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EP. REVIEW: Talentless Nana


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#HayamiLover



Joined: 22 Jul 2018
Posts: 769
Location: Eastern Europe
PostPosted: Sat Nov 07, 2020 6:48 am Reply with quote
Is it just me or that the constant emphasis on the gender of an offensive character is toxic in itself? It's like you're trying to say that his masculine gender is part of why this character is toxic. If anyone tried to similarly refer to Nana's female gender as part of her toxicity as a two-faced killer, it would be obvious sexism and an abuse of the old prejudices of "dangerous femininity". But here it is for some reason normal.
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blahmoomoo



Joined: 27 Jan 2020
Posts: 80
PostPosted: Sat Nov 07, 2020 10:15 am Reply with quote
TexZero wrote:
ThatGuyWhoLikesThings wrote:

No, it works just fine, because we're talking about if she attempted to go against him earlier in the day, before the events in the shed. He literally even says at one point that if she doesn't go to meet him there, he'll go ahead and show the photos to everyone. That's the entire foundation of his blackmail - do what he says or he blabs about her being a murderer. It helps to have the most damning picture on him if it comes to that.


Again, no.

He already showcased fate cannot be changed. That means no matter what she tried prior to 10pm in the Shed he wouldn't have died. That's how and where he was doomed. There was 0 point to this asinine level of duplicitiness by a guy who didn't think anything would change. He had absolutely jack all to fear from Nana and had no reason to keep a photo on him. It's sloppy writing.


There are several things Nana could do that aren't just murdering him earlier. But also, his main motivation of the blackmail is to have fun with her by trapping her in his dorm room; otherwise, he would have shown off the photo at the cliffs much sooner. If she destroyed that photo, he wouldn't have anything on her to force her to stay. I suppose the photo of her choking him would be the next best thing, but she could wiggle out of that one. Since that photo happens in the future, the purpose behind the choking could be manipulated into something that isn't sinister, like a crash training course for what to do if you're being attacked by an enemy of humanity.

Additionally, because he believed he was about to kill her, he would need proof that he did it for justice. Without the photo showing she's the serial killer, he would be suspected as the serial killer instead. So having it on his person means he can immediately prove that her death was justified.
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ThatGuyWhoLikesThings



Joined: 04 Jul 2013
Posts: 857
PostPosted: Sat Nov 07, 2020 8:42 pm Reply with quote
TexZero wrote:
ThatGuyWhoLikesThings wrote:

No, it works just fine, because we're talking about if she attempted to go against him earlier in the day, before the events in the shed. He literally even says at one point that if she doesn't go to meet him there, he'll go ahead and show the photos to everyone. That's the entire foundation of his blackmail - do what he says or he blabs about her being a murderer. It helps to have the most damning picture on him if it comes to that.


Again, no.

He already showcased fate cannot be changed. That means no matter what she tried prior to 10pm in the Shed he wouldn't have died. That's how and where he was doomed. There was 0 point to this asinine level of duplicitiness by a guy who didn't think anything would change. He had absolutely jack all to fear from Nana and had no reason to keep a photo on him. It's sloppy writing.


I never said she had to try and kill him for him to show the picture to others. Just disobeying him *at all*. Please read what I say before you respond.

And this isn't completely relevant, but I should state that the picture doesn't actually show what day the attack is happening. Just the time and location. Nana deduces from the shape of the moon that it could be as soon as that very night, but that's not a guarantee, but Nana and Tsunekichi agree to go there that night anyway.


Last edited by ThatGuyWhoLikesThings on Sat Nov 07, 2020 8:51 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Cryten



Joined: 19 Jan 2019
Posts: 164
PostPosted: Sat Nov 07, 2020 8:46 pm Reply with quote
At this point can we just say that some of you think its pretty convenient that he had the photo on him in such a way to be found to create an episode hook. And others think its just fine and follows he trying to blackmail him.

You dont have to win. Both sides can continue to think that way and your not less for someone thinking otherwise.
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ThatGuyWhoLikesThings



Joined: 04 Jul 2013
Posts: 857
PostPosted: Sat Nov 07, 2020 8:56 pm Reply with quote
Cryten wrote:
At this point can we just say that some of you think its pretty convenient that he had the photo on him in such a way to be found to create an episode hook. And others think its just fine and follows he trying to blackmail him.

You dont have to win. Both sides can continue to think that way and your not less for someone thinking otherwise.


how dare you imply that we shouldn't tear out each other's throats over relatively minute plot details in a japanese cartoon, how dare
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Cryten



Joined: 19 Jan 2019
Posts: 164
PostPosted: Sat Nov 07, 2020 8:58 pm Reply with quote
Smile You made me chuckle.
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TexZero



Joined: 25 Oct 2017
Posts: 448
PostPosted: Sat Nov 07, 2020 10:21 pm Reply with quote
ThatGuyWhoLikesThings wrote:
Cryten wrote:
At this point can we just say that some of you think its pretty convenient that he had the photo on him in such a way to be found to create an episode hook. And others think its just fine and follows he trying to blackmail him.

You dont have to win. Both sides can continue to think that way and your not less for someone thinking otherwise.


how dare you imply that we shouldn't tear out each other's throats over relatively minute plot details in a japanese cartoon, how dare


The minute details matter though especially when it comes to the logical consistency of the world if we're meant to take the murderfest seriously.

