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DmonHiro
Joined: 06 Jan 2007
Posts: 394
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 Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 1:47 pm |
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| sola......is not a moe show...what's wrong with you people? The very deffinition of moe is having characters you want to protect. Matsuri is a freaking DEMON. She does not need much protection, nor does she ask for it. Same goes for the rest of the cast. Why must people call every show with cute girls moe? |
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grgspunk
Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 131
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 1:50 pm |
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| Leebo wrote: | | Quote: | | Or it could be everyone mislabeling drama and romance animes as moe, simply because they have nothing better to do, and all they really want are more action shows. (ala, the GAR-ness that was TTGL.) |
Sounds like you hit the nail on the head. |
Seconded.
| Quote: | | I think carving the R1 market into different categories is what's hurting it. I'm not saying each anime title should be for everyone, but (for example) prioritizing moe and game players serves to alienate the rest of us. This obsession with the next big thing shouldn't throw the rest of us out of the loop. |
*double facepalm*
Morons. The fact that there are categories is what's called "diversity".
One of the great things about anime is that there's always something for people of any taste, age, gender, etc. The problem with you is that you don't see anything you like because you're obsessed with focusing on what you don't like. Just because something is popular does not mean that there isn't going to be anything that's suitable for you. If you feel that BVUSA isn't releasing titles that suit your tastes, then focus on a different company. You know, like Funimation? I'm pretty sure if you're not satisfied with what BV offers, then another company will release titles that you do like, because you're a part of an audience that can potentially bring in money for someone.
Why would a company prioritize a certain genre? They happen to find it more profitable/suitable: This is what's called "business". It also happens to apply to companies who focus primarily on releasing action-packed gar titles in R1/R2E.
Just because one company favors a particular genre does not mean you're some "victim" of alienation. If one company fails to offer the kind of shows you like, then chances are, some other company will bring it to you. So look around for once before shooting your mouth off.
Your complaining is about what types of anime that you like and dislike. Period. End of story. There is nothing else to it.
Let me set the record straight: Idiocy within the fandom is what's killing anime, not some particular genre.
Last edited by grgspunk on Tue Feb 26, 2008 2:03 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Heretic
Joined: 06 Mar 2007
Posts: 175
Location: Laurel, Maryland
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 1:58 pm |
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| Wow...the term "moe" is being thrown around a little too much here. Next I'm going to be told that GitS is "moe" because of the Tachikoma tanks. |
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Key
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Joined: 03 Nov 2003
Posts: 4533
Location: Indianapolis (formerly Mimiho Valley)
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 2:25 pm |
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Whether or not the series is moe is irrelevant to me. I've heard good things about this one, and so had been kinda interested in picking it up, but BVUSA's $50-for-3-eps pricing has assured that it will, at best, be only a rental for me. And yes, you can get the volumes cheaper than that by shopping carefully, but this volume with discounts is still going to end up being double or more the price of a sub-only volume with an equivalent amount of content from any other company.
Someone earlier in the thread mentioned something about "BV doesn't need to worry about the licensing costs so they can get away with this pricing because they're doing it purely for profit." I have to think they'd sell well more than double the number of copies at a more conventional price even if they didn't dub it. BVUSA seems to be going strong, though, so I guess this model must be working for them.  |
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narutoismybrother
Joined: 10 Aug 2007
Posts: 198
Location: Connecticut
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 3:35 pm |
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| I swear if they don't lower the price Bandai's gonna go exactly where Geneon is now. |
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ZeetherKID77
Joined: 17 Jun 2007
Posts: 124
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 3:36 pm |
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At this rate they'll get H20 as well...
I really want this company to die off now and have Bandai Entertainment pick up their licenses. |
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Monster in a box
Joined: 05 Sep 2005
Posts: 474
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 3:54 pm |
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| DmonHiro wrote: | | sola......is not a moe show...what's wrong with you people? The very deffinition of moe is having characters you want to protect. |
That's a new one for me. Like I've said elsewhere, ask 50 people the definition of moe, and you'll get 50 different answers. It doesn't mean anything. It means cute, it means loli, it means fetish, it means character development, it doesn't mean anything.
