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NEWS: Bleach Ends Watchmen's 11-Month Run as #1 Graphic Novel


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littlegreenwolf



Joined: 10 Aug 2002
Posts: 4796
Location: Seattle, WA
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 2:41 pm Reply with quote
LeoKnight25 wrote:
My beef isn't with just Watchmen, per se. It's more with what the American comic industry did after Watchmen came out, which was try and copy that and the Dark Knight Returns. The dreary darkness and hopelessness of the current American scene is really stifling. Everyone wants to write the same things over and over. It's my main reason for dropping just about everything Marvel and DC are doing right now. I just don't want to read so much overly depressing stories, as good as they may be. I'd rather read something that lifts my spirits and Bleach is doing a really good job of that as of late.


Some would argue that everyone isn't copying Moore and Miller, two men who have very different styles in story telling. Instead what happened was those two opened up the world of comics from the drill little happy go lucky spandex monster of the week club that was American Comics (something up til that point thought of only for little boys) and made comics a force to be taken as a serious story telling medium. It made it so some people who otherwise wouldn't pick up a comic would suddenly gain interest, while at the same time paving the way for tons of underground and unconventional comics.

And like arachneia has made example of there are PLENTY of fantastic comics published here in the US since, particularly those of DC's Vertigo imprint.

But why do we even need to keep only to American and Japanese comics? V for Vendetta for example was originally published in England under an old, now defunct comic publisher, and titles such as Marjane Satrapi's Persepolis are in the same non-fictional vein as Spielgelman's Maus. Persepolis is a title that's I'd love to see at #1 over here and I think the whole country could benefit from reading it.
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Colonel Wolfe



Joined: 05 Aug 2004
Posts: 370
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 4:46 pm Reply with quote
animehermit, as anyone will tell you, Japanese anime are not cartoons. 99% of those who frequent ANN just follow the trends and don't treat anime as the series cultural event that anime fans from Japan take them in.

The recurring problem I've seen from those who post here on the forums are fans who are into anime simply for the popularity of the genre.

I can tell you that if you head over to the forums at Megatokyo, a community that has dedicated itself to Japanese anime, which has serviced the online community for over 20 years, a lot longer than ANN, that you'll find yourself getting flamed and banned for suggesting such a thing.

Shows such as Bleach, One Piece, Pokemon, Digimon, Naruto and others like that just show how stupified American anime fans have become.

There is just so much anime out there that is considered more serious than those I mentioned. I just think that ANN needs to do more in getting its facts straight than reporting that Bleach Volume 27 has spent 11 months as the top #1 book when the manga volume mentioned had only been released last month.

I wish I could see into the future like ANN does.
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Colonel Wolfe



Joined: 05 Aug 2004
Posts: 370
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 4:47 pm Reply with quote
animehermit, as anyone will tell you, Japanese anime are not cartoons. 99% of those who frequent ANN just follow the trends and don't treat anime as the series cultural event that anime fans from Japan take them in.

The recurring problem I've seen from those who post here on the forums are fans who are into anime simply for the popularity of the genre.

I can tell you that if you head over to the forums at Megatokyo, a community that has dedicated itself to Japanese anime, which has serviced the online community for over 20 years, a lot longer than ANN, that you'll find yourself getting flamed and banned for suggesting such a thing.

Shows such as Bleach, One Piece, Pokemon, Digimon, Naruto and others like that just show how stupified American anime fans have become.

There is just so much anime out there that is considered more serious than those I mentioned. I just think that ANN needs to do more in getting its facts straight than reporting that Bleach Volume 27 has spent 11 months as the top #1 book when the manga volume mentioned had only been released last month.

I wish I could see into the future like ANN does.
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Colonel Wolfe



Joined: 05 Aug 2004
Posts: 370
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 4:48 pm Reply with quote
animehermit, as anyone will tell you, Japanese anime are not cartoons. 99% of those who frequent ANN just follow the trends and don't treat anime as the series cultural event that anime fans from Japan take them in.

