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NEWS: 4 Washington Middle Schoolers Disciplined over "Death Note"


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abynormal



Joined: 09 Apr 2008
Posts: 427
Location: Louisiana
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2008 8:01 am Reply with quote
The argument that "the school should know it's just fiction" is really weak. Most adults in governing bodies (ie. school boards and such) are not up to date on popular Japanese entertainment and are too busy to keep up with what's popular on Bitorrent and Adult Swim. How do you expect them to react with a notebook with "Death Note" on the cover and the names of students and teachers written inside and no prior knowledge or understanding of what it's based on?
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tygerchickchibi



Joined: 29 Sep 2006
Posts: 1448
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2008 10:30 am Reply with quote
bleuster wrote:
Top Gun wrote:
I watch the show on a weekly basis myself, but I'd be ****ing scared if I found out my name had wound up in one of these morons' books, and I'd want them out of my school ASAP, if not sooner.

Call me crazy, but I'd actually want to confront the person and know why I was on that list.


o_o I mean, I wonder if any of these kids had some kind of past history...Are they even going to get help at all?

x_x I hate such vague stories, seriously....
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stevek504



Joined: 29 Apr 2007
Posts: 216
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2008 10:54 am Reply with quote
dormcat wrote:


How about "if you look at past school massacres, nearly every instance had guns involved. Let's dissolve NRA and have a gun control." In fact I'm sure that many people, including relatives of victims of past massacres for sure, would support this with both arms raised, but their voices are just too insignificant compared with arms companies and their lobbyists.

Or maybe a bullet control would be more viable.


Maybe that's a bit overboard.

How about "if you look at 9/11, nearly every instance had a plane involved. Let's dissolve FAA and have a plane control." In fact I'm sure that many people, including relatives of victims of past 9/11 massacres for sure, would support this with both arms raised, but their voices are just too insignificant compared with aircraft companies and their lobbyists.

or, How about "if you look at lung cancer, nearly every instance had a cigarette involved. Let's dissolve the cigarette industry and have a tobacco control." In fact I'm sure that many people, including relatives of victims of past lung cancer massacres for sure, would support this with both arms raised, but their voices are just too insignificant compared with tobacco companies and their lobbyists.

Okay, that last example wasn't perfect. We know tobacco is addictive. Maybe flying planes into buildings is as well, but since they don't get another chance...

My point is that it is the people that are the problem, not the thing involved. There are plenty of cases where a gun protected a person. Police cannot be every where at every time to protect you. Politicians and celebrities have guns (or maybe bodyguards / posse that have them). Why - I guess there are crazy people everywhere. The rich, famous, and political types know it and they take action by protecting themselves. So why can't poor people?

I guess once we have a police state everything will be okay.

dormcat wrote:

"Would be seen as irresponsible" would be more accurate, and I'd say this is the real motive behind such disciplinary action. School boards just want to tell parents "hey look we are doing something to prevent massacres so your tax money are not wasted." In short, they just wanted to dodge responsibilities, just in case something bad happens.


I am sure you are correct here, but it probably goes deeper. Insurance and liability. No one wants to get sued and loose everything if they can take a little action up front. The insurance companies probably give them a rate cut if they show they have a plan / policies on handling issues like this. I would think this applies to the school administrators, city, and state as they would all be sued if something were to happen.
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Sven Viking



Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 1035
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2008 11:15 am Reply with quote
stevek504: Not meaning to particularly support either side, but you should note that they already do have "plane control". And right or wrong, a lot of people already support tobacco control.
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One wing angle



Joined: 03 May 2007
Posts: 6
Location: prairie village, USA
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2008 11:30 am Reply with quote
honestly I think that in this day and age you can't go around wrighting peoples names who you want to die in a note book at school. waether your joking or not and nomatter what your intentions are we all know people flip out about this stuff. if you got problems with people thats fine but vent in your note book at home or at least keep it out of your school, they had to have known what would happen if they where to get cought with it or even if they where reported to be wrighting down peoples names down who they wanted to die. this is their oun fault and their punishment although kinda harsh atleast for one of them is rathe fitting. if your gona do something stupid like that and get the whole school and a legon of soccer moms in an uproar yeah your going to be punished to a fairly high degree, I still think expulsion is a little much but I don't know the depth of the situation.
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stevek504



Joined: 29 Apr 2007
Posts: 216
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2008 11:39 am Reply with quote
Sven Viking wrote:
stevek504: Not meaning to particularly support either side, but you should note that they already do have "plane control". And right or wrong, a lot of people already support tobacco control.