Also, HEY PLATINUMHAWKE I KNOW YOU FROM THAT OTHER PLACE. *cough* |
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Colonel Wolfe
Joined: 05 Aug 2004
Posts: 356
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 4:23 pm |
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| Sarkozy wrote: | They wouldn't recoup the costs of the dub, they'd suffer losses. BVUSA, to my understanding, doesn't pay the excessive license fees that say, ADV or FUNimation would have to pay. Why? They (as in Bandai Visual), produced the series. They have global rights to it and can jack up the license cost or well, give it to the USA wing, Bandai Visual USA. BVUSA is more-or-less, making PURE profit. They don't want to take on losses(which is understandable), so they don't dub or lessen prices, which has a history of over time, biting a company off the map(i.e. Geneon).
If you are selling niche titles like sola, Shigofumi, Haruka and True Tears -- it would be smart to cut your losses - which would be a dub, which costs probably around $10,000-20,000 an episode -- they would need to sell a lot of discs at standard American MSRP of $29.99 and with such niche series as these, they WOULD NOT recoup costs and they would end up just like Geneon, in a crippled, vegetative state.
BVUSA is targeting 3 consumer groups it seems -- the importer, the audio/videophiles and the collector. BVUSA knows what I want -- I want superb video quality and neat little collectibles, that I can "Ooo.. ahhh..." over. Geneon, ADV and BEUSA -- but now also BVUSA, have given me A-quality video/audio in the past. I love that. It's just the best experience in the world to me. I'm not an importer, so I can't speak there.
I'll gladly defend BVUSA, because I understand why they don't dub and why they charge R2 prices. I'm paying for a quality release that I can't get anywhere else, because with ADV's condition unknown, Geneon in a coma and BEUSA's defective risks. Who can I rely on for QUALITY audio and video? Certainly not FUNimation - even though it has gotten better as of late, but those are at a moral cost. BVUSA = quality releases, with quality extras.
I will gladly support sola and Shigofumi. I'll probably even support True Tears eventually. |
Bandai Visual SUCKS!!! Simply put.
They still don't understand the Region 1 market. Anime fans will not pay heavily inflated prices for anime DVD releases. You'd think that these prices were referring to the Blu Ray releases but they're not.
Fact 1: Geneon suffered problems with anime distribution and got out of the business in the United States.
Fact 2: ADV Films has been scaling back their operations because of similar problems with the anime market.
Anime fans in the United States simply will not purchase this series because of these prices. Since it's subtitled only I'll download it via bit torrent before I consider buying it. At least Media Blasters has gone the right route. They're releasing similarly but you can find their subtitled only releases at Best Buy for $14.99, retail $19.99-$24.99.
Bandai Visual is going to quickly find that anime fans will not support anime releases when they are priced into the stratosphere. |
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insomniac1970
Joined: 17 Jul 2006
Posts: 9
Location: Pacific Northwest
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 4:31 pm |
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| darkchibi07 wrote: | | Ugh, and I really, really liked the series too. But I seriously refuse to support their overpriced, sub-only releases. This will be hard to wipe this series out of my mind. |
I agree. What in the world is going on with Bandai? If they subbed this and True Tears, then I could see the justification for the ridiculous prices that they are charging. But for subbed, only? What makes them think that American anime fans are going to pay that. I want to support R1 anime companies, but not when they shoot themselves in the foot! BTW, I LOVED Shuffle! and I like H20. Don't hate, appreciate the awesome moe-ness! |
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Kirkdawg
Joined: 07 May 2006
Posts: 304
Location: The Golden State
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 4:46 pm |
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| Kit-Tsukasa wrote: | | These DVDs should be no more than $15 a piece and even then that's stretching it when compared to what other DVDs are being sold at. |
Er...what other DVDs are you talking about? |
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Paploo
Joined: 21 Nov 2006
Posts: 556
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 4:47 pm |
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Or conversely, they do understand the US market, and rather then dealing with retailers, stick to specialty retailers [their website, online anime retail specialty stores, and comic shops], and counter lower sales levels with higher prices that the smaller number of people buying their stuff are probably more then willing to pay. Basically, similar to Synch Point [Brocolli, who're now their business partner/distributor/graphic design firm], but with a smaller market in mind
They could be losing lots of money, but usually, when that happens nowadays, companies pull out pretty fast [hi Toei usa!]. So who knows? Either way, we get subtitled dvd's at prices lower then R2, if not much lower then R2. It's not like we have a right to all this- and with other companies who did make pushes at lower prices suffering due to low sales, who can blame them?
