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NEWS: 4Kids Plans Sale of Major Yu-Gi-Oh! Assets to Firm Tied to Saban


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ARC-1300



Joined: 06 Feb 2012
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 7:32 pm Reply with quote
Animeking1108 wrote:
Maybe they'll bring Season Zero and finish GX & 5Ds.


(Season 0) Completely different studio dude, (toei animation) not happening
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kaiser11492



Joined: 19 Feb 2011
Posts: 159
PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2012 10:08 pm Reply with quote
TitanXL wrote:
Did we watch the same dub? I remember Gotsumon and Pumpkinmon got sent to Myotismon's Digi-Dungeon. While in Japan, Vamdemon killed Gotsumon and Pumpmon in cold blood by having his bats devour their bodies.

WaruMonzaemon as well, since I remember that cheesy line "Ow, he shot my paw", rather than Mugendramon tearing him to shreds and killing him.


I never said Digimon was the perfect dub. But 4kids dubs are more extreme in comparison. Saban's Digimon at least had some tolerable entertainment. In Digimon 02, they explain how Ken's brother and Cody's father had died. Despite changing Revolvermon's name to Deputymon, Saban still depicted him to be a walking revolver, and this was a Saturday morning show! Also season 3 was one of the darkest series and even with edits, it still retained it's overall dark appearance. Season 3 also had the character Mitsuo Yamaki, who was depicted constantly flicking his lighter.

4kids, however, doesn't think death exists, believes depicting a gun/lighter means the end of the world, and reduces the seriousness of its plot.

Note: about the scene with Pumpkinmon and Gotsumon, i remember watching it and i knew that they were killed even though they never said it because of the reactions of the some of the characters and the situation. We see Myotismon send one of his attacks at the two while Matt tells T.K. to not look, indicating something horrific was happening. Afterwards, all we see is Pumpkinmon's axe and a piece of Gotsumon fall to the ground and disintegrate.

TitanXL wrote:
Though to be frank, I doubt Yu-Gi-Oh would ever air unedited on TV unless it's Adult Swim. Kids shows in Japan can get away with things like rape, death, blood, and all that stuff, but it's limited to adult shows here.


I disagree with this statement. first of all, kids watching anime in Japan aren't getting messed up and creating chaos. second, rape is something that is going to be taboo in most parts of the world. third, if anime can't show things such as death, blood, and innuendo, then how come Western animation gets away with it more? (ex. Disney animated movies are for kids, yet can appeal to adults because of their dark undertones. just look at the Hellfire scene from Hunchback of Notre Dame. heck, even Spongebob gets away with more things than 4kids' shows.)
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ConanSan



Joined: 13 Jun 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:10 am Reply with quote
Digimon as a dub worked for when the dramatic moments where necessary (Izzy's parents, "That's what I'm supposed to do", The Running Gag of Leomon, etc) and over time learned what could and could not work on the network and as such established a mature for the audience stance for a children's anime.

Then The Disney buyout happened and then they went Ape-spit dubbing Tamers, giving us a near uncut experience (Including child nudity, not congratulating such a thing, just noting it there).

4Kids however was more one of spits and spats, at worst. Sometimes they'd have their A Game (The Kanto bit of Pokemon, Shaman King, Ultimate Muscle) and other times they'd hoist thier Z game on everyone (Verious bits of YuGiOh, One Piece, Tokyo Mew Mew). There just happens to be a lot of Z Game and scant little A game.

Samari Pizza Cats is allowed it's "Hack Job" for one very good reason, it doesn't even attempt to be the translation of Cat Ninja Legend Teyandee. In a way, it's closer to Saban's work with Power Rangers than it ever was an anime dub.

To Some degree, Funimation's dubs of Shin Chan and Sgt. Frog take a similar, if not as militant in the case of Frog, approach and are genearly considered to be very good versions of those shows.
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enurtsol



Joined: 01 May 2007
Posts: 14196
PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:52 am Reply with quote
kaiser11492 wrote:

TitanXL wrote:
Though to be frank, I doubt Yu-Gi-Oh would ever air unedited on TV unless it's Adult Swim. Kids shows in Japan can get away with things like rape, death, blood, and all that stuff, but it's limited to adult shows here.


