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The Mike Toole Show - Terminal Tominosis


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pajmo9



Joined: 24 Feb 2005
Posts: 323

PostPosted: Sun Sep 25, 2011 10:38 pm Reply with quote
Loved the article.

Tomino has been my favorite creator/director for quite some time now. I love his stories and the unscripted fill he gives them. Although I will admit, when he does something bad its really bad. I can't wait to see what this new project is.
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GATSU



Joined: 03 Jan 2002
Posts: 12544

PostPosted: Sun Sep 25, 2011 10:55 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
This is probably my favorite of Tomino's shows that haven't gotten western release -


We didn't get it, but this HK/Western B-movie guy used an unauthorized music sample from the show.

I know it sounds kinda weird, but I liked the original Gundam more than Zeta. Feels more focused, and Amuro has a reason to be in the show. And Char's Counterattack would probably have more impact if that Transformers animated movie didn't cover a lot of the same ground, first. Does make for a nifty fan video, though.

Quote:
Turn-A Gundam, Tomino's next project, would filter most of the weirdness to the mecha, which took the iconic Gundam and put it through Syd Mead's distorted lens.


BTW, Bandai tweeted that they got an exclusive interview w/ Mead for the U.S. home video release of Turn A.
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Kicksville



Joined: 20 Nov 2010
Posts: 166

PostPosted: Sun Sep 25, 2011 11:36 pm Reply with quote
Yay Tomino! I've been looking forward to this, I always figured when you got around to him it'd be a good article to point people to who want a good overview of his career, and as usual, you deliver.

Wholeheartedly agreed on Xabungle - its cast is tremendously lovable and memorable. It's often been said Tomino shows are addictive, but with this one in particular, it's easy to just pull out a random episode any old time later and have a blast. Never fails to earn a smile.

Maybe it's been a while since you've seen any of it, but what'd you make of ZZ? Seems most people either don't like it or only like part of it, so I'm curious.
Quote:
He did a little better with 1991's V-Gundam, which takes a huge leap ahead in the UC timeline and introduces what might be the entire franchise's least-liked protagonist - still, the show improved through its run, and Tomino would gleefully embrace the "Kill 'em All" approach one last time at its climax.

He is? Might just have to do with where I hang out and what I've read, but he's never seemed particularly disliked from what I've seen. Of course it might have to do with how Gundam Seed came out during the time I was getting really heavy into knowing all there was to know about Gundam, and fans had plenty of other people to complain about...

It was actually 1993 btw, just to be the snooty know-it-all before anyone else gets the chance to be snootier. :B
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FaytLein
Collector ExtraordinaireCollector Extraordinaire


Joined: 21 Jun 2008
Posts: 1260
Location: Williamsburg, VA

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 1:04 am Reply with quote
Ah, V Gundam, the legendary show which, according to the Tomino rumor mill, he actively DISPISED, and lobbied for a sticker to be placed on it that basically read "Don't buy this!"

Tomino has always been a love it or leave it kind of guy. He can come up with great worlds and character types, but doesn't seem to be able a coherant story behind them. Brain Powerd leaps at me as an obvious example, ZZ Gundam's Glemy is another example. But Tomino is kind of interesting, if only for his perceived bullheaded-ness, which always made me root for the guy, even though a lot of his stuff gets confusing near the middle part.
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Eivion



Joined: 26 Dec 2008
Posts: 501

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 2:21 am Reply with quote
Don't think I've seen anythign non-Gundam related by Tomino aside from King Gainer which I recall digging when my brother was picking it up. I'm a little sad to hear it didn't do too well over here. Had no idea the "Kill 'em All" attitude started before Gundam and Ideon. I'm kind of interested in checking out some of these other series.
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Charred Knight



Joined: 29 Sep 2008
Posts: 3023

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 4:24 am Reply with quote
My two favorite works of Tomino are probably Turn A Gundam, and Overman King Gainer.

In particular I love how the characters in Turn A Gundam have realistic motives, and have problems that can be seen in the world. The Moon People want to recolonize Earth, but the Earthlings don't want the more advanced Moon People on the planet. That and the voice cast is really good especially Tetsu Inada and Takehito Koyasu. UNIVERSE!

As for Overman King Gainer, it has Adette Kistler in it.

My problem with Zeta is that while the series looks nice Tomino bungled the story by having the Titans be shallow, insane villains that never really have an actual ideology. They're basically just the SS in space. Halfway through Tomino basically gives up on the Titans and simply replaces their leaders with Paptimus Scirocco who has different motives all together. Say what you will about Logos but at least they seem to have a motivation for all the people they killed (they hate Coordinators).

