Forum - View topicChicks On Anime - Fansubs (Pt 1)
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Unit 03.5-ish
Posts: 1540 Location: This space for rent |
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tl;dr
Sounded like a bunch of BLAH BLAH BLAH R2 DVDS ARE ALWAYS BETTER ENGLISH DUBS SUCK 'CAUSE I THINK THE CHARACTERS SOUND LIKE HOMOSEXUALS BLAH BLAH BLAH TRUE OTAKU And reading the tail end of what you said, there's no such thing as a "somewhat" illegal fansub. They're ILLEGAL, period. And you said the other posts here were too long to read when you posted a BARELY comprehensible collection of very scattered thoughts and random statements. Oi. Vey. EDIT: my intro to "modern" anime (i.e., stuff I knew was Japanese in origin, not tricked into thinking it was US-made a la Robotech, Voltron, G-Force, etc.) was the VHS version of NGE. I took a chance on it, at the tender age of 14, and had my perceptions of what a "cartoon" can be forever altered. Last edited by Unit 03.5-ish on Tue Feb 03, 2009 4:04 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Animehermit
 Posts: 964 Location: The Argama |
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WOW, just wow, either your a troll or an idiot. truth be told, i've seen more anime than most, and i don't give a damn about karaoke effects, or any of the other bull crap reasons you listed, official translations will and always will be better than fansub translations, thats reason enough to buy them. |
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samuelp
Industry Insider
Posts: 2231 Location: San Antonio, USA |
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In regards to letniinside's post:
See what you've created, fansubbers? (Note, I include myself in that group  )
In the book of history yet to be written of anime, this chapter will likely be titled: "Unintended Consequences" Last edited by samuelp on Tue Feb 03, 2009 4:06 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Ai no Kareshi
 Posts: 561 Location: South Africa |
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Can we all just agree not to respond to letniinside's post? It hurts my eyes and my intellect, and quoting it only makes it worse...
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samuelp
Industry Insider
Posts: 2231 Location: San Antonio, USA |
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See, that was mine, too, except I'm pretty sure the VHS I saw were fansubs of NGE that my college roomate was watching. Then, later on that year I rented the official VHS tapes from a local video store. So, I guess the background is mixed, then: I would have never rented those tapes if I hadn't seen a few episodes earlier that were (VHS) fansubs... but I didn't even know what fansubs were at the time. |
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teh*darkness
 Posts: 901 |
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I totally agree with you. Imho, the point of fansubbing was to help shows gain popularity, help licensors figure out which ones would sell, and then we get good anime in the US. Problem is, more and more people started watching anime for free, same as they would on tv, and they don't have that "collector spirit", and they ask why they should buy it on DVD when they've already watched it? The market got flooded as more and more good shows came out following huge fanbases created by fansubs, creating huge followings over here, more people learned about anime, they all went online and discovered fansubs, and stopped watching it on tv or buying the releases. Now all the fans created off of fansubs just want it faster and faster, now now now. And now, people like us are being left in the cold, as these 'fans', younger and younger, probably still in highschool, with/out jobs, living at home, no money to buy anime, say "I want more anime online, for free, hours after it airs in Japan. This is the future of anime distribution!", without realizing the logistics of actually making money off this setup. And where does it leave people like us, who prefer physical media, who like to hold something in their hand, and say they've supported what they love? I'm sorry, but watching an episode online, and dealing with the ads does not really make the company a whole heckuva lot of money. And I refuse to go to CR. They are crooks and thieves who have been rewarded for their crimes, and I refuse to support them in any way, shape, or form. If I feel like subjecting myself to horribly tiny, grainy and questionable streams of Naruto, I'll go to Naruto.com, and watch them there. I'm already buying the boxsets as they come out, and I was already watching the new episodes for free within a day or two of it airing. Why should I have to pay them for a horribly lower quality streaming file for the same timeframe? And if I want it for free, I only get the crappiest one available, a week after it's aired. I'm sorry, but screw you CR. I'll keep watching my fansubs, and giving my money to Viz as they release the DVDs. And honestly, this is my opinion on streaming as a whole. It's only a placeholder until the eventual DVD release, just like fansubs. If I don't enjoy a show, I stop watching after one or two episodes, I don't keep watching just so I can talk with everyone else about every show. Most of the time, I never even start half the series I download, and end up deleting them when I need more space. Streaming isn't a solution for a lack of HDD space. It's a solution for those with an anime addiction who have no money to support it, and never plan to.
