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Ichigo77



Joined: 10 Dec 2006
Posts: 389
Location: California

PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2007 11:18 pm Reply with quote
Well I am looking forward to buying The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya starter set when it comes out because it looks like a cool series. I did not read the full rant because I didn't want to read any spoilers but don't let the reviews get you down. I almost never listen to reviews of something since just because one person does not like it doesn't mean I won't. Girls Bravo got some bad reviews but I loved that series. Also does anyone know if Funimation is doing the second series of Kodocha too?
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chrisb



Joined: 07 May 2006
Posts: 452
Location: TX, USA

PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2007 11:20 pm Reply with quote
Although I wouldn't be so harsh, I was also dissapointed with The Melancholy of Haruhi. I did enjoy the very last episode but the rest really annoyed the heck out of me and I just did not understand why people thought this show was so funny. I suppose it was just the whole "moe" factor that really turned me off. I can understand why a lot of people liked the series though, it had a lot of what hardcore anime fans tend to like in series.

KyoAni's Kanon also had too much moe going on for me to love it despite it being a pretty good series. I was actually a huge fan, and still am, of the TOEI version, its just that in my opinion KyoAni did some things way better (Mai's Arc, Nayuki, ending) but it also did a lot of things way worse(Sick girl and her sister, Makoto, Ayu, odd and sometimes nerdy comedy)

In the end I guess moe just really bothers and annoys me.

I really didn't like the Tenchi series, but I agree the movies were all great. I don't really see any incest undertones in the first movie, if you mean Tenchi and his extreme like of his mom, well I think it was just he had lost her at a young age and was just really fascinated and happy to see her again and knew he would have to leave her soon.

The second movie was good but I think it was just too short and could have done more.

The last movie was great and it felt like all the characters had grown with me as I was already a teenager when I saw it and had been watching the whole series since I was very little.


Last edited by chrisb on Thu Apr 19, 2007 11:55 pm; edited 3 times in total
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kazenoyume



Joined: 18 Apr 2006
Posts: 193

PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2007 11:24 pm Reply with quote
I'm really not one to fall for hype. Okay, I'm not at all. I did check into Haruhi because a friend rec'ed it to me, but not because I'd heard it was the greatest thing ever. They just said I should try it. I didn't read anything on it before going into it.

I love the series a lot. I DO agree it's a bit over hyped, but not that it isn't excellent. I just don't think it's the most amazing and inventive anime known to man, but it is certainly extremely good.

I can see where Haruhi could be irritating, but I think it should be taken with a a grain of salt. It's comic relief. It's a bit of a pet peeve of mine to see people take comic relief so seriously. Oh this female character is so abusive because she whacks her boyfriend with a paper fan, or a mallet, or smashes him into the ground, or electrocutes him, or pummels him. It's a joke. Yeah sometimes anime overdoes it (often an anime will play up the gag when it was used very seldom in the manga/novel it's being adapted from, and I do find that very annoying), but If most of these characters were real, they wouldn't be doing this. It's just a sight-gag. Like walking off a cliff and floating for a few moments... or something.

I think that Haruhi is a little different. There are some of the things she does that she'd certainly do if she were 'real,' but some not so much. However, I'll be honest in saying I don't really care that she extorts people and forces Mikuru into skanky clothes. It's funny. She's flawed, but we see at many points that she also has a very good heart (Island murder mystery episodes for one). Haruhi is just a girl with ideas to big for the mundane world we live in.

But Yuki is also my favorite character. I am not a big MOE fan, so Mikuru wasn't my cup of tea. However, I loved the rest of the SOS-dan.

Also, I do think the series being out of order added to the fun.

Oh and I agree that Beautiful Dreamer is extremely frustrating. I never got the appeal, and I'm a big Urusei Yatsura fan. But I have to say that Lum: The Forever is much worse imho. It makes even less sense and is full of even more pointless allegory and symbolism- to the point where no one really even knows what it's about.
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HitokiriShadow



Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 6137

PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2007 11:35 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
ADV kept releasing Aura Battler Dunbine even though it was pretty clear nobody on Earth bought that show (considering for about a year there every single ADV DVD and Newtype USA issue had a promotional card where if you so much as looked askance at ADV's corporate headquarters or made eye contact with Matt Greenfield, you'd get a volume of Aura Battler Dunbine for free)


I bought it. Admittedly, it wasn't until a couple months ago when I could get most of the series for $4 a disc. But tracking down those last two volumes was a pain in the ass. Apparently, ADV made very, very few of those last two volumes because plenty of places had #1-10 and nobody had #11 and #12. A few had them listed as out of stock, but most didn't even had them listed.

