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INTEREST: Shōnen Jump Authors Comment on Bleach Ending


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syrianmj



Joined: 06 Jun 2010
Posts: 52
PostPosted: Tue Aug 23, 2016 5:20 pm Reply with quote
nobody knows wrote:
anddo! wrote:
Why didn't Kishimoto comment?


he will say " thank you for ending your manga as bad as mine so i don't feel lonely"

even though I still think naruto ending is worst one .

lol at gintama comment Very Happy

Thanks 4 openion moran sensi
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tintor2



Joined: 11 Aug 2010
Posts: 1820
PostPosted: Tue Aug 23, 2016 7:29 pm Reply with quote
I'm pretty sure everybody noted this but:
1. Lets fight Hollow of the week
2. Lets rescue Rukia while developing BS powers
3. Lets fight Arrancars of the week
4. Lets rescue Orihime from the Arrancar while developing more BS powers
5. How about Fullbrings? .....Anybody?
6. Lets make everybody fight against..... Quincy... why? who cares. Also don't forget to add more BS powers and have the most anticlimatic fight of shonen.

Even Masami Kurumada would find Bleach too repetitive.
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lamel2g



Joined: 04 Dec 2004
Posts: 30
PostPosted: Tue Aug 23, 2016 8:16 pm Reply with quote
That's weird. I could've sworn I made a post in this thread yesterday, now it's not here.
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War_Destroyer



Joined: 23 Jan 2014
Posts: 29
PostPosted: Tue Aug 23, 2016 10:05 pm Reply with quote
So is that it? Is this how Bleach will fade completely into the past? When Naruto's manga came to an end, or was coming to an end for that matter, there were many articles, many of which came from non anime/manga oriented sites, from curious facts to personal retrospectives, there were events, and it trended on social media with some articles carrying thousands of comments... But all we get is a little news about the obviously canned comments from Kubo and his contemporaries?

I guess that it's not at all surprising, I followed the anime and manga from the very beginning, definitely one of my favorites for many reasons, but I lost interest as the fulbringer arc ended and I began to take my college life and courses more seriously.

You really blew it Kubo, you got too greedy and you milked your franchise thin until, to the point where they cut your show and now your manga...
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GrayArchon



Joined: 28 Feb 2011
Posts: 393
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2016 2:56 am Reply with quote
I'm guessing the people that are saying Bleach was suddenly cancelled don't read Toriko. Which has been moving at warp speed towards it's conclusion for the last year, skipping and off paneling things that were clearly intended to have had their own arcs, and infodumping like made just to reach the point where more or less everything is answered and it can work on the final battles. It's very obvious that a year ago it's author was given a deadline by which to wrap it up, forcing him to make lots of cuts and rush through things.

Bleach would not have received less warning. Besides the example of Toriko, it's unlikely to the point of impossibility that they'd coincidentally cancel Bleach at it's 15th anniversary. Not to mention they were running some databook like pages in Jump for Bleach for the last several months. Reaching Ichigo and his close friends right around the time Bleach ending was announced. It's basically guaranteed that Kubo and his editors agreed upon an end date for Bleach at least a year ago, likely more. I would not even be surprised if an end date was settled upon way back when they announced that this would be the final arc.

So no, Bleach's ending did not suffer from Kubo being surprised by a sudden cancellation by his evil editors. It was not rushed because his editors suddenly gave him a very short amount of time in which to wrap it up.

What happened to Bleach is Kubo's own pacing issues that have existed for years. Years ago he grew used to dragging out the series, partly by having relatively low content chapters. By "low content" what I mean is that he grew used to using much larger panels. He'd take a third of a page for something that could have been done in a small panel. Half a page for something that could have easily been done in a quarter or a third of the page. A full page for something that could have been done in half a page. A two page spread for something that could have easily been just a single page. The result is that the events ended up taking significantly more pages to show. This bit Kubo on the butt in the final arc. A lot of the fights that people complain were pointless were clearly designed to show off various characters shikais and bankais, and provide cause to show various backstories that Kubo had come up with. The problem is that Kubo never managed to pick up the pacing. Fights kept taking chapters and chapters, going past a month when they could have been done in 2-3 weeks easily. Then as the months rolled by, Kubo eventually came up against the deadline he'd known about for a while, with too much left to do, and too little time to do it. So he tried to cram in a few last things, before throwing together something for the climax, and skipping to the epilogue he'd had planned out.