I disagree with this statement. first of all, kids watching anime in Japan aren't getting messed up and creating chaos. second, rape is something that is going to be taboo in most parts of the world. third, if anime can't show things such as death, blood, and innuendo, then how come Western animation gets away with it more? (ex. Disney animated movies are for kids, yet can appeal to adults because of their dark undertones. just look at the Hellfire scene from Hunchback of Notre Dame. heck, even Spongebob gets away with more things than 4kids' shows.)


It's a double-standard.

Plus, as in the example of Saban distributing DBZ for Funimation, Saban was extra-strict because they didn't want to get in trouble for something they didn't even create (and thus don't largely own and profit much from).
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TitanXL



Joined: 08 Jun 2010
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:44 am Reply with quote
Animeking1108 wrote:
Maybe they'll bring Season Zero and finish GX & 5Ds.


Like Arc said, Yu-Gi-Oh completely unrelated to Yu-Gi-Oh Duel Monsters. They're not made by the same company or related to any way (and not a 'season zero', whatever that means. There's no seasons in the original, and I'm not sure how you have a zero season anyway) Chances are Toei wont given the license out to anyone, or even they legally can't since they no long own 'Yu-Gi-Oh' rights.

kaiser11492 wrote:
I never said Digimon was the perfect dub. But 4kids dubs are more extreme in comparison. Saban's Digimon at least had some tolerable entertainment. In Digimon 02, they explain how Ken's brother and Cody's father had died. Despite changing Revolvermon's name to Deputymon, Saban still depicted him to be a walking revolver, and this was a Saturday morning show! Also season 3 was one of the darkest series and even with edits, it still retained it's overall dark appearance. Season 3 also had the character Mitsuo Yamaki, who was depicted constantly flicking his lighter.


If you say so. I always found them to be completely unenjoyable. Reducing your final villain to cracking bad punny jokes and complaining about how he only gets to eat pizza crust while the rest of the world gets all the pepperoni and cheese does a great job of ruining the 'seriousness of the plot' as you say. Digimon was notorious for all it's horrible one-liners and puns. Not to mention the abomination that was the movie that mashed three unrelated movies together. And as opposed to masterful duo of Wada Kouji and AiM, we get Smash Mouth, Barenaked Ladies, and other pop songs. Lovely.

Quote:
I disagree with this statement. first of all, kids watching anime in Japan aren't getting messed up and creating chaos. second, rape is something that is going to be taboo in most parts of the world. third, if anime can't show things such as death, blood, and innuendo, then how come Western animation gets away with it more? (ex. Disney animated movies are for kids, yet can appeal to adults because of their dark undertones. just look at the Hellfire scene from Hunchback of Notre Dame. heck, even Spongebob gets away with more things than 4kids' shows.)


I said they can't, not that they shouldn't. I'm just saying Cartoon Network or whoever is not going to air any Yu-Gi-Oh series uncut no matter who dubs it, series where an older brother contemplates suffocating his newborn baby brother to death in his crib, or a teacher attempts to blackmail and rape one of his students. Maybe I need to watch some of the newer episodes, but I don't think Spongebob gets away with more than that.

And more than likely anyone who gets Yu-Gi-Oh! is going to be whipped by Konami of America into doing their bidding and following their procedures, which will hamper things.
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baadaku12345



Joined: 21 Feb 2010
Posts: 179
PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:06 am Reply with quote
Primus wrote:
Teriyaki Terrier wrote:
4kids, after all this time, now you decide to sell the Yu-Gi-Oh license? Oh wait, this is 4kids we are talking about, so no surprise at all this doesn't really make much sense.

At least though, even though I don't watch Yu-Gi-Oh, this series was given to a slightly better company. Yeah Saban did have their mishaps, but they are hardly as bad as 4kids, but then again, with the possible exception of Tokyo Pop, few companies have missed the mark as much as 4kids have.


Yeah, Saban's totally better than 4Kids, they stream all of those Super Sentai shows online with Japanese audio. Imagine if 4Kids did that with Yu-Gi-Oh!...

That was sarcasm, with Saban at the helms the streams 4Kids were doing will likely end. Not only that, based on Power Rangers Samurai you'll get even worse acting, and almost all the same changes!