Though if you do want low prices, Media Blasters seem to have found a way to make it all work, if you don't mind waiting longer for titles, and now being bombarded with them. They have a very nice mix of sub-only and dub/sub releases at around the 20 bucks/disc mark coming up. So if you don't like BV's prices, go for the competition that IS offering what you want rather the gripping about it. |
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Porcupine
Joined: 21 Jul 2004
Posts: 1033
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 4:58 pm |
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Curse Bandai Visual USA.
People should realize by now that BVUSA's primary intent is not to release anime in the USA. It's to "license" anime quickly and try to prevent their series from being watched on fansubs. Too bad it won't work. Go, fansubbers! (note: I dislike fansubbers, I am only saying this because in this case, piracy is a necessary evil to balance out corporation-based evil).
I think BVUSA had a reasonable goal earlier. Even though I disagreed with their business tactics, at least they had one. Release anime in the USA quickly, in the same quality as in Japan, and ask for higher prices to try to equalize the US and Japanese markets. But they are failing on multiple aspects. One, they aren't releasing anime as quickly as they should (given this business model). Two, they don't even have a distributor and aren't even a "real" USA company anymore in my eyes. You can't buy their titles in stores. So them licensing something is simply putting a legal stamp on it, preventing another legitimate domestic licensor from doing so.
| Paploo wrote: | Or conversely, they do understand the US market, and rather then dealing with retailers, stick to specialty retailers...
They could be losing lots of money, but usually, when that happens nowadays, companies pull out pretty fast. |
Like I just said, I agree their business model was at least thought-out, whether right or wrong I don't know. But that was before they lost their distributor. Now things are entirely different. Sticking to only 2 online specialty retailers, one of which is their own website, is not in line with the economic viewpoint of America. That creates a monopoly on the retail side. And only people who have Internet access and credit cards can buy their titles. Unfortunately for them, these are the same people who probably watch fansubs, so I don't see them selling significant amounts of product under this model.
They're just "licensing" stuff to effectively put things into licensing limbo. Right now BVUSA is the enemy of the legitimate buyer. But about them losing money, I dunno about that. Because my theory is that they aren't even a real business anyway. They are probably just a red-tape organization-in-name-only that "licenses" things from Bandai Visual Japan, most likely for free...with the intent to prevent legitimate licensing (and reverse-importatation) in the USA. So they won't ever go out of business because their organization probably has no upkeep cost.
Last edited by Porcupine on Tue Feb 26, 2008 5:07 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Key
Moderator
Joined: 03 Nov 2003
Posts: 4533
Location: Indianapolis (formerly Mimiho Valley)
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 5:05 pm |
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| Paploo wrote: | | It's not like we have a right to all this- and with other companies who did make pushes at lower prices suffering due to low sales, who can blame them? |
Don't bring that into this issue. This has absolutely nothing to do with entitlement; this has to do with an anime company making questionable business practices that are alienating any potential purchasers for their product beyond the truly ardent fans with deep pockets. If they are content with that minuscule market share, then fine, but if they ever want to expand in sales they are doing absolutely nothing to endear themselves to expanded audiences, who would be willing to pay if their offerings had a decent price.
