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Re:Zero -Starting Life in Another World- (TV) (all seasons).


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ACxS



Joined: 03 Aug 2019
Posts: 867
PostPosted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 10:59 pm Reply with quote
S2 9 / 34:

Subaru continues to amaze me. I'll explain why in a minute.

This is one revealing episode. Echidna explains that the Witch of Envy—the one responsible for Subaru's Return by Death—doesn't give two sh*ts about the death of those Subaru cares about. Subaru, on the other hand, can't live with the fact of those around him dying. He could've suspected a long time ago that the Witch of Envy doesn't care if Rem or Otto dies in a timeline. It never occurred to him that even if Rem dies, that timeline still continues; he just doesn't want that timeline (or any timeline where someone he cares dies).

But now think about it: what exactly is the motive of the Witch of Envy? It's strongly hinted that it has something to do with Subaru's emotional attachment to the people he cares for. Is the Return by Death her way of keeping Subaru to herself, and ripping him away from them? Is that why she's the Witch of Envy? So although Echidna explains that the Witch of Envy's only cause is to keep Subaru alive, it doesn't paint the full picture: the Witch doesn't care if someone like Rem has to die for the cause. Echidna gets it: it's not in her calculations, anyway.

Okay, Subaru amazes me. Why? One of Echidna's warnings: do not touch the Witch of Envy. One of Subaru's first things to do: touch the Witch of Pride's hand. I was almost tearing my hair off when Subaru's about to shake her hand. Was I shocked that he lost his arm and broke into pieces? Not shocked, but furious. In this Re:Zero universe, Subaru has learned the hard truth, and no, it's not "whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger". It's this: "whatever you don't know, is going to kill you." Subaru just has to learn everything the hard way.

So let's sum up the witches we learned so far:
- Typhon: Witch of Pride, kid who's interested to know about people's moral grounds?
- Minerva: Witch of Wrath, tsundere girl who actually gave Subaru a legit advice ("don't be careless")
- Daphne: Witch of Gluttony, Iron Maiden who lives by the unforgiving code of "eat or be eaten"
- Echidna: Witch of Greed, tea party lady who's voracious for knowledge (it feels as though she's a knowledge broker)
- Satella: Witch of Envy, dark lady who's obsessed with Subaru and envious about his relationship to those around him?
- Witch of Sloth: Echidna borrowed her powers to help keep Subaru in one piece?
- Witch of Lust: ???

So there's another Great Mabeast in this world: the Great Rabbit that multiplies like rabbits (uh huh) and munches everything in their path. Splendid, that explains why the village was completely empty. Subaru was apparently transported temporarily to another timeline where the Great Rabbit came to the village. Outstanding, now Subaru has another thing to worry about. Hurray! Not enough? How about the Witch of Envy herself dropping in for the party? Whoopee! Subaru almost agitated Daphne... jeez, he really has to learn everything the hard way, doesn't he.

Speaking of the Witch of Envy, she finally shows herself in this timeline... but why now? Is it because Subaru's met the other witches and therefore gains a better chance at ruining her cause? Her debut appearance raises some questions, and Subaru even knows it.

Last but not least, the one revelation that we (DuskyPredator mentioned before) suspected some time ago: Roswaal knew about the Return by Death and the workings of the Witch of Envy. I just have to ask: what exactly does the nigh-Tome of Wisdom (or is it really the Gospel?) say? Does it foretell events that are supposed to happen, and if it does, how far does it foretell? Is this the book that tells Roswaal about Subaru's Return by Death?

The plot continues to thicken. How exciting.


Last edited by ACxS on Thu Sep 03, 2020 8:42 am; edited 3 times in total
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DuskyPredator



Joined: 10 Mar 2009
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Location: Brisbane, Australia
PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2020 4:26 am Reply with quote
ACxS wrote:
Speaking of the Witch of Envy, she finally shows herself in this timeline... but why now? Is it because Subaru's met the other witches and therefore gains a better chance at ruining her cause? Her debut appearance raises some questions, and Subaru even knows it.