The recurring problem I've seen from those who post here on the forums are fans who are into anime simply for the popularity of the genre.

I can tell you that if you head over to the forums at Megatokyo, a community that has dedicated itself to Japanese anime, which has serviced the online community for over 20 years, a lot longer than ANN, that you'll find yourself getting flamed and banned for suggesting such a thing.

Shows such as Bleach, One Piece, Pokemon, Digimon, Naruto and others like that just show how stupified American anime fans have become.

There is just so much anime out there that is considered more serious than those I mentioned. I just think that ANN needs to do more in getting its facts straight than reporting that Bleach Volume 27 has spent 11 months as the top #1 book when the manga volume mentioned had only been released last month.

I wish I could see into the future like ANN does.
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Animehermit



Joined: 05 Aug 2007
Posts: 964
Location: The Argama
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 5:07 pm Reply with quote
Colonel Wolfe wrote:
some nonsensical BS, in triplicate


not even gonna bother
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littlegreenwolf



Joined: 10 Aug 2002
Posts: 4796
Location: Seattle, WA
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 5:44 pm Reply with quote
Colonel Wolfe wrote:
animehermit, as anyone will tell you, Japanese anime are not cartoons. 99% of those who frequent ANN just follow the trends and don't treat anime as the series cultural event that anime fans from Japan take them in.

The recurring problem I've seen from those who post here on the forums are fans who are into anime simply for the popularity of the genre.

I can tell you that if you head over to the forums at Megatokyo, a community that has dedicated itself to Japanese anime, which has serviced the online community for over 20 years, a lot longer than ANN, that you'll find yourself getting flamed and banned for suggesting such a thing.

Shows such as Bleach, One Piece, Pokemon, Digimon, Naruto and others like that just show how stupified American anime fans have become.

There is just so much anime out there that is considered more serious than those I mentioned. I just think that ANN needs to do more in getting its facts straight than reporting that Bleach Volume 27 has spent 11 months as the top #1 book when the manga volume mentioned had only been released last month.

I wish I could see into the future like ANN does.


... So... if I happen to like one of those anime your posted, I'm stupid? And anime fans have just recently become stupid for liking popular series? And anime is not a form of animation to be lumped with anything else because it comes from the holy land known as Japan? And Megatokyo's forums have been around since I was 3 years old, and in that case they SO set the standard to how we all should deal with people who aren't obsessive.

You, good sir, make me laugh for posting some weird otaku rules in an thread that didn't even call for them.

In the spirit of the thread I just can't help but wonder: What would Rorschach do?
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doctordoom85



Joined: 12 Jun 2008
Posts: 2093
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 6:07 pm Reply with quote
Let me get this straight, Megatokyo began around 20 years ago?

Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing

I won't even get into calling fans of certain series "stupified".....
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Colonel Wolfe



Joined: 05 Aug 2004
Posts: 370
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 6:16 pm Reply with quote
animehermit wrote:
Colonel Wolfe wrote:
some nonsensical BS, in triplicate


not even gonna bother


I never said anything like that at all ...

littlegreenwolf wrote:
Colonel Wolfe wrote:
animehermit, as anyone will tell you, Japanese anime are not cartoons. 99% of those who frequent ANN just follow the trends and don't treat anime as the series cultural event that anime fans from Japan take them in.

The recurring problem I've seen from those who post here on the forums are fans who are into anime simply for the popularity of the genre.

I can tell you that if you head over to the forums at Megatokyo, a community that has dedicated itself to Japanese anime, which has serviced the online community for over 20 years, a lot longer than ANN, that you'll find yourself getting flamed and banned for suggesting such a thing.

Shows such as Bleach, One Piece, Pokemon, Digimon, Naruto and others like that just show how stupified American anime fans have become.

There is just so much anime out there that is considered more serious than those I mentioned. I just think that ANN needs to do more in getting its facts straight than reporting that Bleach Volume 27 has spent 11 months as the top #1 book when the manga volume mentioned had only been released last month.