But yes we shouldn't rip each others throat out over chinese cartoons.
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Probablytomorrow



Joined: 04 Aug 2019
Posts: 95
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2020 1:52 am Reply with quote
TexZero wrote:
This doesn't fit with his character of being a fatalist that explicity said fate can't be changed and him seeing his death and knowing it. If his death was certain as he proclaimed it was he wouldn't have thought he'd live

Sorry to step in, but I think the strangling photo only showed that Nana would attempt to murder Tsunekichi. Neither of them knew whether she would succeed. So Nana's fake photo is what convinced him that he didn't need to take desperate measures or something to ensure he'd survive the attack.
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TexZero



Joined: 25 Oct 2017
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2020 3:50 am Reply with quote
Probablytomorrow wrote:
TexZero wrote:
This doesn't fit with his character of being a fatalist that explicity said fate can't be changed and him seeing his death and knowing it. If his death was certain as he proclaimed it was he wouldn't have thought he'd live

Sorry to step in, but I think the strangling photo only showed that Nana would attempt to murder Tsunekichi. Neither of them knew whether she would succeed. So Nana's fake photo is what convinced him that he didn't need to take desperate measures or something to ensure he'd survive the attack.


Which is bollocks because fate can't be changed and he already saw days earlier that she'd kill him just as she had already killed her classmates.

It's logically inconsistent with his powers and his beliefs.
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Probablytomorrow



Joined: 04 Aug 2019
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2020 10:19 am Reply with quote
As I just said, the only thing that he foresaw was that she'd attack. The outcome was still his to control.
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TexZero



Joined: 25 Oct 2017
Posts: 448
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2020 3:44 pm Reply with quote
Probablytomorrow wrote:
As I just said, the only thing that he foresaw was that she'd attack. The outcome was still his to control.


Except no. He forsaw both of the killings of the prior students and his own.
To suddenly have a contrary piece of his evidence show up runs counter to his ability, his character and the plot. He knew she'd kill him and stated so multiple times. Not once did he state oh you'll just attack me and i'll thwart it and live.

You're trying to fill in the blanks for the show yourself and it doesn't work when the show itself tells you these things.
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blahmoomoo



Joined: 27 Jan 2020
Posts: 80
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2020 4:38 pm Reply with quote
He never saw the photo of himself dead with Nana over his body and detective and healer bursting into the room. Nana stole that from him right after that photo was taken (so he never saw it) and effectively replaced it with a fabricated photo of her appearing to be dead. Because of this fabricated photo, he was confident that he was going to kill her.

His visions come from his dreams and/or the act of sleeping, but he doesn't remember them. The five photos his camera takes at night are how he knows what those visions are.

He did see the photo of her choking him and that did end up occurring, but it turned out to be a failed attempt, not his actual cause of death.

This isn't reading between the lines. All of the above was outright shown or stated.
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TexZero



Joined: 25 Oct 2017
Posts: 448
PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2020 2:47 am Reply with quote
blahmoomoo wrote:
He never saw the photo of himself dead with Nana over his body and detective and healer bursting into the room. Nana stole that from him right after that photo was taken (so he never saw it) and effectively replaced it with a fabricated photo of her appearing to be dead. Because of this fabricated photo, he was confident that he was going to kill her.

His visions come from his dreams and/or the act of sleeping, but he doesn't remember them. The five photos his camera takes at night are how he knows what those visions are.

He did see the photo of her choking him and that did end up occurring, but it turned out to be a failed attempt, not his actual cause of death.

This isn't reading between the lines. All of the above was outright shown or stated.


Also stated but ignored.

He said he was going to be killed by her just like the previous photos of the other now missing students.

He said fate cannot be changed. His first image of Nana killing him would have sealed this fate regardless of what subseqeunt photos happened to emerge.

He wakes up the day of his death with 4 photos instead of 5. He grabs the planted photo (conviently i might add) of a strangeled Nana which again goes counter to his fate not being able to be changed.

It's at this point anyone and especially the scumbag should have know that was fake. Yes hubris is a bitch, but sloppy writing is more so. The show has logical consistency of a dog turd and it was further showcased in the most recent episode. It's so bad that they even poke fun at their own bad plotholes and inconsistencies with powers and have Nana give a rather non-sensical excuse as to why healer girl wasn't licking the dead guy and why her power wasn't actually draining her life anymore.
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Cryten



Joined: 19 Jan 2019
Posts: 164
PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2020 5:58 am Reply with quote
TexZero wrote:

He said he was going to be killed by her just like the previous photos of the other now missing students.

He said fate cannot be changed. His first image of Nana killing him would have sealed this fate regardless of what subseqeunt photos happened to emerge.


You seem to be struggle with this. The photo did not show his death, just that he would be attacked.

Episode 5. Timestamp 4:15, "Oh, but wait. We don`t know what happens after she attacks me. Am I gonna fight back? Or am I gonna let Nana kill me?"
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TexZero



Joined: 25 Oct 2017
Posts: 448
PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2020 5:40 pm Reply with quote
Cryten wrote:
TexZero wrote:

He said he was going to be killed by her just like the previous photos of the other now missing students.

He said fate cannot be changed. His first image of Nana killing him would have sealed this fate regardless of what subseqeunt photos happened to emerge.


You seem to be struggle with this. The photo did not show his death, just that he would be attacked.

Episode 5. Timestamp 4:15, "Oh, but wait. We don`t know what happens after she attacks me. Am I gonna fight back? Or am I gonna let Nana kill me?"


Episode 4: Timestamp 18:40 "What's all this about...The enemies of humanity don't kill me. Why's the new Leader going to kill me instead ?"

Shocking i know but i wasn't speaking out of my ass when i said he explicity fingered her multiple times in his death. For someone with the ability to see the future that cannot be changed he (and the writers) sure has a way of forgetting these things.
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