| Quote: | | Though if you do want low prices, Media Blasters seem to have found a way to make it all work, if you don't mind waiting longer for titles, and now being bombarded with them. They have a very nice mix of sub-only and dub/sub releases at around the 20 bucks/disc mark coming up. So if you don't like BV's prices, go for the competition that IS offering what you want rather the gripping about it. |
And that's what I have been doing, and why I buy a goodly amount of MB content and almost nothing from BV these days. When BV puts out titles I'm interested in but at prices so inflated that I'm not willing to pay it, though, then I am going to gripe about it. |
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Paploo
Joined: 21 Nov 2006
Posts: 556
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 5:17 pm |
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| Porcupine wrote: | Curse Bandai Visual USA.
People should realize by now that BVUSA's primary intent is not to release anime in the USA. It's to "license" anime quickly and try to prevent their series from being watched on fansubs. Too bad it won't work. Go, fansubbers! (note: I dislike fansubbers, I am only saying this because in this case, piracy is a necessary evil to balance out corporation-based evil).
...............They're just "licensing" stuff to effectively put things into licensing limbo. Right now BVUSA is the enemy of the legitimate buyer............ So they won't ever go out of business because their organization probably has no upkeep cost. |
1- That's some mighty crazy Conspiracy Theory Assumptions there, that is. CORPORATIONS ARE TEH EVUL! God forbid someone*make money* off of something they made.
2- Companies like Media Blasters and ADV both licensed stuff from BV since they established their US arm anyways. It seems moreso for stuff other companies have passed on, as a way to branch out, make stuff available, and add a little more profit to a given series [which given how timeconsuming/expensive animation is to create, even the lowest of low end anime, is probably a good idea], I don't really see how offering dvd's at the slightly lower then same price they do in Japan constitutes evil. Unpopular? Sure. Evil? Nah
I do wish their prices could be lower, but I can see why they're what they are, and it's not as sinister as people want it to be. Stuff costs money, it's a fact of life. If you're patient, you can find a bargain, or just buy something else..... |
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Richard J.
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Joined: 11 Aug 2006
Posts: 2931
Location: Sic Semper Tyrannis.
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| Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 5:23 pm |
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| DmonHiro wrote: | | Jokes aside......they have droped the dub and incresed the speed......AND THE PRICE!!! That's like the total oposite to what I was thinking would happen without the dub |
That's because they want to maximize the profit for each title and they know that, based on the realities of the R1 market, sub-only sells far less copies than bilingual. (Edited dub-only can sell even less.) Plus, since they are the Japanese side of Bandai marketing their product to the extreme anime fan/collector, they expect that such people will be willing to pay the higher price for their oh-so-special collectible anime because Japanese fans do, never mind that we aren't getting exactly the same things they did.
Now, personally, I don't think it's fair to say F-off to a sizable portion of the anime fan base (English dub fans) in favor of the extreme fan who often is a fansub watcher watching basically everything that comes out of Japan.
For me, I've never watched Sola, so largely I don't really care that they're releasing it. I'll never watch it on their DVDs either. If I one day feel an absolute desperate need to watch it, I'll just download the fansubs. Why not, since all they're giving me is an over-priced DVD with a professional version of what the fansubers have already done and some extras that won't matter to me unless I freaking love the show and it's Japanese cast.
Why would I pay so much more and get less than other companies can provide me for less? Why have fewer choices and less money to spend overall when I can get more series and have more choices for the same amount of money?
As I said though, I don't have a horse in this race. Unlike some of Media Blasters' sub-only releases, I don't have a pre-existing love for the series and it's unlikely I ever will. Not many people will blind-buy this one and quite a few of those who've already seen it will pass at that price. As much as I hate Media Blasters for not dubbing some of their recent licenses, at least they have the sense to recognize that a sub-only release should be priced less than a bilingual one. (Of course, Bandai Visual USA only grudgingly admits that this isn't the Japanese DVD market, so it's not surprising they wouldn't be willing to make this obviously leap of logic.) |
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