Yeah, as much as people like to complain about 4Kids, they do stream subtitled Japanese Yugioh, and I cannot see Saban doing the same thing. And I guess we can kiss that "Bonds Beyond Time" DVD release goodbye, though I don't think 4Kids was going to release it anyways.
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TaiChiChasers



Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 57
PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 2:48 pm Reply with quote
SOMEONE PLEASE ANSWER MY QUESTION!
Does this mean Saban will take control over the dubbing or will 4Kids still retain that right?!?!?!?!
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Saffire
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Joined: 25 Nov 2007
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Location: Iowa, USA
PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 2:56 pm Reply with quote
TaiChiChasers wrote:
SOMEONE PLEASE ANSWER MY QUESTION!
Does this mean Saban will take control over the dubbing or will 4Kids still retain that right?!?!?!?!
The article sounds like 4Kids is getting rid of the whole thing, so they won't be involved at all. No one has any idea at this point what Saban's plans for it are.
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PurpleWarrior13



Joined: 05 Sep 2009
Posts: 1906
PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:39 pm Reply with quote
TitanXL wrote:
PurpleWarrior13 wrote:
Yeah there are certain anime that would only work with very accurate dubs (Fullmetal Alchemist, Revolutionary Girl Utena, Akira, etc), but for a fun show like Samurai Pizza Cats, you're only watching to have a good time!


So basically "if it's a show I like, it needs a proper dub, but for a show I don't, it can be butchered for all I care". That stance only works until it's a show you like that gets the treatment, then it falls apart. If I don't like Fullmetal Alchemist, then I can say it should have a gutted dub and no one but fanboys would care. I watch anime to have fun, it's a fun show, so mess it up. That's basically what you're saying now.

See, everyone's just fine with saying One Piece or Yu-Gi-Oh are awful dubs, but as soon as it's SPC, it's "Oh no man, my childhood, that's horse crap" Despite there being zero difference.

Well go look on YouTube and see how many kids praise and love 4Kids One Piece and Yu-Gi-Oh to death. That's their childhood. We know better because we didn't grow up on it and don't have nostalgic ties to it, but to them, they're doing the same thing as people who actually defend SPC.


I never said that a show like SPC SHOULD have an inaccurate dub. I'm just saying that comedy shows could very well be tolerable with a rewritten script adapted to American audiences, and add jokes that WE would find funny and understand (of course, I've never seen the original version of SPC, so I don't know how applicable that would be). They could be done straight if they wanted, but I'm not sure how funnier it would be. Though a re-written script would have to be done well. It's VERY easy to screw something like that up. I'm personally not very fond of FUNi's version of Shin-Chan, but then again, I'm not really a fan of that show as a whole. I DO like their version of Sgt. Frog, but that stuck relatively close to the premise. The only changes in the show were done to the jokes themselves (plus the Japanese version is included in their release).

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but many people seem to be just fine with what we've got. Of course, there's nothing wrong with liking the Japanese version either... whatever rocks your boat. People have different tastes. I just don't like it when people bash other people's opinions on this sort of subject and treat their own opinions as fact, when that's not the case (there's obviously no such thing as a "true" or "false" opinion).


Arguing against someone's nostalgia is always a losing battle, but that's not really factual evidence of anything either. What makes a bad dub then if not tons of edits, awful voice-acting, blatant disregard for the script, skipped episodes, gutted music, changed character personalities, and all that stuff? I don't see how it's much of an opinion. All these series suffer from it, but suddenly we're giving pardons to certain series based on arbitrary criteria?


That's an opinion. Those (except for the bad voice acting, but even that's subjective) just make it different.

BTW, the original YGO series cannot be released to the states subbed. They tried, but apparently there was some issue with Yugi's Japanese voice actor that prevented it from being released with his voice. They should've kept Megumi Ogata. She was a MUCH better Yugi than whoever voiced in the later series.

As for Saban, if they are indeed taking control over the English version, then they'll likely at least get the original cast back. They don't always deal with LA voiceover talent. They've also dealt with New Zealand talent (with newer Power Rangers) and Vancouver talent (with DBZ).

Another thing: I can't see how KidsCo has anything to do with Saban. According to their Wikipedia page, they have more of a connection to Nelvana, Cookie Jar, and DiC: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KidsCo
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TitanXL



Joined: 08 Jun 2010
Posts: 4036
PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 4:22 pm Reply with quote
baadaku12345 wrote:
Yeah, as much as people like to complain about 4Kids, they do stream subtitled Japanese Yugioh, and I cannot see Saban doing the same thing.