My suspicions is that is her doing her namesake, she got super jelly. Satella is so envious and possessive of Subaru that she kills him or anyone else who may learn of their little shared secret, and he just met four of the other witches who at least figuratively dared put their hands on her man and shared their secret. Satella is raging, but anger is not in her sphere, so it comes out as her fantastically envious of everything that has Subaru's affection.

Thinking of the larger story, I think that we have been told that the Witch is sealed away, by the dragon, if she herself has Return by Death it would make sense that they could not kill her. And if Subaru is something she wants, she is going to want the outcome that will free her from her prison and be with him. And her appearance in this episode is while she is still locked away. Hopefully her envy rampage will stay in this timeline.

Meeting some of the infamous witches has made this episode extremely notable. Apparently Daphne created three great Mabeast to solve hunger, a giant flying whale, super multiplying bunnies, and a black snake of some sort that to fill the theme my guess is maybe it continuously grows so one could just keep eating it. Daphne was pretty intimidating, I wonder if Subaru was not careful he would catch hunger that would make him try to eat anything he could, based on how Echidna thought that the experience could destroy Subaru's mind.
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Gina Szanboti



Joined: 03 Aug 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2020 10:29 am Reply with quote
More than the "why now?" of Satella's appearance, this all got me wondering "why Subaru?" Why does she love him so? Why did she summon him, assuming she did, and why him and not someone else? Also, we know he's not the only person summoned from our world, during the history of Lugnica or even its present day. Who summoned the others and why? It doesn't seem like it would all be Satella's doing.

I know it'll be a long time before any of that is answered, but this episode got me thinking about it. Smile
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter



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PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2020 12:54 pm Reply with quote
Why does Satella love Subura so? Until I learn different, I'm gonna assume it's because she has super crap taste in men.
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stilldemented



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PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2020 7:58 pm Reply with quote
The theory I'm running with at present is that this goes all the way back to the first episode where Subaru promises he's going to save 'Satella'. Satella has some sort of omnipresence that allows her to know when Subaru mentions Return by Death to someone. I figure she took a strong interest in him from the moment he wasn't afraid of her name, called it pretty, has no bias against silver-haired half elves, and promised he was going to save her. And she doesn't seem to be all there anymore. XP.
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ACxS



Joined: 03 Aug 2019
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2020 11:44 pm Reply with quote
Truth be told, there are a lot of questions to be answered:

Why is Satella obsessed with Subaru, of all people?
Why was Subaru transported into this world in the first place?
What's the story between Emilia and Satella?
What's exactly this destiny Satella is seeking, that only Subaru can accomplish?

All fundamental questions, but I don't think they're going to be answered anytime soon. I'm just wondering what's happening at hand.

(In a way, I'm starting to understand how Subaru thinks. If I were him, I'd probably ask myself the same questions he did—things that are happening in front of me—and not the fundamental ones above.)
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ACxS



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 09, 2020 11:04 pm Reply with quote
S2 10 / 35:

Wahey, here we go.

Subaru's interaction with Satella turns out to be yet another boon, and in two ways. One, he finds out what Satella looks like. Maybe not that important to learn now; nobody's surprised that she looks just like Emilia. But maybe down the road this will be a big clue in the story between Satella and Emilia. Sisters? Emilia and Satella being one and the same, but as different manifestations? We'll find out later.

Two, Subaru gets a glimpse of the memories of the villagers. That led him to learn about Ryuzu's origins, and ultimately the Echidna's motives when creating the village (maybe; I feel like there's more to it than what Subaru has deduced). Echidna's goal is to hoard knowledge, yet by Ryuzu's testimony, she was aiming for immortality. How do those two tie together?