True. And there are some forms of gun control already in place. I just want us all to think about the issues a lot more. Maybe, like these school administrators, government is quick to take action so that they can say "look - we did something! Stop shouting, vote for us, and go away now." But, what they “do” is only for looks and won't help in the long run...

Look at what they did for fuel issues. They gave incentives for farmers to grow corn for ethanol – now food prices are on the way up because corn syrup is, (used in everything) in short supply. Politicians - “Oh, we didn't know that would happen”.
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BunnyCupCakes



Joined: 02 Apr 2008
Posts: 224
Location: The Sunshine State
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2008 11:48 am Reply with quote
heyyobyme wrote:
This is completely ridiculous. Our information is limited, so perhaps other factors were at play with the expulsion. However.

Anyone who takes this "death note" as a serious threat, based only on the info we're given here, is a little bit out of touch with reality. Allow me to explain to you how this Death Note came into existence.


Step 1: Kid watches Death Note, and enjoys it. Rightfully so.
Step 2: Kid buys Death Note merchandise, because kids love merchandise.
Step 3: Kid shows his new "Death Note" to his friends who also saw the show, probably during lunch.
Step 4: Kids write a silly list of names, including classmates and celebrities, for the sake of a laugh.
Step 5: ????
Step 6: Profit! Oh, no, wait.


You see, the problem with the logic some people have been presenting, is that there was no "death threat" whatsoever. Yes, the perpetrators know the object is fake, you got that part right. But no, they do NOT honestly want you dead. How many times do you think the words "I'll kill you" are muttered in every school in North America, daily? How many of the kids who say this actually murder their friends? Shockingly few, no?

There was NO death threat. These kids don't need punishment, nor do they need counseling. These kids are just fine. They're kids. They were being silly, and pretending. Emulating a cool T.V. show, in a harmless manner. They no more intended or wanted to harm anyone than I did when I pretended to fire a Kamehameha at my friends when I was 10.

The real problem lies with the adults involved. And society at large. Due to several school shootings in recent years, everyone's become all uptight about everything. Apparently, kids are just itching to murder each other in the hallways, and the only way to stop this is to throw them out of school at 12 years old. Disregard the fact that most school shootings were perpetrated by young people with serious psychological issues, and perpetrated with firearms, not notebooks.

Good lord. Loosen up people. Let kids be kids. Silly adults. You're not protecting anyone. You're only sapping the fun out of kids' school years.


Loosen up? At a time like this?
And yet,we actually let kids be kids and let teens be teens and what is the outcome? Well you got Columbine,Virginia Tech & various other school violence.

Doesn't matter if there was no death threat,matters have to be taken.We can't gurantee that these kids take this as some sick joke or not.We can't read their minds but their actions are something we have to be cautioned with.

If a bunch of kids decided it would be fun to steal some candy from a candy shop and they're caught,what can they say to the authorities? "Oh....um,we just wanted to have alittle fun." Sure that's what they thought but they're actions can't just be pushed aside from that.Yeah,no one was harmed but it's still very suspicious.

Schools can't take any chances at this state.
[lol @ Paris Hilton xDDD]
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Murasakisuishou



Joined: 22 Jun 2006
Posts: 1469
Location: NE Ohio
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2008 12:18 pm Reply with quote
Great, another one of these cases. All I can say is keep punishing the little idiots; maybe someday they'll get it through their skulls to leave their Death Notes at home. We can't expect public schools to start making exceptions for perceived death threats, even if the 'threat' is just a joke, because there will come a case when a student has written names in their Death Note that actually turn out to be a hit list, and when the school is asked why they didn't do anything, they'll say that they just thought it was some joke from a cartoon. It's always best to error on the side of caution in cases like these. All I can say is that I hope people keep getting suspended, or better yet, expelled over these 'jokes'; wishing death on others, even if it's without any real intent to cause them harm, is never funny. Also, the public school systems will never change; the staff will always overreact to even the slightest hint of a threat against their student body. Kids need to learn this and just stay below the freaking radar.
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DKW



Joined: 19 Nov 2007
Posts: 6
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2008 12:22 pm Reply with quote
Maybe I should explain the thought processes of the administration and police when they see something like this.