All in all, the rush is on Kubo, not his editors.
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Shadowrun20XX



Joined: 26 Nov 2007
Posts: 1935
Location: Vegas
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2016 4:02 am Reply with quote
Predictable end to a mediocre shonen series. It's finally over. These mangaka know how to start series but never how to finish them. Kubo chose the "next gen" end, he is gonna have to live with it.

I did enjoy the series and the games but dropped off when the anime quit. When Dattebayo stopped subbing it actually. I've been hearing the doom and gloom ever since. I'm glad he is done. These guys need to make multiple series, Zombie powder and Bleach are not enough.
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JDude042



Joined: 29 Dec 2011
Posts: 261
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2016 12:33 pm Reply with quote
GrayArchon wrote:
What happened to Bleach is Kubo's own pacing issues that have existed for years. Years ago he grew used to dragging out the series, partly by having relatively low content chapters. By "low content" what I mean is that he grew used to using much larger panels. He'd take a third of a page for something that could have been done in a small panel. Half a page for something that could have easily been done in a quarter or a third of the page. A full page for something that could have been done in half a page. A two page spread for something that could have easily been just a single page. The result is that the events ended up taking significantly more pages to show. This bit Kubo on the butt in the final arc. A lot of the fights that people complain were pointless were clearly designed to show off various characters shikais and bankais, and provide cause to show various backstories that Kubo had come up with. The problem is that Kubo never managed to pick up the pacing. Fights kept taking chapters and chapters, going past a month when they could have been done in 2-3 weeks easily. Then as the months rolled by, Kubo eventually came up against the deadline he'd known about for a while, with too much left to do, and too little time to do it. So he tried to cram in a few last things, before throwing together something for the climax, and skipping to the epilogue he'd had planned out.

All in all, the rush is on Kubo, not his editors.


What I don't understand is if Kubo really was aware of his upcoming deadline, then why did he waste so much time on the fight with Gerard Valkyrie? To spend so much time on a senseless battle that was going to go nowhere only to pull the plug on it by having the main bad guy drain him of his power when the dude could basically regenerate endlessly makes absolutely no sense. He should have had him regenerate as a giant poop mound, just to give a perfect representation of what the series had become. Laughing Anyways... I wouldn't be surprised if by the end Kubo deep down was tired of working on Bleach and just wanted to get it over with and stopped caring about consistency or tying up loose ends.

I totally agree about the wasted panel space. I would link photos, but linking to scans is against the rules here so you're just gonna have to deal with word of mouth. I remember towards the climax of the fight with Aizen in Fake Karakura Town, an entire half a page being wasted by a huge panel of Aizen pointing his finger into the air, and the exact same thing with Yhwach when he declared to Ichigo that he would now be leaving Soul Society to go to the Royal Realm. I was like, "What is this? What...? What is this...?! Evil or Very Mad "

Overall as many have already said, Bleach started off excellent, then slowly and steadily went down the crapper to the point of no return. This series will surely forever be remembered for its flaws rather than its strong points, and we'll see if Kubo Tite even wants to continue being a mangaka in the future after this catastrophe. Only time will tell...
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theNightster



Joined: 14 Mar 2014
Posts: 1328
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2016 1:30 pm Reply with quote
You guys should leave Kubo alone and stop acting like you know what happened behind the scenes, he still wrote a better last arc then Kishimoto
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JDude042



Joined: 29 Dec 2011
Posts: 261
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2016 2:43 pm Reply with quote
theNightster wrote:
You guys should leave Kubo alone and stop acting like you know what happened behind the scenes, he still wrote a better last arc then Kishimoto


Until someone who actually knows what happened behind the scenes comes out and says something, then all we can do is speculate. If I had the time or patience, I honestly think it would be funny if I did a YouTube video in an Angry Video Game Nerd style where I appear in front of the camera and talk about how much of a train wreck Bleach turned out to be and point out its flaws. I imagine by the end of the video that I would take a copy of a manga volume, bite down into it, ripping apart the cover, and continue to beat the crap out of it, then maybe take a fake bowel movement on it for comedic effect? Laughing
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theNightster



