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Kimi ni Todoke (TV).


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David.Seth



Joined: 20 Jan 2009
Posts: 453
Location: near SF
PostPosted: Mon Oct 05, 2009 11:54 pm Reply with quote
Kimi ni Todoke

Trailer/Preview: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aH8pvZKFVYQ

This is the show I've been waiting for. I love the manga, and once I heard it was getting the anime treatment, I've been waiting for the day. So I guess the first episode airs Oct 6th (tomorrow). Plus its being made by one of my favorite studios, Production IG.

Sure, the story is a bit cheezy, but for some reason I have a soft spot for slice of life/high school romance. Even poorly made ones. Not saying this show will be bad, but check out the premise:
Quote:
Kimi ni Todoke is about a girl named Kuronuma Sawako. She is nicknamed Sadako (from the ring) because many people see her as strange and often mistake her for a ghost. A boy called Kazehaya kun becomes her friend and, to her, is "100% refreshness."

"100% refreshness"? lol but other than that I can't wait.
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tarheel91



Joined: 28 Sep 2008
Posts: 128
PostPosted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 10:52 pm Reply with quote
I'm having trouble making up my mind on how good the first episode was. spoiler[ For the first 4/5 of the show I was convinced it was way too awkward/cheesy for your standard popular boy x shy girl who admires him stuff. However, the fact that he's had a crush on her that whole time changes everything, and makes it all fall into place much more easily.] I guess I'll wait and see. It looks good. Granted, not Bokura Ga Ita good, but still good.

Last edited by tarheel91 on Tue Oct 13, 2009 1:15 pm; edited 1 time in total
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dtm42



Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 14084
Location: currently stalking my waifu
PostPosted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 12:07 am Reply with quote
The fact that the boy likes the shy/demure girl back is nothing new. Indeed, almost nothing in this show is "new"*, or even all that creative.

But that doesn't matter, because it is quite funny (once I had gotten used to its quirky SD humour), and surprisingly heartwarming. I was happy that the class apologised to her; that was actually unexpected and a really nice touch. It didn't need to be included if the show was just going to follow the standard formula, but they did. The backgrounds are - what's the word I want - "ditzy", with flowers and sparkles and flowery sparkles. That'll take some getting used to, as I don't really have much previous experience with Shoujo.

In the end, it was an enjoyable watch, and that's coming from someone who doesn't normally "do" Romance. Definitely going to watch the next two episodes to give it a proper go. It will be interesting to see if they can keep the show from going stale, or if they used up all their better ideas (such as the Ringu allusions) in the first episode.



*
There is virtually nothing new under the sun, at least in the world of story-telling. Yet, we constantly get reinventions of old genres and such, so in a way there are new things, kind of.
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter



Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Posts: 23669
PostPosted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 6:04 am Reply with quote
I loved it - with the exception of some of the animation style which I occasionally found distracting. For example, one of the female students looked like she had botox lips even in non-chibi form. But from a pure content point of view, I absolutely adored it. True, not innovative in any sense, but the execution of it really appealed to me. It's funny, Kobato and Kimi ni Todoke both feature nice, sweet female leads, but it's working for me much better in the latter case. I think part of it is just the set up that everybody is so scared of poor Sawako and she's actually just the sweetest kid.

Also, Kana Hanazawa as Kobato is doing what I consider the "standard" version of a nice anime girl whereas Mamiko Noto's Sawako feels a bit more off the beaten path to my ears and thus fresher.

Anyway, barring some unforseen drop in content quality, I'm sure I'm in until the end on this one.
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dtm42



Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 14084
Location: currently stalking my waifu
PostPosted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 7:21 am Reply with quote
You're not stalking me, are you Blood-? I swear you seem to pop up in the same series discussion threads that I do. Maybe we just share similar tastes? Is that even remotely possible? Can you use those words in a sentence like that? Will I stop asking questions?

Anyway, good to see you like Kimi ni Todoke. I too find Sawako sweet. And though in one sense she's a bit too shy for story/believability purposes (it's always "I'm not good enough"), I'm sad to say that I don't think her inner thoughts are actually all that unrealistic. People really do obsess like that, and some teenagers really can feel that worthless.