I wish I could see into the future like ANN does.


... So... if I happen to like one of those anime your posted, I'm stupid? And anime fans have just recently become stupid for liking popular series? And anime is not a form of animation to be lumped with anything else because it comes from the holy land known as Japan? And Megatokyo's forums have been around since I was 3 years old, and in that case they SO set the standard to how we all should deal with people who aren't obsessive.

You, good sir, make me laugh for posting some weird otaku rules in an thread that didn't even call for them.

In the spirit of the thread I just can't help but wonder: What would Rorschach do?


I never said anything like that. I'm merely stating that ANN members seem to follow the trend of anime that is more popular and oftentimes misses out on a lot of the great anime that is out there.

Appearance to the contrary, anime isn't just Pokemon or Naruto. That represents a very narrow view of the culture of anime if you believe that.

Gunbuster, the original Bubblegum Crisis OVA series, the original Mobile Suit Gundam, Riding Bean OVA, Macross, Love Hina. These anime are often swept aside as trash, as is evident by a lot of the reviews conduted by online anime news sites in favor of those anime and manga shows like Bleach, Naruto and Pokemon that require very little intelligence to follow.

I remember that this trend started out with Sailor Moon when some high school students saw that there was a small group of people watching something from Japan called anime and when it started appearing on notebooks, bookbags, etc, they decided to start collecting it because it was a fashion statement.

This is the problem with anime fans these days. They look at such shows as Naruto and One Piece thinking that's all there is while dismissing all other anime that is out there.

Just look at how falsely anime and manga sales are reported ...
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Cait



Joined: 29 May 2008
Posts: 503
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 6:35 pm Reply with quote
*scratches head*

Uh, I don't even know where to begin here. The people that frequent ANN are from a wide range of demographics. I'm sorry that it seems to offend you that Pokemon and Naruto are so popular, but they appeal to a very specific demographic, which also just happens to be the biggest demographic of animated popular culture in the US: children. To balk at the kids shows as "trends" and only accept the legitimacy of "adult" programming is not only arrogant, it is denying the very "reality" that you are so very diligently trying to "educate" us with. The biggest demographic of comics, graphic novels, anime, manga, or whatever you want to call it is young people, regardless of what you want to believe.

But putting that completely aside, ANN is not full of children. In fact, of the majority of the online communities I have found myself a member of over the 10+ years I have used the internet, ANN has been the place where I've felt the most maturity (most of the time), the most imtelligent conversations about popular culture and the most varied in the tastes and interests of its many members. I really don't know where you get off insulting the entire site for posting a news bite (and that's all it is, one little piece of interesting anime/manga related news), that according to your previous post here, you didn't even seem to get the facts straight regarding. BLEACH 27 displaced Watchmen at #1 this month. Watchmen was the title that was #1 for 11 months.
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Adacus



Joined: 26 Apr 2009
Posts: 10
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 8:21 pm Reply with quote
Quote:
But why do we even need to keep only to American and Japanese comics? V for Vendetta for example was originally published in England under an old, now defunct comic publisher, and titles such as Marjane Satrapi's Persepolis are in the same non-fictional vein as Spielgelman's Maus. Persepolis is a title that's I'd love to see at #1 over here and I think the whole country could benefit from reading it.


Yes, I agree. I will also like to see the French TinTin and the English Eagle on that list, though that will never happen.

Damn it.
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bahamut623



Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 1463
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 9:58 pm Reply with quote
Adacus wrote:
Quote:
But why do we even need to keep only to American and Japanese comics? V for Vendetta for example was originally published in England under an old, now defunct comic publisher, and titles such as Marjane Satrapi's Persepolis are in the same non-fictional vein as Spielgelman's Maus. Persepolis is a title that's I'd love to see at #1 over here and I think the whole country could benefit from reading it.


Yes, I agree. I will also like to see the French TinTin and the English Eagle on that list, though that will never happen.

Damn it.