Although Zeta is the perfect way to add Metal Wolf Chaos into Super Robot Wars simply insert Michael Wilson as the Earth Federation President, and Richard Hawk preforms his coup d'état and creates the Titans to preform his acts of villainy.

I just love Tomino when his actually happy and not trying to come up with new ways to kill off characters.

Kicksville wrote:

Quote:
He did a little better with 1991's V-Gundam, which takes a huge leap ahead in the UC timeline and introduces what might be the entire franchise's least-liked protagonist - still, the show improved through its run, and Tomino would gleefully embrace the "Kill 'em All" approach one last time at its climax.

He is? Might just have to do with where I hang out and what I've read, but he's never seemed particularly disliked from what I've seen. Of course it might have to do with how Gundam Seed came out during the time I was getting really heavy into knowing all there was to know about Gundam, and fans had plenty of other people to complain about...

It was actually 1993 btw, just to be the snooty know-it-all before anyone else gets the chance to be snootier. :B

What Japan likes and what the western world likes can be very different. For example Kira Yamato is one of the most despised characters in the history of anime in America, but in Japan he rivals Char and Amuro as one of the most beloved characters in the history of Gundam. As for Uso Ewin, checking out Newtype favorite character of the decades poll he doesn't appear on the 90's list so his not popular.

http://forum.evageeks.org/​viewtopic.​php?​t=​8772&​sid=​c69a86d62fcdb41713bd​bbfd5d706db3

Kind of interesting that Mike made the V Gundam mistake, as V Gundam's failure caused Bandai to create the AUs to restore the ratings, and improve merchandise sale.
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JohnnySake



Joined: 22 May 2008
Posts: 543
Location: Auburn Hills, MI

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 6:59 am Reply with quote
What a timely choice for such an article, especially with Bandai having just released the original Mobile Suit Gundam series on dvd. (before I logged in, there was an ad for it on top of this forum's web page Wink ) I'm just enjoying watching this original series and seeing what started this whole big Gundam thing going. Excellent article. I've been waiting to see the Turn A Gundam series, but the article and poster's comments here make me want to see it even more.
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_V_



Joined: 13 Apr 2009
Posts: 616

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 9:32 am Reply with quote
I hope Mr. Toole that one day these columns are the seed for some kind of book.

What was wrong with MSG ep 15 "Kukuus Doan's Island"?
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Julia-the-Great



Joined: 14 May 2005
Posts: 328

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 10:02 am Reply with quote
Star of the Seine sounds like a series I would really enjoy, but a quick Google search shows absolutely no options for someone who only knows English. Sad Alas.

I'm familiar with some of Tomino's work, but obviously just a small percent of it! I'm going to have to look into some of his other works.
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nightjuan



Joined: 22 Jan 2008
Posts: 1400

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 10:52 am Reply with quote
It's always nice to read another of Mike Toole's articles, even if I don't usually get to comment on most of them these days.

To make a long story short, I can certainly appreciate a lot of the work Yoshiyuki Tomino has done for Mobile Suit Gundam over the years, as well as some of his other unrelated projects, but I also share the hope that he will get at least a few more opportunities to work on something new before his time finally runs out. It would be a shame if he never directed another full length animated project again.

I agree that Turn A Gundam was, quite fittingly, probably the best thing he had done for the property, precisely because it's simultaneously very different on the surface yet extremely familiar in terms of the underlying themes. Many of his strange quirks and bits of random weirdness still make an appearance, of course, but they're usually kept in check by one of his most interesting worlds and a relatively coherent narrative. A more cynical mind would remark that Tomino may have almost tried to copy the look and feel of a Hayao Miyazaki production in certain respects, but it's still quite creative by Gundam standards and has enough original or at least unusual elements to stand out on its own.

Having real or perceived influences isn't entirely bad, in my opinion, and sometimes taking a few risks within a specific context requires looking outside the box for other sources of inspiration. The concept of absolute originality almost seems a myth by this point in history, when there's really little that hasn't been done before, one way or another, in both anime and fiction.
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Kicksville



Joined: 20 Nov 2010
Posts: 166

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 12:11 pm Reply with quote
_V_ wrote:
What was wrong with MSG ep 15 "Kukuus Doan's Island"?

You may have already heard that Tomino personally requested it be removed, but as for the reason...well, here is his answer at a panel a few years ago:
Quote:
Q: Episode 15, the Isle of Korlas Doom was missing the US release. What
happened to that episode?