That's a bit giving them too much credit I think.

-They don't have Duel Monsters subbed on their site
-They don't have GX subbed on their site
-The last 30+ episodes of 5Ds are not on their site
-Only the first few episodes of ZeXal are subbed on their site.

ZeXal's series and fansubs are at 50+ in Japan. Being 40+ episodes (almost a year) behind isn't a very good streaming service. Not to mention their subs use the American names, so they're not really worth watching regardless.

So basically we'd be losing out on less than one series worth of episodes with questionable subs. It's not really something we should be really be crying over.

PurpleWarrior13 wrote:
I never said that a show like SPC SHOULD have an inaccurate dub. I'm just saying that comedy shows could very well be tolerable with a rewritten script adapted to American audiences, and add jokes that WE would find funny and understand (of course, I've never seen the original version of SPC, so I don't know how applicable that would be).


Well that's debatable, especially when you realize Shin-chan aired unaltered in many other countries.

But I wouldn't say Kyatto Ninden Teyandee is a comedy show. An action/comedy, sure, but it's not a pure comedy/sitcom like Shin-chan. It's still an action show.
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dragonrider_cody



Joined: 14 Jun 2008
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 7:18 pm Reply with quote
PurpleWarrior13 wrote:
: I can't see how KidsCo has anything to do with Saban. According to their Wikipedia page, they have more of a connection to Nelvana, Cookie Jar, and DiC: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KidsCo


Wrong KidsCo. If you look at the dates and locations, the KidsCo you linked to is an international partnership. The KidsCo that is attempting to buy Yugioh was just incorporated at the beginning of April and is an American company. The two don't appear to be related.

The Saban connection is because the new company shares the same address as Saban's corporate headquarters. Saban is also acting as guarantor for the deal. Though I suppose it's possible Saban could be working with the international KidsCo group as some sort of coventure. They have wanted to launch I the US for a few years. But that doesn't appear to be the case right now.

Here is a link to a more detailed story on the matter: http://www.c21media.net/archives/80648
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kaiser11492



Joined: 19 Feb 2011
Posts: 159
PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 9:00 pm Reply with quote
TitanXL wrote:
kaiser11492 wrote:
I never said Digimon was the perfect dub. But 4kids dubs are more extreme in comparison. Saban's Digimon at least had some tolerable entertainment. In Digimon 02, they explain how Ken's brother and Cody's father had died. Despite changing Revolvermon's name to Deputymon, Saban still depicted him to be a walking revolver, and this was a Saturday morning show! Also season 3 was one of the darkest series and even with edits, it still retained it's overall dark appearance. Season 3 also had the character Mitsuo Yamaki, who was depicted constantly flicking his lighter.


If you say so. I always found them to be completely unenjoyable. Reducing your final villain to cracking bad punny jokes and complaining about how he only gets to eat pizza crust while the rest of the world gets all the pepperoni and cheese does a great job of ruining the 'seriousness of the plot' as you say. Digimon was notorious for all it's horrible one-liners and puns. Not to mention the abomination that was the movie that mashed three unrelated movies together. And as opposed to masterful duo of Wada Kouji and AiM, we get Smash Mouth, Barenaked Ladies, and other pop songs. Lovely.


I guess we just have different levels of dub tolerance. If it did have many one-liner jokes and puns, then i don't remember them being as bad as the ones made by 4kids. the only thing i found disappointing with the movie was how they made Willis the creator of Diaboromon. still even though it wasn't the perfect dub, it's better than anything 4kids has done.

TitanXL wrote:
Kaiser11492 wrote:
I disagree with this statement. first of all, kids watching anime in Japan aren't getting messed up and creating chaos. second, rape is something that is going to be taboo in most parts of the world. third, if anime can't show things such as death, blood, and innuendo, then how come Western animation gets away with it more? (ex. Disney animated movies are for kids, yet can appeal to adults because of their dark undertones. just look at the Hellfire scene from Hunchback of Notre Dame. heck, even Spongebob gets away with more things than 4kids' shows.)