I was lucky enough to find #12 used at FYE, but finding #11 was a b****. I even ordered from a site I never wanted to order from again because they sold bootlegs, but I ordered from them because they seemed to have it. Then I got an e-mail saying it was backordered (unlike what the listing said), and since the DVDs were no longer being produced that meant they were never going to get it. So I searched around and after two more false leads, I was ready to give up. Then one day, a package showed up from the aforementiond retailer that sold bootlegs. Apparently they didn't feel like ever informing me that they got it and shipped it, but since I was able to get a hold of it, I didn't care to much.

I finished watching volume 6 last night and its pretty good. Sadly, ADV has some quality control and consitency issues. The fairy was named Cham for about 15 or so episodes and then suddenly she became Chum. I've noticed more typos than usual, and whoever translated the inserts apparently didn't consult the person translating the show. For example, Musiy (in the show) is named Musty Poe on the insert.

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* Tenchi The Movie 2 I believe had some new girl who claimed to be Tenchi's daughter and if I recall correctly there was a bunch of sexual tension in that film so hey, I guess both of those movies had creepy incest undertones!


I must have missed those undertones in the first movie. Achika was clearly in love with Nobuyuki and barely even saw Tenchi and Tenchi never showed the slightest sexual interest in her. Ayeka's role in the movie was pretty small, so I'd say the movie had fewer incestuous undertones than the OVAs or TV series.


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As for the shojo stuff, well, none of that really came true. FUNimation's doing a few shows - Kodocha did eventually get licensed, after all - but they're hardly setting the world on fire.


Sadly, evidence suggests that volume 13 will be the last volume Funi releases, leaving half the series unreleased.

As for the rant.... oh joy, we get the broadcast vs. chronological debate AND Haruhi fans vs. Haruhi dislikers. I wonder how long this thread will go.

I really enjoyed Haruhi, but it certainly isn't for everyone and I'm not about to declare it (or anything else) the greatest anime of all time or that every one should like it. I don't really feel like addressing the episode order right now.
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GATSU



Joined: 03 Jan 2002
Posts: 12431

PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2007 11:55 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
...I have never seen Patlabor: The Movie. Wait, correction: I saw the first 10 minutes of it and passed out. Technically I suppose it did put me to sleep, but that's hardly fair. I've also never seen the first Urusei Yatsura movie, and in hindsight, Beautiful Dreamer is the most frustrating film in that franchise. Mamoru Oshii just has to lay on a thick layer of pretension no matter what he does, doesn't he?...


That's hilarious, coming from an Eva fan. Rolling Eyes

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Although I did like The Cat Returns, and that's a sequel.


Same here. Although it's more like a reboot.

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Yu Yu Hakusho had already seriously faded in popularity, and there wasn't a lot of potential for another cheaply-animated shonen fighting serial that hadn't aged well since the 1990s.


Now, now, don't lump YYH with Recca as cheaply-animated, especially when you compare it to Togashi's manga.

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Sure, there are a few, but that "spark" everyone was expecting would blow up the shojo genre in America and we'd get countless genre series released here on DVD and broadcast on TV... well, that didn't happen, and it likely never, ever will.


The shoujo bubble may have burst, but it has led to more high-profile and classy titles like Paradise Kiss and Honey and Clover getting licensed. Before, it was just the magical girl crap.
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Richard J.



Joined: 11 Aug 2006
Posts: 3367
Location: Sic Semper Tyrannis.

PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2007 11:59 pm Reply with quote
HitokiriShadow wrote:
Sadly, evidence suggests that volume 13 will be the last volume Funi releases, leaving half the series unreleased.
Don't lose hope. They might choose to continue it at a later time or the sales might pick up at some point.

I cling to my desperate hope.

The problem with shoujo anime releases is that both males and females buy shounen but most guys are unwilling to buy shoujo and, strangely, I don't think a lot of the ladies are buying it either.
HitokiriShadow wrote:
As for the rant.... oh joy, we get the broadcast vs. chronological debate AND Haruhi fans vs. Haruhi dislikers. I wonder how long this thread will go.

I really enjoyed Haruhi, but it certainly isn't for everyone and I'm not about to declare it (or anything else) the greatest anime of all time or that every one should like it. I don't really feel like addressing the episode order right now.
Yeah, this rant should produce a few responses.

Personally, I don't get the debate. Either order is just fine with me. I kind of prefer chronological but that's just me.

I hate to break this to the ranter, but the internet is filled with rampant hyperbole, so it's best to take every review with a grain of salt the size of a cow. Anime is wonderful, Haruhi is a great series, but the only person who can decide if you think Haruhi is the greatest anime of all time is you.

