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The Best and Worst of the Season So Far: Week of Mar 12-18


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Shay Guy



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 748
PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 12:49 pm Reply with quote
I'm not entirely clear on how "Schulze with abstentions" works.

Let's say you have two very popular shows for which, by chance, nobody has rated the week's episode for both. Suppose both are praised enough that either one would be the Condorcet winner in the whole set, if not for the other -- no beatpath exists from either one to the other. Then which is #1? Is it a tie? Chosen randomly? Based somehow on which one's beatpaths are stronger?

EDIT: Never mind, I think I figured it out. I was thinking of a "ballot" as a unit instead of a set of "A>B, A>C, B=C, B>D..." votes. So if there are 5 candidates, there are (5 choose 2) = 10 comparisons, and an abstention for E just means your ballot doesn't affect any of E's four rankings.

I wonder how you'd vote if you knew A>B>C>D and A>E>D, but weren't sure how E compared to B or C.
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relyat08



Joined: 20 Mar 2013
Posts: 3356
Location: Northern Virginia
PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 2:26 pm Reply with quote
For some reason, I never realized that Demi-chan was actually that popular here. I've been enjoying it, but it's sort of settling into a nice "pretty good" area. Certainly not on the level of March Comes in Like A Lion, which it has surpassed.
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Kidkidd



Joined: 14 May 2016
Posts: 21
PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 2:58 pm Reply with quote
The lack of Friends disturbs me greatly.
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Paiprince



Joined: 21 Dec 2013
Posts: 591
PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 6:02 pm Reply with quote
Kidkidd wrote:
The lack of Friends disturbs me greatly.


This site's userbase doesn't like anything CGDCT hence why Urara Meirochou, Schoolgirl Strikers and Kamakura Jitensha-bu aren't even on the list.
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meiam



Joined: 23 Jun 2013
Posts: 1754
PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 6:27 pm Reply with quote
Paiprince wrote:
Kidkidd wrote:
The lack of Friends disturbs me greatly.


This site's userbase doesn't like anything CGDCT hence why Urara Meirochou, Schoolgirl Strikers and Kamakura Jitensha-bu aren't even on the list.


That's not even remotely true, Koyabashi is doing very well, same for monster girl, both of which are very similar in nature to cute girl doing cute things. Gabriel dropout is also doing pretty well, this one is a pure cute girls doing cute things.
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zrnzle500



Joined: 04 Oct 2014
Posts: 2605
PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:04 pm Reply with quote
Well not enough of the userbase liked the aforementioned titles. There are definitely users that like CGDCT. And with Schoolgirl strikers and kamakura jitensha bu, well it was because people thought they weren't good regardless of their genre.

I wouldn't call Gabriel Dropout CGDCT let alone a pure one, unless one considers being sadistic, pettily evil, or slovenly cute things.
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Takkun4343



Joined: 19 Jul 2007
Posts: 417
Location: Gahanna, Ohio
PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 8:43 pm Reply with quote
zrnzle500 wrote:
I wouldn't call Gabriel Dropout CGDCT let alone a pure one, unless one considers being sadistic, pettily evil, or slovenly cute things.

Cute girls doing not-so-cute things?
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Gina Szanboti



Joined: 03 Aug 2008
Posts: 6539
PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 11:43 pm Reply with quote
If we're talking about Kemono Friends, it's because people don't like cgi anime + it looked like it was aimed at little kids. Nobody knew it was going to turn into such a charming treat.
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zrnzle500



Joined: 04 Oct 2014
Posts: 2605
PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 11:49 pm Reply with quote
Definitely to all that. Though the kid's show angle is belied by its airing time (1:35 am). Not that one couldn't get the impression from the show itself.
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Gina Szanboti



Joined: 03 Aug 2008
Posts: 6539
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 1:47 am Reply with quote
I don't think most people notice or even know what time anything airs in Japan. Smile
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Fluwm



Joined: 28 Jul 2009
Posts: 50
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 1:49 am Reply with quote
Little Witch Academia is one of the best anime I've seen in years.