I said they can't, not that they shouldn't. I'm just saying Cartoon Network or whoever is not going to air any Yu-Gi-Oh series uncut no matter who dubs it, series where an older brother contemplates suffocating his newborn baby brother to death in his crib, or a teacher attempts to blackmail and rape one of his students. Maybe I need to watch some of the newer episodes, but I don't think Spongebob gets away with more than that.


But have you ever watched any of Disney's animation, most notably the Hunchback of Notre Dame? We have in the first scene the bad guy about to kill a baby by dropping it into a well. then we have the bad guy lustfully sniffing the main female protagonist's hair and he later describes how his lust for her is tearing him from the inside. may i also add the bad guy is a pure, manipulative, racist monster. And may I remind you this is Disney.

The Yu-Gi-Oh! scenes mentioned above have the words contemplate and attempt, meaning everything was implied and not actually being depicted.
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PurpleWarrior13



Joined: 05 Sep 2009
Posts: 1906
PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2012 11:07 pm Reply with quote
dragonrider_cody wrote:
PurpleWarrior13 wrote:
: I can't see how KidsCo has anything to do with Saban. According to their Wikipedia page, they have more of a connection to Nelvana, Cookie Jar, and DiC: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KidsCo


Wrong KidsCo. If you look at the dates and locations, the KidsCo you linked to is an international partnership. The KidsCo that is attempting to buy Yugioh was just incorporated at the beginning of April and is an American company. The two don't appear to be related.

The Saban connection is because the new company shares the same address as Saban's corporate headquarters. Saban is also acting as guarantor for the deal. Though I suppose it's possible Saban could be working with the international KidsCo group as some sort of coventure. They have wanted to launch I the US for a few years. But that doesn't appear to be the case right now.

Here is a link to a more detailed story on the matter: http://www.c21media.net/archives/80648


Good point. Maybe if it is the same company, Saban is partnering with their US branch??? No matter, whoever it is, seems to have purchased most major assets 4Kids has at the moment. I think it's safe to say that 4Kids may have just been bought out.
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enurtsol



Joined: 01 May 2007
Posts: 14196
PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 4:02 am Reply with quote
PurpleWarrior13 wrote:

I never said that a show like SPC SHOULD have an inaccurate dub. I'm just saying that comedy shows could very well be tolerable with a rewritten script adapted to American audiences, and add jokes that WE would find funny and understand (of course, I've never seen the original version of SPC, so I don't know how applicable that would be). They could be done straight if they wanted, but I'm not sure how funnier it would be. Though a re-written script would have to be done well. It's VERY easy to screw something like that up.


Yeah, it could easily be screwed up, but it could also be done successfully. Like SPC, nobody cared for the Shinesman OAV, even amongst fansub circles, until the rewritten dub was released. An American example is Sealab 2021 - nobody even remembers the original, and that's because when they showed clips of the original, it actually wasn't memorable like the new rewrite. Yet another cult American success of a Japanese rewrite was MXC of Takeshi's Castle.
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kusanagi-sama



Joined: 22 Aug 2004
Posts: 1721
Location: Wichita Falls, TX
PostPosted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 12:50 am Reply with quote
PurpleWarrior13 wrote:
dragonrider_cody wrote:
PurpleWarrior13 wrote:
: I can't see how KidsCo has anything to do with Saban. According to their Wikipedia page, they have more of a connection to Nelvana, Cookie Jar, and DiC: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KidsCo


Wrong KidsCo. If you look at the dates and locations, the KidsCo you linked to is an international partnership. The KidsCo that is attempting to buy Yugioh was just incorporated at the beginning of April and is an American company. The two don't appear to be related.

The Saban connection is because the new company shares the same address as Saban's corporate headquarters. Saban is also acting as guarantor for the deal. Though I suppose it's possible Saban could be working with the international KidsCo group as some sort of coventure. They have wanted to launch I the US for a few years. But that doesn't appear to be the case right now.

Here is a link to a more detailed story on the matter: http://www.c21media.net/archives/80648


Good point. Maybe if it is the same company, Saban is partnering with their US branch??? No matter, whoever it is, seems to have purchased most major assets 4Kids has at the moment. I think it's safe to say that 4Kids may have just been bought out.


Well, 4Kids essentially doesn't exist anymore. Konami bought their US headquarters and Saban bought the CW4Kids block.

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