My rule of thumb for anime reviews: just see if the plot sounds interesting and if anyone mentiones serious problems with the animation or major plot holes. Decide if you like the art style. See how much it costs if it's an official release. See if the creator has done something else that you liked or if the studio has turned out shows you liked consistently.

I only base my anime watching on a person's opinion when either A) they're someone I respect and usually agree with in terms of what's a good anime series or B) they're recommending it as their all-time favorite and I've been thinking about getting it anyway.
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radda



Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 25

PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2007 12:07 am Reply with quote
Ugh.

I'm all for opinions, of course, but not when you weren't paying attention or if you didn't bother to do your research. Let's break this down:

Quote:
The Ana chronological\Chronological debate. Who ever decided to air this series out of order and\or without a script rewrite to make this series flow better is an idiot.

The original novels were written that way. Granted, I understand why you don't like the way the series was presented, but calling the producers idiots because they decided to stage the story like the novels did is asinine, and proves that you didn't do your research at all.

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Asahina.. I don't know why she's in the series except for being fan service and to up the moe factor

True, and I'll give you this one for now. Fortunately for us all, the novels suggest that Mikuru is far more that what she seems, and that her moe moe personality is just an act so she can get closer to and manipulate Haruhi. Unfortunately, that hasn't made it into anime form yet, but you can count on a second season and probably more in the future.

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Now for Koizuma.

Who?

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But the biggest problem that I found is that the series feels incomplete like there should be something else after Episode 14. We could have had a few episodes on The Agency, more aliens, more action sequences against some other supernatural entities, and even having Haruhi and Kyons relationship develop into something more natural instead of having it forced. But instead of the 26 episodes that this series should have gotten, it's like the the writers just didn't care anymore after halfway through the series.

*facepalm*

It seems you don't understand how an anime production works. The series IS based off of a light novel series, with PLENTY of story left to tell. Again, research.

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Don't believe the hype.

I agree that people should form their own opinions about everything and not go with what the 'people' say, but before you make claims like the ones above, I suggest you learn a bit about the subject at hand.

Again, I respect the fact that you didn't enjoy the series as much as I did, but you obviously haven't looked too far into it.
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domino



Joined: 25 Nov 2004
Posts: 372

PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2007 12:30 am Reply with quote
It's refreshing to see that I'm not the only person in the world who was completely underwhelmed by the Haruhi anime..... good rant.
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SoloButterfly



Joined: 12 Jul 2005
Posts: 236
Location: Masaki Residence

PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2007 12:35 am Reply with quote
radda wrote:
Quote:
The Ana chronological\Chronological debate. Who ever decided to air this series out of order and\or without a script rewrite to make this series flow better is an idiot.

The original novels were written that way. Granted, I understand why you don't like the way the series was presented, but calling the producers idiots because they decided to stage the story like the novels did is asinine, and proves that you didn't do your research at all.


Yes, but the anime series should be it's own complete tail. Not just a teaser for the novel series. So I'm going to let the ranter have that point.

I also agree that the moe was a little over the top, but as a female anime fan I've gotten used to dealing with and ignoring moe and other fanservice if a story or concept interests me enough. And In my opinion Haruhi takes the cake for originality.

Quote:
The only time when I've liked her was when she was vulnerable or quiet.
So basically, you prefer the moe type Razz Haruhi's rambunctious and very atypical personality is what I like about her. And it's a major flaw for a character to combat the "perfect in every club" syndrome in my opinion.

As for the chronological debate, I'll have to watch the series in non-broadcast order before I can really make the call, but right now I like broadcast because of the climax issue.

And I think it's a little unfair to say that Haruhi is the only series given 11 out of 10. There's always some series that's on top. A while ago it was Fullmetal Alchemist, before that was Evangelion. It happens, and one will always take the last ones place. But they are often series that warrant a viewing because if that many people are watching there must be something appealing to them (of course there are always exceptions, and reverse situations where series aren't viewed nearly enough) .

I'm usually one to avoid fad series myself but sometimes I just give in and only in the case of Eva did I reget it. And at least even Eva did give me something, I now understand the jokes people poke at it with Very Happy


aahh..reading about Tenchi always puts a smile on my face...even if we are discussing the large amount of incest tones Anime smallmouth + sweatdrop' As for other movies, I though the first CardCaptor Sakura movie was a bit weak, but the second movie was really good and better than some of the earliest episodes imo. I'm not sure if Escaflowne can count as a sequal since it's a totally different take on the story, but it's definately a movie adaptation that came after the series worth looking into! And if we talk about series sequals Sailor Moon S the third season is my favorite and Slayers Next improves on Slayers (which, I'm still waiting to hear about Funi's release of Confused )
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GATSU



Joined: 03 Jan 2002
Posts: 12431

PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2007 12:46 am Reply with quote
Richard J. :

Quote:
The problem with shoujo anime releases is that both males and females buy shounen but most guys are unwilling to buy shoujo and, strangely, I don't think a lot of the ladies are buying it either.