The crux of this episode is understanding Garfiel's motives. He's volatile and violent, but he's not irrational. He's extremely protective of the village, and thus extremely hostile towards outsiders. That's natural. In fact, Subaru could've known that from previous timelines already. Therefore, Subaru's purpose of confronting Garfiel was to show/prove to Garfiel that he knows about latter's concerns. That's very important; previously, Subaru was only fixated at how to not trigger Garfiel. This time, he's acknowledging Garfiel's deepest concerns. Subaru's not just addressing the symptom; he's addressing the root cause. That way, Subaru's claim that he's not harming the village is much more credible... and Garfiel won't bite Subaru's head off in the meantime. Subaru knows about Garfiel being the Witch of Greed's apostle, so technically that makes both of them suspicious; it's just that Garfiel's able to smell Subaru out. But now that Subaru can use this knowledge and veil it as his trump card, he's bested Garfiel (for now).

Subaru's game plan: everyone at the mansion must bail to the village at the first sight of trouble, using the barrier (and Ram and Garfiel) to thwart Elsa. And now Beatrice hints the irony of the situation. In other words: how ironic that she has to be saved by Subaru (instead of the other way round, which is what supposed to happen) and to free her from her contract (bound by a contract... what contract? We'll find out).


Last edited by ACxS on Thu Sep 10, 2020 8:54 pm; edited 1 time in total
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DuskyPredator



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PostPosted: Thu Sep 10, 2020 3:53 am Reply with quote
Ryuzu's true surname is Meyers, sounds a lot like Roswaal's surname; Mathers. I know that could mean anything and nothing considering the Japanaese author. Also feels like pieces where the nature of the Sanctuary was creating hoards of Ryuzu that were originally intended to aid in Echidna's immortality and preserving knowledge in the young girl bodies, and with Beatrice. Beatrice stuck in some sort of contract that bound her with a library, her and Roswaal both being led by the black books.

Kind of looked like Subaru was able to placate Satella by when he was dying to try and escape her love hell he said he was going to save her, which may have just been him mistaking her for Emilia as he was dying, although she probably is wanting to be saved. Subaru also seemed pretty spooked of Emilia, due to how she resembles Satella, and him trying to shake off what she put him through.
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ACxS



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PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:25 pm Reply with quote
S2 11 / 36:

Dayum.

Beatrice was created to serve Echidna all along... damn, why didn't I piece this part earlier? Always stuck in her library to hoard knowledge (the fundamental reason behind the existence of libraries: to be the depository for knowledge), always depending on her Tome to know how it ends... the writing's on the wall, yet I couldn't see it coming. Now, upon hindsight everything makes so much sense! The only thing new is the revelation of Beatrice's goal: to die and get out of her 400-year imprisonment / slavery from Echidna (ever thought that the library was not Beatrice's sanctuary; it's her prison all along? #mindblown).

I already said earlier on that the attack on the mansion is can't possibly be a one-man show. I knew Elsa wasn't operating alone, even if she's the type who does. There's just no way Elsa could be controlling Mabeast when she's too busy gutting people; we know she's not a Mabeast user. Not surprised who her partner-in-crime turns out to be because, well... I don't even remember who Maylie is. A seemingly innocent extra who turned out to be a spy / Mabeast user. Hmm, whatever.

What happens next? Beatrice gets her wish, but oddly transfers Subaru to another timeline. It's unlikely she knows about Subaru's Return by Death, and her Tome was empty, meaning she's finally meeting her end, so by doing this she's essentially preventing Subaru from Returning by Death. But to her—and I'm deducting this only by hindsight—she doesn't want Subaru to die before learning more about the truth (god, I swear this show only makes sense in hindsight). Which brings me to...

...Roswaal, the devil himself! He knows a lot, and we still don't know how much he knows. But it's confirmed he knows about Subaru's Return by Death, and he will do whatever it takes to fulfill his wish, whatever that is. This shouldn't be a surprise; we already know long ago he would manipulate and throw people under the bus for his own ends, even if it means killing Ram just so he can have a talk with Subaru in peace.

There's the other thing about Roswaal: he's a psychopath. It's confirmed. We already suspected him to be one, and I felt so too. But now I can attest with conviction for one simple reason. It's not necessarily because he would make it snow to isolate Emilia and make her ostracized by Garfiel and the villagers. It's not necessarily because he knew Subaru would then come to Emilia's rescue, as he instinctively would (and no, he doesn't need to sabotage his letter to do this; he doesn't even know about it). And I dare say, it's not just because he's perceptive enough to recognize how emotionally fragile Emilia is or how selfless Subaru is when it comes to saving Emilia.