It's absence is disappointing, and seeing so much generic crap in its place is, frankly, horrifying.
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relyat08



Joined: 20 Mar 2013
Posts: 3356
Location: Northern Virginia
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 3:43 am Reply with quote
Fluwm wrote:
Little Witch Academia is one of the best anime I've seen in years.

It's absence is disappointing, and seeing so much generic crap in its place is, frankly, horrifying.


Welp, not like we can do anything about that. It's not streaming, so it is what it is. That being said, nothing in the top 5 of this list is really generic crap at all. A prestige historical character drama, two unusual parody/satire comedies that are very different from one another, a mecha about family drama, and a show about dragons settling down with a human. All of them are "anime" in some ways, especially Dragon Maid, but none of them are generic really at all. Unless Gintama is generic purely by continuing to exist, I guess.
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Dan42
Chief Encyclopedist


Joined: 02 Jan 2002
Posts: 3528
Location: Montreal
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 8:20 am Reply with quote
Shay Guy wrote:
Let's say you have two very popular shows for which, by chance, nobody has rated the week's episode for both. Suppose both are praised enough that either one would be the Condorcet winner in the whole set, if not for the other -- no beatpath exists from either one to the other. Then which is #1? Is it a tie? Chosen randomly? Based somehow on which one's beatpaths are stronger?

The question of ties is relevant. Even if that particular situation above is very unlikely, the fact that we allow absentions AND that absentions are the rule rather than the exception (most people only watch a few shows) means that ties are not only possible but somewhat frequent. In that case the tie is simply broken using the average score.

Shay Guy wrote:
I wonder how you'd vote if you knew A>B>C>D and A>E>D, but weren't sure how E compared to B or C.

Since preference-ballots are inferred from numeric ratings, that situation is impossible to describe with the current rating system. The preference of E-vs-B or E-vs-C is automatically inferred from the rating you gave them.

If we did have a system where people directly choose two-way preferences, we could have that kind of "partial absention" where
A > B,C,D,E
B > C
B ? E
C ? E
A,B,C,E > D
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Blanchimont



Joined: 25 Feb 2012
Posts: 1390
Location: Finland
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 12:30 pm Reply with quote
Paiprince wrote:
Kidkidd wrote:
The lack of Friends disturbs me greatly.


This site's userbase doesn't like anything CGDCT hence why Urara Meirochou, Schoolgirl Strikers and Kamakura Jitensha-bu aren't even on the list.

Actually, it says right there in the article;
Quote:
Only the titles legally streaming in North America and popular enough to be reviewed are being ranked

...might be the reason they don't appear here...

It is easy in hindsight, but at the start of a season when reviews are decided, it's sometimes hard to predict which shows will turn out unexpected successes .


Last edited by Blanchimont on Fri Mar 24, 2017 12:39 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Shay Guy



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 748
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2017 12:34 pm Reply with quote
Dan42 wrote:
The question of ties is relevant. Even if that particular situation above is very unlikely, the fact that we allow absentions AND that absentions are the rule rather than the exception (most people only watch a few shows) means that ties are not only possible but somewhat frequent. In that case the tie is simply broken using the average score.


Ah, that makes sense. Nice and simple. And it's just the raw average, not the Bayesian estimate or anything like that?

Dan42 wrote:
Shay Guy wrote:
I wonder how you'd vote if you knew A>B>C>D and A>E>D, but weren't sure how E compared to B or C.

Since preference-ballots are inferred from numeric ratings, that situation is impossible to describe with the current rating system. The preference of E-vs-B or E-vs-C is automatically inferred from the rating you gave them.


Yeah, I got that. Just a little tangential musing about voting systems in general. I don't think anyone's crazy enough to extend Schulze to allow partial orders -- what would the ballot even look like? Laughing

EDIT: Another question that comes to mind -- how often is there a Condorcet winner? (I imagine your Chaos Dragons and Hand Shakerses are reliable Condorcet losers.)
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