Never say never. Spielberg's making a TinTin movie, so it just might make an appearance on that list within the next few years.
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britannicamoore



Joined: 05 Dec 2005
Posts: 2618
Location: Out.
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 10:06 pm Reply with quote
bahamut623 wrote:


littlegreenwolf wrote:
britannicamoore wrote:
The Xenos wrote:


42nd Street Borders: Manga women's breasts draped across every shelf, every display, littering the aisle. Was offered shojo love and shonen love, but not American comic love. Top selling American comics; like coke in green glass bottles, they don't make them anymore.


Oh my God. It's time we have a thread for Rorschach's Adventures in Anime.


Seriously, the idea is amusing me to no end. I'm wanting to draw up some fanart now. But what section to put the thread in? Would something like this even be allowed?

That would make an excellent webcomic. Someone please do it.


Maybe it could be posted in the Anime thread? It is about anime... Maybe someone can do it like Somerandomguy. Whatever. It just needs to be done.
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LeoKnight25



Joined: 23 Aug 2005
Posts: 319
Location: Puyallup, WA
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 10:41 pm Reply with quote
arachneia wrote:
LeoKnight25 wrote:
I also have to say, in defense of Watchmen's age, yeah, it is 20+ years old but, so what? Has anything in the American comics scene before or since been as thought provoking or deep as that, with the exception of Art Spiegelman's Maus?

Um, Sandman, The Preacher, The Fountain, and Kabuki?

Also, Fables is a pretty fun title. Nowhere near Watchmen in its depth, but it does a fair job deconstructing and retelling age-old tales. I especially recommend 1001 of Snowfall, which is a supplementary issue with insanely beautiful art.


I've never actually read Kabuki. I've seen a few issues here and there but, as long as I've been reading comics (my whole life basically) I've never heard anyone talk about how much they loved Kabuki. I don't think I know of anyone that has read it. Not to say that it isn't influential or deep but, not nearly as well known as Watchmen.

Preacher, I really don't think is too terribly deep and influential, especially compared with Watchmen or the Dark Knight Returns. Even calling Dark Knight deep seems to stretch it a bit, at least in my thinking. I'm not even close to being a fan of Garth Ennis anyway, so I may be biased on that one.

Sandman, I'd forgotten about. I'll give you that one. Neil Gaiman is a great writer and, yeah I'd say it's as influential as Watchmen or Dark Knight.

The Fountain, I've only ever heard of one person that I know of who read it. He liked it a lot, but from my experiences I don't know if I'd call it influential. Deep, I'm sure though.

Fables is one that I'd forgotten as well but, I've never read it either. I've heard great things about it though. But, the only one that I can think of that comes close to either Watchmen or Dark Knight is Sandman.

I think those three titles are some of the most influential comics in our American comics history, with of course the other big guys (Spider-Man, Wonder Woman, Batman, Superman, Hulk, etc.).

Sorry if this is getting a bit off subject.
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Colonel Wolfe



Joined: 05 Aug 2004
Posts: 370
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 11:33 pm Reply with quote
Well, again, I never said that ANN Members were children when it came to anime. Only that when it comes to anime that the vast majority of anime fans are only drawn to simplified anime.

Unfortunately, this includes such anime as Pokemon, Dragonball Z, Sailor Moon, Naruto and the like.

It's just funny how anime fans seem to defend those same simplified anime that they look at as being repetitive and boring.
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Animehermit



Joined: 05 Aug 2007
Posts: 964
Location: The Argama
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2009 11:57 pm Reply with quote
Colonel Wolfe wrote:
Well, again, I never said that ANN Members were children when it came to anime. Only that when it comes to anime that the vast majority of anime fans are only drawn to simplified anime.

Unfortunately, this includes such anime as Pokemon, Dragonball Z, Sailor Moon, Naruto and the like.

It's just funny how anime fans seem to defend those same simplified anime that they look at as being repetitive and boring.

what? not only what you say is false, it doesn't even make any sense.
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