman. I say YES and visionaries and as Zack Synder or David S. Goyer need to lead them.
So vote with your money if your want to see these creators unleash Apokolips on earth, or stay at home. 8,5/10 (with the possibility of a 9/10 due to the upcoming Director's Cut)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime My Manga
Araki



Joined: 12 Apr 2007
Posts: 343
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2016 2:49 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
People fear what they don't understand


Or maybe the movie is just a terrible mess.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
DuelGundam2099



Joined: 07 Dec 2014
Posts: 533
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2016 4:43 pm Reply with quote
The article wrote:
Devilman is a more-or-less human-sized monster hero.

Most incarnations of Devilman are, the 1972 TV however was kaiju sized and often fought giant demons from the Demon Tribe, so in this instance Mike is sadly incorrect. I have no real problem with the article other than that, although not mentioning Gilgilgan or Pikadron from the Great Mazinger vs. Getter Robo movies? And Bong instead? I am disappointed.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Triltaison



Joined: 03 Jul 2011
Posts: 145
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2016 4:49 pm Reply with quote
I have always loved Minky Momo vs. Creamy Mami, even if it was only a short. The opening animation to the PlayStation game Majokko Daisakusen with Sally, Meg, and everyone also thrilled me once I found out about them all being together.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
H. Guderian



Joined: 29 Jan 2014
Posts: 863
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2016 5:18 pm Reply with quote
I like crossovers.
"Wouldn't it be fun if..."
is how they all start in my head. Like, a lot of elements in the Kingdom Hearts games clash, but it is still a fun romp. I feel like there are other crossovers, but they seem to come up in game formats a lot.

Perhaps being able to customize, and mix and match even further is part of the appeal. Like putting Fa from Zeta Gundam into the Sazabi in SRWa3.

I'm not a fan of how Western comics make the Crossover Universe the default universe. It is far more hassle than it is worth, narratively. While it very fun to see cameos and crossovers, if they're gonna be a staple in your universe...why not build a character of that same type and then gain full creative control?

For example, you can't push the boundaries in a crosover without it suddenly throwing everything else out of whack in the shared universe, and eventually you keep getting multiple multiverse resets.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Mr Adventure



Joined: 14 Jul 2008
Posts: 1578
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2016 8:54 pm Reply with quote
My DREAM anime Team-Up?

Lupin the Third/Golgo 13



EDIT: there are also a couple of East/West crossovers I'd love to see, like...

Superman/Astro Boy (or Legion of Super-Heroes/Astro Boy)
One-Punch Man/Empowered
Armored Trooper Votoms/Rogue Trooper


Last edited by Mr Adventure on Sun Apr 03, 2016 9:03 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime
penguintruth



Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Posts: 7384
Location: Penguinopolis
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2016 9:01 pm Reply with quote
Mr Adventure wrote:
My DREAM anime Team-Up?

Lupin the Third/Golgo 13


That would work better than Lupin and Conan, in terms of tone. Too bad Dezaki isn't around anymore.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address My Anime My Manga
Mr Adventure



Joined: 14 Jul 2008
Posts: 1578
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2016 9:17 pm Reply with quote
This is actually why I really enjoyed Concrete Revolutio last season, as it was the closest we've had in a while to a mega 'cross-over' anime with all the classic anime tropes all in one show interacting. One-Punch Man has a bit of that too, though its clearly going more for parody when it does it.

Last edited by Mr Adventure on Sun Apr 03, 2016 10:01 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message My Anime
darkchibi07



Joined: 15 Oct 2003
Posts: 4519
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2016 9:55 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
In light of how enjoyable it is, I'm surprised that Toei hasn't cooked up some sort of TOEI TEAM UP FEATURING: Sailor Moon-Pretty Cure deal.


Now THAT would be an interesting crossover especially in seeing the different fighting styles in thwarting evil. Granted it could depend which Precure team it should crossover to or else we would get like 9 Sailor Scouts teaming up like 30+ Precures. Anime hyper
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address My Anime My Manga
Covnam



Joined: 31 May 2005
Posts: 1052
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2016 10:17 pm Reply with quote
John Thacker wrote:

Mahou tsukai tai vs. Shamanic Princess was a short extra given to people who bought all the OVAs of Shamanic Princess, and is pretty wacky.


I'd love to see that. No luck in my searches though =/

Quote:
They're subsequently chased off by the tentacle Alien X itself; “Please don't chase us,” quips Pelsia, “there are so many other girls!”
It all leads up to a big battle with the alien involving futuristic powered suits and lots of great-looking late 80s OVA animation.


For a second there, I was worried about where that was going...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Top Gun



Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 2753
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2016 10:57 pm Reply with quote
I love seeing Mike's praise for the Kikaider series that [adult swim] aired back in the depths of time. While it's not much to look at visually (it's painfully clear that it was done on a shoestring budget), it has a great somber atmosphere and contemplative tone to it, and I consider it to be very much a semi-hidden gem of the early 2000s. Unfortunately I don't think its OVA follow-up Kikaider-01 was nearly as good: it eschewed most of the TV series' deliberate pacing in favor of non-stop action scenes, and it seemed to assume far more knowledge of the original tokusatsu/manga, since there wasn't a lot of context given for what was going on. (It also didn't help that the OVA changed directors from the extremely talented Tensai Okamura.) I also tracked down the Kikaider vs. Inazuman OVA that Mike talked about, and while I didn't know anything about the latter character going into it, I had enough fun with it to be bummed that he'd never received an animated adaptation of his own.

Also it's fun to learn about those Holmes vs. Lupin specials, since the game developer Frogwares responsible for a series of Holmes point-and-click adventure games on PC tacked the same matchup in one of their titles. That one featured the Frenchman trying to steal everything from the Rosetta Stone to the Crown Jewels to Queen Victoria's heart. Very Happy
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
penguintruth



Joined: 08 Dec 2004
Posts: 7384
Location: Penguinopolis
PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2016 11:46 pm Reply with quote
Top Gun wrote:
I love seeing Mike's praise for the Kikaider series that [adult swim] aired back in the depths of time. While it's not much to look at visually (it's painfully clear that it was done on a shoestring budget), it has a great somber atmosphere and contemplative tone to it, and I consider it to be very much a semi-hidden gem of the early 2000s. Unfortunately I don't think its OVA follow-up Kikaider-01 was nearly as good: it eschewed most of the TV series' deliberate pacing in favor of non-stop action scenes, and it seemed to assume far more knowledge of the original tokusatsu/manga, since there wasn't a lot of context given for what was going on. (It also didn't help that the OVA changed directors from the extremely talented Tensai Okamura.


I mostly enjoyed the Kikaider anime, myself, but felt like it really bordered on tragedy porn a lot of the time, even to the level of Casshern Sins (especially 01). I like my anime dark-ish (Cowboy Bebop, FMA, Zeta Gundam, LoGH), but it was getting silly with how every episode of Kikaider was some great melodramatic loss or had a baffling, life-changing revelation. Contemplative is great, but when you try that hard to wring tears from the viewers, it becomes comedic in its overreach.

Well, hey, there's a crossover for anime studios to look into, Kikaider and Casshern.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address My Anime My Manga
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Anime News Network Forum Index -> Site-related -> Talkback All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group