It's because, when Roswaal knows his plan failed with the arrival of the Great Rabbit—a miscalculation on his end because of his snow plan—he knows he's going to die, yet casually tells Subaru to start over with Return by Death. Subaru basically sums it up: it's "insane", and "that's not how any normal human thinks". It's a morbid and deranged version of Einstein's definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. Except in his case: "Damn, I'm dead. But no matter; I'll just make Subaru go to a different timeline and re-do everything. My other self will have a better chance of winning because Subaru will save the day"... even if Roswaal knows the other Roswaal isn't himself; it's a different person. Think for a minute how unhinged that all sounds, because remember: Roswaal doesn't have Return by Death—he even points this out himself—so it's not like all the Roswaals even know what happened to each other since he has no memory of it.

(and also ironic to see Roswaal comment how weird it is that Subaru doesn't grieve over people's death, when he doesn't flinch at the idea of himself dying... maybe that's what he meant when he said he sees a kindred spirit in Subaru).

I mentioned before how Emila and Satella might be one and the same. Well, we know that now: Satella = Emilia, pushed over the edge. Makes perfect sense, if you think about it. Also ironically tragic or tragically ironic: Subaru inadvertently created Satella, who in turns is the one making Subaru's life a living hell. What a sh*tstorm.

Finally, the last scene there... jeez, that's one of the most disturbing scenes in recent anime history. Subaru (or what's left of him, after being munched by death rabbits) being comforted by yandere Emilia... doesn't get as twisted as that.

P.S. Is this season going to focus only on the village? Really feels like it, at this point.
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Gina Szanboti



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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 2:13 am Reply with quote
ACxS wrote:
I don't even remember who Maylie is. A seemingly innocent extra who turned out to be a spy / Mabeast user. Hmm, whatever.

If I'm not mistaken, she was the little girl with the curse-inflicting dog that bit Subaru back in season 1.
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ACxS



Joined: 03 Aug 2019
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 2:48 am Reply with quote
Gina Szanboti wrote:
If I'm not mistaken, she was the little girl with the curse-inflicting dog that bit Subaru back in season 1.


Thanks. I had to trace all the way back to season 1's episode 5 to know it's when Subaru was made the butler of Roswaal's mansion. Good to know.

It's natural to be shocked at learning who she is, but I wonder if we should be more worried about where she is from. She is Petra's good friend, so there's the shock factor: how could someone seemingly innocent end up being an assassin? Or, should we be asking this: a seemingly innocent girl from a village ended up becoming someone like Elsa... who exactly are they serving, and how far have their master's influence penetrated the village?

I'm more interested in the latter. Rather than be shocked at who she is, I'm wondering if her hometown says more about their mysterious boss.
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DuskyPredator



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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:03 am Reply with quote
I rather conclude that Maylie was not from the village at all, but earlier seemingly inserted herself into the village to... seemingly kill one of the members of the Roswaal's mansion, and setting up the pack of dog mabeast in the area, before later setting up the attack on the others in the mansion.

The questions of who it is behind them has continued to be raised by who sent these assassins, if they are the same that ordered the theft of Emilia's emblem in the first arc, wanting to stop Emilia from becoming a candidate. Whether they are connected to the witch cult in what I think they want to bring the witch back somehow through Emilia. Maybe they are the opposite, and Roswaal actually sets up these conflicts to force growth out of Emilia and Subaru. Don't for sure if Maylie is connected to the Great Rabbit.

What does Roswaal even want? What did he get out of the conversation with Subaru from killing Ram and Garfiel, after it did seem that Roswaal also thought that starting over might be in order. My guess would be that Roswaal's goal might have something to do with Echidna, just granted that his earlier insistence to refer to her by name and not a witch has been a notable character moment. He also owns the mansion that housed an important spirit contracted with Echidna, with the land that also has her sanctuary.
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ACxS



Joined: 03 Aug 2019
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2020 11:29 pm Reply with quote
S2 12 / 37:

Here we go.