I'm not surprised. The covers are too embarassing for most guys, and the plots are too shallow for most girls. So I really don't get why FUNi brought Peach Girl over, after Supergals tanked. But what's weird is that the manga scene seems to go the opposite way. I'm guessing it's because manga-ka have more time to flesh out a story, but anime studios have to crank out an all-pleasing show for advertisers.
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fighterholic



Joined: 28 Sep 2005
Posts: 9193

PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2007 12:49 am Reply with quote
Time certainly seems to change people's minds if you have a different opinion than what you said 6 years ago. Onto Haruhi, I got off of it for about a couple months after watching episode four, finding that some of the stuff was hard to follow. Only today did I get back onto it to try and watch episode five, and I'll admit that this episode certainly picks up (though there's A LOT of dialogue in certain parts) in a sense that I actually laughed at the humor presented. Faster pace than what was presented before. I just don't get how you have a whole bunch of otaku doing the ending theme song in the middle of Akihabara on a warm sunny day Laughing
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v1cious



Joined: 31 Dec 2002
Posts: 5049
Location: Fresno, TX

PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2007 12:52 am Reply with quote
the ranter pretty much hit the nail on the head with Haruhi. this sums up every reason i didn't like the series. not only was Haruhi incredibly annoying, but the pacing just sucked. why the world would i wanna finish a series, when i already saw the last episode early on? it didn't make sense.

i will admit episode zero was a classic though Laughing


Last edited by v1cious on Fri Apr 20, 2007 1:03 am; edited 1 time in total
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luhead



Joined: 04 Oct 2004
Posts: 151

PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2007 12:58 am Reply with quote
A lot of people are going to run out and buy Haruhi sight unseen based on the incredible hype the series is getting and then they are going to end up feeling like the ranter. Ha! I can't wait for the backlash and otaku wars that are awaiting us. Twisted Evil
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Kenotic



Joined: 02 Mar 2007
Posts: 167

PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2007 1:00 am Reply with quote
Quote:
Don't believe the hype.


This sounds like a fair rule for anyone dealing with reviews, most notably net-oriented fansites. You can find people raving about anything out there, I even found a few sites praising the original "Ghost Stories" years before the R1 remake.

That being said, it probably wouldn't hurt to pay attention to what you are complaining about. Not once in the series is Haruhi considered Kyon's girlfriend. It's not implied by other major characters, his friends, or even later in the novels. In fact, spoiler[he's accused of having a thing for Yuki more than once in the novels and anime series - which is also not true.]

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Let me explain, a series needs to have a feeling of suspense as to what is going to happen next throughout the series. Haruhi gains the suspense and reaches a climax at EPISODE 6!!


Don't read Shakespere's "Julius Ceaser." For that matter, don't watch most series or read most novels that are more about the characters than the action. That seems to be the major problem there -- someone wants an action series, and they got a series that focuses on characters and a "slice of life."

Then again, if watched in the broadcast order, the "climax" takes place at the end of the series -- so I don't know what his gripe has to do with anything.

Oh, and don't watch Boogiepop Phantom if you can't handle stories that are out of order but require you to pay attention.

Quote:
Note to the Haruhi purists, if you don't like my rant, come back in two years with a more open mind.


If I don't agree with you, it's because I don't have an open mind -- gotcha. Actually, I read rather pointed backlash posts and comments before even seeing the series. I knew that the hype was big, and I'm pretty cynical about hype (I still haven't watched 95% of the "it" shows on US TV). So I gave it a shot, and ordered the DVDs as soon as I could. It's it the "Best thing EVAR!!!111"? No, but again you'll find someone to say that about anything out there. It's it fun? Certainly, and that's why I'm a fan.

You don't have to be a fan of any specific series/movie if you don't want to be. There's plenty more out there. But at least make the reasons you're not a fan good reasons.
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dormcat
Encyclopedia Editor


Joined: 08 Dec 2003
Posts: 9519
Location: New Taipei City, Taiwan, ROC

PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2007 1:06 am Reply with quote
kazenoyume wrote:
But Yuki is also my favorite character. I am not a big MOE fan, so Mikuru wasn't my cup of tea.

The fact is, if you ask a random fan of the series "who is more moe: Yuki or Mikuru?" Chances are you'll get Yuki:Mikuru = 2:1.
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