YT: I asked that it would be skipped. There is a reason, but since the staff
is still alive I can't answer it. It’s a long story.

This particular episode is known for having some especially dreadful animation, so that may be it. But really, who knows, there may be more to it than that.
Charred Knight wrote:
What Japan likes and what the western world likes can be very different.

I'm well aware of that. Still, if there's particular ongoing disdain for a character here or there or anywhere, you tend to hear about it one way or another, and I'd never come across anything of the sort. Still, the polls you link to bring up a good point - perhaps it's not so much of a matter of dislike as him not being as well loved as the many other protagonists. Either way, I don't doubt it's been so long since anyone's cared to talk about it...
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Anime World Order



Joined: 05 May 2006
Posts: 354
Location: Florida

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 1:20 pm Reply with quote
Charred Knight wrote:
Although Zeta is the perfect way to add Metal Wolf Chaos into Super Robot Wars simply insert Michael Wilson as the Earth Federation President, and Richard Hawk preforms his coup d'état and creates the Titans to preform his acts of villainy.


Reading this sentence made me wish I could send electric shocks through the Internet to your keyboard, sir. This idea is TERRIBLE. Sullying the good name of Metal Wolf Chaos like that. You should be ashamed of yourself. Ashamed.

Charred Knight wrote:
For example Kira Yamato is one of the most despised characters in the history of anime in America


Dude, hardly any anime fans in America even know who that character is, let alone consider him "one of the most despised characters in the history of anime in America." AH BUH BUH BUH, you're about to say something about something-or-other from 7-10 years ago, but you are still mad wrong: what you're saying is only true when limiting things to an incredibly small (yet very vocal) minority of anime fans on the Internet.

And speaking of small yet vocal minorities of anime fans on the Internet: for those wishing to hear Mike talk more about Garzey's Wing and Yoshiyuki Tomino aka "the George Lucas of Japan," (for all the positives and negatives that designation conveys) you can listen to his podcast appearance here. One look at our show notes will reveal that we're never going to be getting any Japanese sponsors!

Be forewarned that you also have to listen to me talk about these things at the same time.
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Charred Knight



Joined: 29 Sep 2008
Posts: 3023

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 1:36 pm Reply with quote
Anime World Order wrote:


Charred Knight wrote:
For example Kira Yamato is one of the most despised characters in the history of anime in America


Dude, hardly any anime fans in America even know who that character is, let alone consider him "one of the most despised characters in the history of anime in America." AH BUH BUH BUH, you're about to say something about something-or-other from 7-10 years ago, but you are still mad wrong: what you're saying is only true when limiting things to an incredibly small (yet very vocal) minority of anime fans on the Internet.


Name me a counter example then (not being rude, I am just asking for who do you think is more hated), who can still get that much hate after 5 years? Most characters who get complaints either have a large fanbase (something Kira lacks in America), or are forgotten in a year.
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belvadeer



Joined: 11 Jun 2006
Posts: 2044

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 2:32 pm Reply with quote
So who is this ultra annoying character in Char's Counterattack?

You know, with "Island" in the title, I was first thinking the episode might have been naughty like the hot springs episode debacle with Outlaw Star, then I thought maybe something really too gruesome for TV happened on said island (besides I can't imagine Tomino suddenly inserting a fanservice-y episode in any Gundam). Well other than spoiler[Tiffa's nude swimming scene in Gundam X].

I see no mention of Gundam X at all. It really was unloved. =<
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Nagatoka_Morito



Joined: 08 Jun 2010
Posts: 27

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 3:00 pm Reply with quote
belvadeer wrote:
So who is this ultra annoying character in Char's Counterattack?

You know, with "Island" in the title, I was first thinking the episode might have been naughty like the hot springs episode debacle with Outlaw Star, then I thought maybe something really too gruesome for TV happened on said island (besides I can't imagine Tomino suddenly inserting a fanservice-y episode in any Gundam). Well other than spoiler[Tiffa's nude swimming scene in Gundam X].

I see no mention of Gundam X at all. It really was unloved. =<


The "ultra annoying character" is likely either Quess Paraya (Who causes a number of other characters to wind up dead because she's a deluded, selfish little teenage brat), or Hathaway Noa (son of Captain Bright Noa, who is probably the biggest loser this side of Zeta's Katz Kobayashi).

As for Gundam X, Tomino had no involvement with it, so it wasn't mentioned.
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