Joined: 14 Mar 2014
Posts: 1328
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2016 3:16 pm Reply with quote
JDude042 wrote:
theNightster wrote:
You guys should leave Kubo alone and stop acting like you know what happened behind the scenes, he still wrote a better last arc then Kishimoto


Until someone who actually knows what happened behind the scenes comes out and says something, then all we can do is speculate. If I had the time or patience, I honestly think it would be funny if I did a YouTube video in an Angry Video Game Nerd style where I appear in front of the camera and talk about how much of a train wreck Bleach turned out to be and point out its flaws. I imagine by the end of the video that I would take a copy of a manga volume, bite down into it, ripping apart the cover, and continue to beat the crap out of it, then maybe take a fake bowel movement on it for comedic effect? Laughing
I would throw a shurikken at a Naruto volume and then spit alcohol and light it on fire via fake Sony Vegas effects but that's because I found Naruto to be much more frustrating to read. Some may call Bleach out on ass pulls but these same people think Naruto is consistent even though that series did the same thing except ten times worse.
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GrayArchon



Joined: 28 Feb 2011
Posts: 393
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2016 4:15 pm Reply with quote
JDude042 wrote:
What I don't understand is if Kubo really was aware of his upcoming deadline, then why did he waste so much time on the fight with Gerard Valkyrie?


That was part of him cramming in a few last things. Several characters that hadn't done anything get to do something, a last few bankai shown off, etc. It taking so long was a function of the same panel problem that drove the series general pacing problems.
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JDude042



Joined: 29 Dec 2011
Posts: 261
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2016 4:27 pm Reply with quote
GrayArchon wrote:
That was part of him cramming in a few last things. Several characters that hadn't done anything get to do something, a last few bankai shown off, etc. It taking so long was a function of the same panel problem that drove the series general pacing problems.


I love how in the 2nd to last chapter, we get a bit of fluff between some of the Gotei 13 with Hisagi spouting about his Bankai that we never got to see. Laughing

Hisagi: I do have a Bankai! I really do! That damn Kubo just never let me show it off, that's all!
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BadNewsBlues



Joined: 21 Sep 2014
Posts: 5920
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2016 7:25 pm Reply with quote
theNightster wrote:
You guys should leave Kubo alone and stop acting like you know what happened behind the scenes, he still wrote a better last arc then Kishimoto


How was the final arc of Bleach in anyway better than Naruto......and why are we comparing and contrasting the endings when they were handled completely differently from one another?

theNightster wrote:
I would throw a shurikken at a Naruto volume and then spit alcohol and light it on fire via fake Sony Vegas effects but that's because I found Naruto to be much more frustrating to read. Some may call Bleach out on ass pulls but these same people think Naruto is consistent even though that series did the same thing except ten times worse.


.....I know of very few people who're are gentle regarding their criticisms of Naruto's second half. Secondly whatever you thought Naruto did that was ten times worse than what Bleach did is purely subjective.
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theNightster



Joined: 14 Mar 2014
Posts: 1328
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:23 pm Reply with quote
JDude042 wrote:
GrayArchon wrote:
That was part of him cramming in a few last things. Several characters that hadn't done anything get to do something, a last few bankai shown off, etc. It taking so long was a function of the same panel problem that drove the series general pacing problems.


I love how in the 2nd to last chapter, we get a bit of fluff between some of the Gotei 13 with Hisagi spouting about his Bankai that we never got to see. Laughing

Hisagi: I do have a Bankai! I really do! That damn Kubo just never let me show it off, that's all!

I liked that second to last chapter tbh mainly because it was so self aware
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theNightster



Joined: 14 Mar 2014
Posts: 1328
PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2016 9:36 pm Reply with quote
BadNewsBlues wrote:


How was the final arc of Bleach in anyway better than Naruto......and why are we comparing and contrasting the endings when they were handled completely differently from one another?

Bleach's last arc filled in some plot holes and upped the stakes and was killing some characters at the beginning, and I'm making a comparison because it's the internet and like game consoles everyone argues about about which series is better.

BadNewsBlues wrote:
.....I know of very few people who're are gentle regarding their criticisms of Naruto's second half. Secondly whatever you thought Naruto did that was ten times worse than what Bleach did is purely subjective.
I can't exactly argue with that, even the ending was lack luster the problem is really more of stuff that we didn't get to see then what actually happened (though granted not getting to see much of Ichigo's last bankai was kind of like a middle finger)
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