We have to admit: we've been biased in our viewing of the Re:Zero universe. Why? Because we only see what happens based on what Subaru sees. Our view is limited by Subaru's view. Until now, we've only seen the good timeline: the one where Subaru lives. No, I'm sorry, scratch that. "Good" isn't the best choice of word... more like "surviving" timeline.

Let's say the surviving timeline is his 50th attempt: he survived this far after 50 attempts. That means he has failed 49 times. That sucks. But remember: that means there were 49 timelines where he died, and in these timelines life still went on. What happened to everyone after Subaru died in those timelines? He never thought about it, and neither did we. I can't blame him for it: why would anyone bother thinking about something that technically never happened? This is one of the tenets of epistemology: we only know what happened, not what didn't.

And before I get to the next talking point, I will raise one thought: did Subaru inadvertently create Satella by dying in the failed timelines? Is Subaru inadvertently making Satella more power the more times he fails and dies? Subaru recognizes how he basically caused Satella, but he has no idea to what extent his actions cause it. All actions have consequences.

By this time, I have to admit: Subaru's self-loathing is getting a little tiring. "If only I'm stronger"... "if only I knew"... "if only (somethingsomething), you wouldn't have died". Yeah yeah, I get it. Subaru blames himself and his weaknesses for everything that's happened, even if it's not entirely his fault all the time. I appreciate this rite of passage. But come on, let's move on from this.

SO! Let's update our tables of witches, shall we?

Quote:
Witch of Gluttony, Daphne - created beasts that defy the will of God to save the world from starvation
Witch of Lust, Carmilla – granted emotions to non-humans to fill the world with love
Witch of Wrath, Minerva – struck people to heal them as she lamented the state of her war-torn world
Witch of Sloth, Sekhmet – drove a dragon past the great waterfall for a chance to rest
Witch of Pride, Typhon – judged criminals (out of youthful innocence and cruelty)
Witch of Greed, Echidna – the embodiment of the thirst for knowledge
Witch of Envy, Satella – killed the other witches and used them for sustenance while making the whole world her enemy


ACxS wrote:
S2 9 / 34:
- Typhon: Witch of Pride, kid who's interested to know about people's moral grounds?
- Minerva: Witch of Wrath, tsundere girl who actually gave Subaru a legit advice ("don't be careless")
- Daphne: Witch of Gluttony, Iron Maiden who lives by the unforgiving code of "eat or be eaten"
- Echidna: Witch of Greed, tea party lady who's voracious for knowledge (it feels as though she's a knowledge broker)
- Satella: Witch of Envy, dark lady who's obsessed with Subaru and envious about his relationship to those around him?
- Sekhmet: Witch of Sloth, eh.... bombshell bumb? (Wanna see what she really does in our story, not just in lore)
- Carmilla: Witch of Lust, timid girl who shows people what they want to see (best used on people with confirmation bias issues, hurray!)


I said before that Subaru should be thankful to Echidna: he can ask her all kinds of questions to learn WTF is going in this universe. BUT! The one thing he should never do is to trust her. Depend on Echidna a little, sure. But to trust a witch? Just say "trust a witch", and you can feel a red flag being raised straight away. Enter a contract with a witch... blood-soaked red flag, please! This brings to my next talking point...

...but before that, I'm going to dig up another of my own quotes:

ACxS wrote:

Okay, Subaru amazes me. Why? One of Echidna's warnings: do not touch the Witch of Envy. One of Subaru's first things to do: touch the Witch of Pride's hand. I was almost tearing my hair off when Subaru's about to shake her hand. Was I shocked that he lost his arm and broke into pieces? Not shocked, but furious. In this Re:Zero universe, Subaru has learned the hard truth, and no, it's not "whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger". It's this: "whatever you don't know, is going to kill you." Subaru just has to learn everything the hard way.


*sigh facepalm* let me say this: if I have a business partner, I would never want him to be Subaru. This guy was about to sign a contract with a witch. Cue his dumb face while he's at it, too.