1. Someone makes a List of people they dislike or possibly hate
Now here is where they begin making assumptions using the Moral Standard of Utilitarianism (Most Benefit for the Most People, Protecting the Most People)
2. Same person could go buy a knife, gun, crossbow, or start making bombs
3. Same person could start hunting down those people and killing them anywhere
4. To protect others, they need to act now
5. Removing the kids from school protects everyone else while they are in school
6. If something happens to the people on the list outside of school, those who owned the list will be rounded up and detained

In the US legal system, Hate equals Motive.
A list equals both a Motive and a Plan, whether hate is involved or not.
Motive makes you a suspect.
Motive + Plan makes you suspect #1.

Well before Columbine, I have seen many a student expelled for having such a list.
I can assure you that the students who had the list are all now in the police database just in case something actually happens to the people on the list, whether now or in the future.
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crescendoll



Joined: 22 Dec 2004
Posts: 60
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2008 1:00 pm Reply with quote
Hmm, the expulsion sounds like a pretty drastic action at first--which probably helps the school look responsive and responsible--but considering that there are probably only a few weeks of school left in the year at most, is it really that big a deal? Sure, it'll look kinda ugly on the kid's record, but there's no police involvement or anything. And (s)he may be allowed back at school in the fall, or just transfer to another school in the area. Overall, I think this particular incident has been handled as best as could possibly be expected.
Plus, I thought the principal was (unexpectedly?) sapient when he basically dismissed it as being "typical Japanese horror movie stuff and not a credible threat." Three cheers for levelheadedness.

Also, not to condone these kids taking their Death Notes to school or whatever, but maybe this might be a bit of a wakeup call to this particular school to deal with their apparent bully problem...? One can hope, anyway.
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fighterholic



Joined: 28 Sep 2005
Posts: 9193
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2008 1:24 pm Reply with quote
I think I know one thing I can say about this whole thing: That I'm laughing my ass off. Nothing new here, since I've had to see it so many times already and I've had to read through people's posts here who don't do much checking into the facts and accuse the school of acting too harsh or saying that writing people's names down in a notebook is harmless. How about let's get with the show here? First of all, we've had four incidents of this exact same type of event happen this year. In my opinion, the schools have done what was necessary as a safety precaution to their students and staff. It's better to be safe than to be too late and sorry. All you need is someone to be hurt and have a Death Note connected to the crime. Do any of you guys accusing the schools know how that would affect anime? Not in a great way.
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hikaru004



Joined: 15 Mar 2004
Posts: 2306
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2008 1:46 pm Reply with quote
v1cious wrote:
where are they buying these from anyway? Hot Topic i'm guessing?


I found it at various online merchants including Amazon ranging from $13.99-17.99.
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TJ_Kat



Joined: 11 Jan 2007
Posts: 362
Location: Saskatoon, Canada
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2008 2:10 pm Reply with quote
penguintruth wrote:
If they're really concerned, they should reccomend counseling for these kids, not punish them. These kids need support, not punishment.


I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought this. You've basically got some kids who are feeling alienated in some way who made a really stupid choice in how to vent their frustration. But rather than getting them some help in finding a better way to deal with their problems, they've just been alienated some more.

While I do think the suspensions make sense, I think if they just leave it at that, it will only make things worse by giving the kids more names to add to their list. I think they need to take that next step and get them some counselling too.

As for the kid who got expelled, my guess is that he's the one who wrote Bush's name in the book. Isn't it considered to be a pretty serious crime to threaten the president in the US?

And finally to the people dismissing this as some harmless little joke. How do you know they don't really want these people to die? Oh, right, you don't. At the same time I don't know that it isn't just a harmless little joke, but better to err on the side of caution.
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st_owly



Joined: 20 May 2008
Posts: 5234
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2008 2:46 pm Reply with quote
I wonder if it'd be any different if they'd just found a list of names in a notebook, without the words "death note" written on the front
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mrsatan



Joined: 06 Jul 2005
Posts: 909
Location: Olympia, WA, USA
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2008 2:57 pm Reply with quote
Wow! Once again, my home of Washington State makes another world-famous anime scandal!
(We had the kid that died copying Gaara from Naruto as well.)
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