That raises an interesting point. Could the show have worked if Sawako was suicidal like so many lonely Japanese teenagers? I'm not talking about the humour (obviously the show's brand would never work in such a dark setting), and I'm in no way saying the show doesn't work as it is now (it does, so far). But still, might a good show have come out of Sawako being suicidal? Maybe not; although her rescue would carry more emotional weight, Kazehaya would then have to have problems just as bad as her to stop it descending into a "Prince Charming" type story. Of course, then it would either turn into a Welcome to the NHK clone or just collapse under the collective angst. Bugger. I was so close.

You know what, don't mind the above paragraph, it was just me pondering out loud. I like the show how it is now, and I hope it can carry on being a sweet and quirky. Save the depressing stuff for another work. Yeah, that's positive thinking.
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter



Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Posts: 23669
PostPosted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 8:49 am Reply with quote
dtm42 wrote:
You're not stalking me, are you Blood-? I swear you seem to pop up in the same series discussion threads that I do.


Well, OF COURSE, I'm stalking you, you burning hunk of Kiwi studliness! Wink As a matter of fact, the only reason I haven't invaded the sanctity of your Tokyo Magnitude 8.0 thread is that I'm still working through the eppies.

But seriously. I'm watching virtually every new show this fall, so don't be surprised to see me in any other discussion threads that pop up.

And yes, I think there is a version of Kimi ni Todoke where Sawako is suicidal that could work but I am profoundly thankful it isn't the one on the table. I don't mind being taken to uncomfortable places - that's one of the charms of anime; a suddenly sunny day can get really, really dark, really, really fast - but I also like the occasional series that says, "Hey man, relax...this is going to be a fun little gentle ride, so check your anxieties at the door."
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tarheel91



Joined: 28 Sep 2008
Posts: 128
PostPosted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 10:15 am Reply with quote
dtm42 wrote:
The fact that the boy likes the shy/demure girl back is nothing new. Indeed, almost nothing in this show is "new"*, or even all that creative.

But that doesn't matter, because it is quite funny (once I had gotten used to its quirky SD humour), and surprisingly heartwarming. I was happy that the class apologised to her; that was actually unexpected and a really nice touch. It didn't need to be included if the show was just going to follow the standard formula, but they did. The backgrounds are - what's the word I want - "ditzy", with flowers and sparkles and flowery sparkles. That'll take some getting used to, as I don't really have much previous experience with Shoujo.

In the end, it was an enjoyable watch, and that's coming from someone who doesn't normally "do" Romance. Definitely going to watch the next two episodes to give it a proper go. It will be interesting to see if they can keep the show from going stale, or if they used up all their better ideas (such as the Ringu allusions) in the first episode.



*
There is virtually nothing new under the sun, at least in the world of story-telling. Yet, we constantly get reinventions of old genres and such, so in a way there are new things, kind of.


spoiler[I wasn't trying to suggest that him liking her was original, only that it changed how I viewed the course of events in the show. It seemed overly cheesy/awkward not knowing that important detail, but it all seemed to come together once that was explained.]

And I agree (as does modernism), there really isn't anything "new" when it comes to stories. Everything is just twists of something that's been done before. That's why what we care about is how the story is told.


Last edited by tarheel91 on Tue Oct 13, 2009 1:15 pm; edited 1 time in total
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David.Seth



Joined: 20 Jan 2009
Posts: 453
Location: near SF
PostPosted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 12:50 pm Reply with quote
tarheel91 wrote:
Granted, not Bokura Ga Ita good, but still good.


While I liked Bokura Ga Ita, it was just a bit too slow for my tastes, and I wasn't a fan of how it ended. I can see a lot of similarities between Bokura Ga Ita and Todoke, but Todoke stands out for me because of the characters (well, at least what I've read in the manga... we will have to see how the anime handles it).
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censored666



Joined: 09 Oct 2009
Posts: 9
PostPosted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 11:24 pm Reply with quote
I only saw the first 10 minutes, and around the final 8 minutes, but I found Kimi Ni Todoke to be rather sweet and endearing. The animation was gorgeous, the art impeccable, and the muic...Well, I danced around to the opening theme for about half an hour and the closer was rather so-so as was the BGM. It was certainly rather funny how almost everyone could mistake such a sweet soul like Sawako as some freak of nature, but this can be realistic of how some people only notice a persons outisde appearance without knowing what's on their inside. Sawako's budding relationship with ( I forget his name...) was also rather poignant, and how the episode ended was rather unconventional.