And this point is so completely true. Though nowadays, people do come into anime due to fansubs, because their friends who watch fansubs invite them over to watch... fansubs. But I'd venture that the majority of people who watch fansubs and then buy the DVD releases probably got into anime from seeing it on tv or borrowing from a friend. I know I started out by watching DBZ, Tenchi Muyo, Gundam Wing and Outlaw Star on Cartoon Network. Then .hack//SIGN aired on Saturday afternoons. That's the series that finally did it for me. I went out and bought it when the DVDs came out, then followed shortly by Gundam SEED, then Rurouni Kenshin, after a friend told me about it. This was back in 2001 or so. It wasn't until 2005 that I saw a fansub, and that was Bleach, and only after having been reading Viz's release of the manga since Summer 2004, and seeing in NewType USA that there was an anime airing in Japan. A poll would be a very interesting thing to see on this issue. Maybe even throw in questions about how old we were when we first saw anime, and how old we are now, for demographic purposes, though maybe make them optional fields. |
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Unit 03.5-ish
Posts: 1540 Location: This space for rent |
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I'm surprised how civil the conversation has been, with a few exceptions (BLARGH INCOHERENT FANBOY RAMBLING AHOY). I know I've made my stance on fansubs clearer than a pane of glass, and I do enjoy debates that don't devolve into name-calling, personal attacks, or strawman arguments. I remember when the biggest argument in the fandom was "OMG DUBZ SUCK SUBS RUUUUULE", and yet dubs have gained a lot more acceptance since then. Fansubs have always been part of anime fandom, though, and I, for one, am curious to see what solutions companies will attempt in the coming year.
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Ai no Kareshi
Posts: 561 Location: South Africa |
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I know I'm the one who said not to respond, but I'll only do this once, I swear... There.
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Unit 03.5-ish
Posts: 1540 Location: This space for rent |
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Why am I bothering to respond to nii? Maybe it's the insomnia or the fact that I'm waiting for parts of my art project to dry and need something to do in between.
R1 DVDs are not cheap, poorly-manufactured copies. You've made this argument before, and have no evidence to back it up. The digital transfers are, in fact, better than ever these days, and from what I've seen, even with FUNi stretching their discs to the limits with up to 7 episodes sometimes, there really is no discernible quality loss. Exorbitant import fees are not something I want to throw money at, and I'm more than happy with my "inferior" R1 collection as-is. |
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Asrialys
 Posts: 1160 |
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I'm glad to be a collector of anime. Maybe I buy too much, but I like what I get anyway. I do feel for those, though, that live outside North America who have fewer opportunities.
I got into anime through Toonami, then Blockbuster VHS and DVD rentals of Evangelion and Steel Angel Kurumi. I eventually got to buying Chrono Crusade and Evangelion. It was shortly after that an online friend of mine got me into fansubs. Admittedly, I've been watching them ever since. And there were a few times where I downloaded dubbed material. I didn't really know better at the time. However, after I learned more, I completely stopped watching licensed material. What I'm doing is still illegal, but I have a few personal principles I like to follow. Last edited by Asrialys on Tue Feb 03, 2009 6:25 am; edited 3 times in total |
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Unit 03.5-ish
Posts: 1540 Location: This space for rent |
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I have something to say to the people who are saying they use fansubs to view the shows we might never get.
Why don't you learn Japanese? Then you can either move to Tokyo or import the R2s, and that way, you WILL be legally supporting the industry in a more direct way. But aside from our board members residing in La Tierra de Sol Subida, is anyone willing to go to such lengths? Most people probably aren't. Because I don't have that gumption, I choose to instead support the R1 industry, exercise patience when it comes to viewing new shows, and feel comfortable knowing that nothing weighs heavily on my conscience in regards to this matter. |
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Ai no Kareshi
Posts: 561 Location: South Africa |
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Easier said than done, buddy. Sure, the basics of the language are quite straight forward, but mastering a foreign language is no simple task. It took me more than five years to attain the proficiency level I now hold, and while I can watch many shows raw, I'm still more comfortable with some subtitles to aid me. Also, I doubt half of the anime fans out there have the time or devotion to undertake such a mission. There are many good arguments against fansubs, but I'm afraid I find this one pretty poor. |
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Unit 03.5-ish
Posts: 1540 Location: This space for rent |
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I was more trying to make the point that if people really think they deserve to see these shows for free, then their only option is to learn the language and move to Japan. That's the ONLY way for them to see these shows in their raw format on a legal TV station.
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Ai no Kareshi
Posts: 561 Location: South Africa |
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I wish that would change, though. |
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ikillchicken
 Posts: 7272 Location: Vancouver |
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You know, letniinside actually raises an interesting point: What about people who are just that [expletive] stupid. I'm not making fun of him here (well, okay, I am a bit) but also I think it's a genuinely interesting question regarding fansubs. It's my belief (or at least my hope) that with legitimate distribution methods moving further towards meeting the demands required by fansubs, the two can come to an acceptable balance. There will be no need to sub stuff that is legitimately distributed and people can keep on subbing old or obscure stuff which is harmless. However, the key idea that this theory counts on is that people will not delude themselves into believing for some reason that the legitimate version is inferior. It's here that I worry because there really isn't much R1 companies can do. If people think this nonsense nothing will change their minds.
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