Let me ask you: when you hear a salesman utter "contract", what comes to your mind? T&C? The fine print? "What's in it for me?" or "what's in it for you"? Is he trying to cheat me? Best of all: am I a sucker? All the above? Then great; before writing your John Hancock, you ask yourself the important things. But Subaru? NAHHH. Echidna tells him the good stuff, but only the good stuff. "Good enough!". Oh good lord. But I will give him the benefit of doubt: after the trauma of learning all about the failed timelines and every sh*t that's happened, and with Echidna being his sole "empathic" listening ear and savior, he would be easily tempted by her offer.

That's Subaru's biggest problem: he's too trusting. Even when he's learned about how not everyone is driven by self-interest—refer to his talk with Otto in the cell—he still trusts some people too much. Not depending on someone (which is more "just doing business"), but trusting that someone is operating out of good intentions. Echidna is the Witch of Greed—apparently this fact isn't hammered enough in Subaru's head—who's only in it to hoard knowledge. That's her only motive: if people have to die many times for her to get more knowledge—à la how Roswaal would throw anyone under the bus for his "dearest wish"—then so be it. She's only in it for herself.

It's only after Minerva interrupted the contract signing, that Subaru finally started thinking straight. And then every other witch crashes the tea party. I hope Subaru realizes that all of them are witches who are only in it for themselves. Nobody's running a charity here. Please Subaru, I'm begging you, get this through your thick skull. You're surprised Echidna doesn't give two sh*ts about people's feelings—let alone Beatrice's—only now? You admit that Echidna's intentions might not be "100% good" all the time only now? Does the word "witch" not set off any alarm for you at all? Jeez.

Now Satella's joining the fun. What's your plan now, Subaru?


Last edited by ACxS on Thu Oct 01, 2020 12:01 am; edited 1 time in total
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DuskyPredator



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PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:12 am Reply with quote
To be fair, Subaru did just have to face the emotional turmoil of the idea of every failed timeline, which could have meant all the versions of people he loved being left behind, that idea of letting them down in his greatest trauma. But also it is like a defining trait that he has a big weakness for pretty faces. Going back to that whole part that he had to get over, I think that it partially comes from a bit of a sexist side of Subaru, he is quick to act to defend a girl in need, but that maybe partially comes from looking down on them as in need, as weak, and someone he can trust quickly. In terms of cultural analysis, a witch is kind of the perfect counterbalance, being historically women prosecuted for being too 'powerful', and in modern times are often seen as symbols for self empowerment from those expected to be without. I have seen my fair share of videos or essays that go into things like how witches have often been seen as icons for not only feminists but queer groups along the lines of the ostracized.

All coming down to say to never underestimate a witch, and Subaru with his protect the cutie mentality almost did exactly that. Not like being a witch automatically makes her evil, but Subaru lacked looking at Echidna as more than the useful things he could get out of her. Seems pretty clear that Echidna would probably love to even exploit the return by death so that she could greedily obtain as much information as she can, the linchpin seeming to be that Echidna would not care at all what the consequences would be in getting what she wanted. That does seem like a good warning for Subaru to avoid stooping to certain levels.

Cool to see the 6 deceased witches at once, that Echidna apparently lied about limitations. But the most exciting was the 7th, will Subaru actually be able to talk to Satella and be able to ask what it is she wants? Perhaps have some sort of conveying of borders so that Subaru can avoid upsetting her in the future, her maybe try and not be as possessive. Is Satella worthy of being treated like the enemy of the world?
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ACxS



Joined: 03 Aug 2019
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:19 am Reply with quote
Hence, the benefit of doubt I have to give him. I do have to question the timing of his experience with the "unthinkable pasts". Going through all of that just before Echidna gave him a contract that seemed too good to be true? Seems like something Echidna would have premeditated. Trying to pull a fast one there.

I have to ask now: is Subaru going to pit Satella (aka not-Emilia) against Echidna now? They have every reason to go after each other's jugular now. Oh this would be so amazing.
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