However, it seems as if this revelation came rather fast, so I am wondering how they can get enough mileage out of this premise without becoming too boring, which could very well be the case since both of the leads are so nice. Nice isn't bad at all, but in the world of anime I wanna see some teeth gritting together, a slap across the face, and enough tears to fill an ocean.
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Wervyn



Joined: 23 Oct 2003
Posts: 14
PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2009 3:53 pm Reply with quote
I found the episode tedious, trite, and honestly incredibly disappointing given how well it was reviewed in the preview. It's not a matter of originality, since there is after all nothing new under the sun, including paraphrases from Ecclesiastes. It is, more, a matter of amateurish story execution, apparently targeted at an audience assumed to lack even the most basic capacity for romantic subtlety. To turn a cliche, this anime is telling, not showing, and that sucks all the enjoyment out of it. We spend far too much time listening to Sawako's banal and incessant inner monologue explaining every detail of her feelings, and every word of it is completely redundant. Her feelings are obvious just to look at her, almost painfully so, and so when the show won't shut up about them and let the visuals and the atmosphere do the talking, it's actually insulting the intelligence of its viewers.

I have a feeling I've gotten spoiled on slice-of-life romance after watching the absolutely brilliant Cross Game. But the contrast between the two is striking. Watch a few episodes of Cross Game and count the number of times the director feels the need to TELL us what a character is thinking. It's damn near close to zero. And yet, the amount and quality of the information we get about characters' thoughts, just by observing their actions and expressions, far exceeds what we get from Kimi no Todoke.

In short, one big meh, I'll give this one a pass.

"High school romance is so last season."
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Blood-
Bargain Hunter



Joined: 07 Mar 2009
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2009 9:44 pm Reply with quote
Bye. Don't let the door smack your ass on the way out. Rolling Eyes
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David.Seth



Joined: 20 Jan 2009
Posts: 453
Location: near SF
PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2009 11:51 pm Reply with quote
dtm42 wrote:

In the end, it was an enjoyable watch, and that's coming from someone who doesn't normally "do" Romance.


Blood- wrote:
I loved it.... barring some unforeseen drop in content quality, I'm sure I'm in until the end on this one.


I really liked the first episode too. Glad that theres a few people who seem to like this show. I went to a few other forums and most people either felt it was "meh" at best or out right hated it. Maybe I just haven't seen enough slice of life shoujo romance to get burned out yet Laughing

Wervyn wrote:

I have a feeling I've gotten spoiled on slice-of-life romance after watching the absolutely brilliant Cross Game. But the contrast between the two is striking. Watch a few episodes of Cross Game and count the number of times the director feels the need to TELL us what a character is thinking. It's damn near close to zero. And yet, the amount and quality of the information we get about characters' thoughts, just by observing their actions and expressions, far exceeds what we get from Kimi no Todoke.


I can understand why you see Kimi ni Todoke as "meh", but comparing it to Cross Game is a little unfair. CG has 39 episodes to tell its story, while KnT only has 12. CG is, to me, primarily a sports anime, with a little bit of romance thrown in (although it could focus more on that later, who knows). But KnT is primarily a high school romance (albeit a lighthearted one), and thus wastes no time. I just see them as two completely different series. That and sometimes it takes a series two or three episodes to get good. I know when I saw the first episode of Kaiba, I was really weird-ed out with the story and visuals to the point that I almost dropped it at that. But I stuck with it, and now its one of my all time favorites. But that's just me.
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egoist



Joined: 20 Jun 2008
Posts: 7762
PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2009 12:56 am Reply with quote
tarheel91, your first post could spoil the whole first episode.
_
This anime reminds me of The Wallflower, except for all the reversed harem and that the protagonist's personality is totally different, among many other huge differences.
I don't understand why's everyone so afraid of such a girl. But hell, if you're looking for anime that makes sense you won't find many.
Overall, I like this show and I'll keep watching it.
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Wervyn



Joined: 23 Oct 2003
Posts: 14
PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2009 1:45 am Reply with quote
David.Seth wrote:
I can understand why you see Kimi ni Todoke as "meh", but comparing it to Cross Game is a little unfair. CG has 39 episodes to tell its story, while KnT only has 12. CG is, to me, primarily a sports anime, with a little bit of romance thrown in (although it could focus more on that later, who knows). But KnT is primarily a high school romance (albeit a lighthearted one), and thus wastes no time. I just see them as two completely different series. That and sometimes it takes a series two or three episodes to get good. I know when I saw the first episode of Kaiba, I was really weird-ed out with the story and visuals to the point that I almost dropped it at that. But I stuck with it, and now its one of my all time favorites. But that's just me.


I don't mean to dump on everyone's happy parade, and I certainly don't intend to make an appearance every week to diss it, since who needs that kind of hypocrisy ("If you hate the show so much why do you keep watching it?"). I'm just expressing a differing opinion, since for some reason this was an itch I really wanted to scratch.

I think you're misunderstanding my complaint, though. I didn't actually have a problem with the show's pacing, so much as its timing, or rather delivery. I brought up Cross Game because I began watching that for the same reason I gave Kimi ni Todoke a shot: favorable reviews indicating something that might be really special. For Cross Game it absolutely paid off; for this, I couldn't help feeling let down. But my general experience is that shorter, 12-13 episode series are by and large of higher quality than longer-running shows, precisely because they don't have time to fool around. Would it be unfair to compare the romantic subtlety on display here to that of Spice and Wolf or Bakemonogatari, because the shows are too different to compare? Or at a certain point, is that just an excuse for mediocrity?

It's not that I think the story is moving too fast, either. Honestly the idea of a show hooking up the main romantic couple at the front and then exploring how their relationship evolves is incredibly appealing to me, because you just don't see that very often in anime. Too many directors seem obsessed with the supposed romantic tension of will she/won't he dithering that they drag that nonsense out for the whole show. So assuming Kazehaya and Sawako don't get stuck at "almost in a relationship" for the next 10 episodes, then I don't expect I'd have any problem with that.

What I do have a problem with is Sawako just not shutting up (and her CV isn't doing that any favors either). It's not that I have any particular trouble accepting that a lonely, angsty teenage girl would be thinking like that, even if it is goofy. It's that the show doesn't need to tell me what I can already see plainly. That effort would have been much better spent on art direction and cinematography to visually convey emotions, than needlessly filling up space by taking the lazy way out of character exposition. In other words, this is a show where I'm convinced that I could out-direct the director, and those always end up being particularly frustrating for me. I can never escape the feeling that a show that could be and by all rights should be quite good, is being cheapened by incompetent storytelling. See: Elfen Lied.

Of course my version would probably be the one where Sawako is suicidal, and Kazehaya ends up rescuing her from depression but then ultimately pushes her over the edge at the end of a rocky relationship, because I'm just dark like that. Or maybe that's too depressing and I'd have it all work out somehow. But that's neither here nor there, since again, it's all in the execution.

ADDENDUM: Since I'm still sorting through the offerings this season, I just now got around to Sasameki Koto and found it a perfect counterpoint to the kind of problem I'm describing here. Overall a much better executed first episode that sets things up with a minimum of unnecessary dialogue (or monologue, as the case may be). I dunno, it's probably a matter of taste, but I like it when an anime shows me that character A likes character B (who likes character C who likes character A), rather than telling me.

"Or maybe it's just that I have a thing for tsundere."
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David.Seth



Joined: 20 Jan 2009
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2009 2:24 am Reply with quote
lol ok thanks for clearing that up. And I have to agree with you that most 12 episode series tend to be better than longer, drawn out ones (although Maison Ikkoku, at 90somethin episodes, is friggin awesome... but i digress). Anyway, if I can remember clearly (which I can not at all) the manga had a lot of her inner dialouge stuff so theres a good chance the anime will be the same way. Dunno.
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