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sainta wrote:

Man the character designer from Fafner needs to change a bit. For a second I saw Kira greeting Shinn Laughing

Welcome to Hirai. Enjoy your stay.

But seriously. Guy was great in the 90s/ Early 2000s and then SEED happened. I think the character designs just got lazy around then. Space Prince does look it might still retain some same-face but does look different enough from SEED.

Also;

Quote:

Fafner -
2004-07-04 to 2004-12-26

Quote:

SEED Destiny -
2004-10-09 to 2005-10-01

Fafner came first. So technically, Shinn is from Fafner.

himono.onna wrote:

Is "Episode 0" of Un-go not on the discs? That would be unfortunate.

Episode 0 is included in the release.

Quote:

Over the last few years, it seems like NEETs and hikikomori have become increasingly vogue in anime, so much so that I sometimes worry it's becoming a shtick. Sometimes they've been used as the subject of derision, but more often than not, they've been cast in a strangely, charmingly positive light, as unconventional heroes and beacons of nerd pride.

This is something I just don't get. The whole appeal of such characters/shows boggles my mind. Ok, once or twice it can be funny and be something different. Now though....this phenomenon just confounds me. As time has gone on and more examples of such characters/shows have come around I see such characters as just.....bland I suppose is an apt word. I just don't get the "charmingly positive" aspect of such characters as I personally just don't see the appeal of such characters beyond a certain point. I know it's just my own view on life probably skewing my opinion but such characters just seem like they're.....not whole I guess. I often look to determine if I like or dislike a character but with these types of characters I feel like I keep looking and keep looking but never get a straight answer. As if there's not enough to them for me to truly decide if I like them or not. Given the fact you labeled the show actually Shelf Worthy though I suppose I might give it a chance. See if it intrigues me enough to sit through it all.

As for the Fafner movie.....I love my mechs and explosions. I however did not get into the series. I only gave it an average rating myself on MAL. I suppose part of the problem was I had been soured by watching Gundam Seed BEFORE Fafner. I know they have 0 to do with each other really but the same character animation coupled with both shows involving mechs more then likely had me go into Fafner with a sour note. It's been long enough I should probably re-watch Fafner and give it a real chance.

Quote:

Over the last few years, it seems like NEETs and hikikomori have become increasingly vogue in anime, so much so that I sometimes worry it's becoming a shtick. Sometimes they've been used as the subject of derision, but more often than not, they've been cast in a strangely, charmingly positive light, as unconventional heroes and beacons of nerd pride.

I do think that how Japanese society at large views unemployed people as useless and incompetent (if you're unemployed it's your own fault etc.) is problematic. Using neets as characters in animes though seems to be mostly for identification purposes ... a large number of otakus are supposedly neets and/or hikikomoris. Maybe there is also a certain part of wishfulfillment / rebelliousness, because these characters are capable of living and doing meaningful things without corresponding to the way a "good adult" is supposed to be.

In this particular case, the author of Heaven's Memo Pad was / is a Neet himself.

maaya wrote:

Quote:

Over the last few years, it seems like NEETs and hikikomori have become increasingly vogue in anime, so much so that I sometimes worry it's becoming a shtick. Sometimes they've been used as the subject of derision, but more often than not, they've been cast in a strangely, charmingly positive light, as unconventional heroes and beacons of nerd pride.

I do think that how Japanese society at large views unemployed people as useless and incompetent (if you're unemployed it's your own fault etc.) is problematic. Using neets as characters in animes though seems to be mostly for identification purposes ... a large number of otakus are supposedly neets and/or hikikomoris. Maybe there is also a certain part of wishfulfillment / rebelliousness, because these characters are capable of living and doing meaningful things without corresponding to the way a "good adult" is supposed to be.

In this particular case, the author of Heaven's Memo Pad was / is a Neet himself.

I did forget to consider the social implications and attitudes toward neets/hiki etc in Japan in my evaluation of them as characters. I suppose at the heart of it one big issue I have, beyond just figuring out if I like/dislike a character, is that I find such characters just seem like filler. But in character form. We all know filler episodes in anime. Some can be worthwhile, most often just are there to fill out the episode block on larger shows. Characters like this feel like filler characters in a sense. It's like they're simply just "there" for lack of a better word. Not sure if I'm making sense or not. Finding it hard to put into words really. Such character types can be useful in the right situation as can any character type. The problem with this character type is you don't really have ti put much effort into them and you can get away with it, If they're bland or pointless or lack depth it's fine as that fits the character type. It gives producers an excuse to be lazy if they wanted to and nobody would argue too much as the lack of depth would fit the character type. Again, not sure if I'm putting into words my thoughts in a concise manner right now. Rather tired actually so I'll leave it at that for now and try again tomorrow if needed once my mind is refreshed.

maaya wrote:

In this particular case, the author of Heaven's Memo Pad was / is a Neet himself.

As was the author of Welcome to the NHK. On the other hand, the author of Eden of the East probably wasn't one seeing how NEETS only became useful after spoiler[being stripped naked and sent out to sea for about a week. Something of a metaphor, you think?]

And Welcome to the NHK was about overcoming such tendancies, certainly not glorifying them, enshiring them into one moe idol to be worshipped. Well, that was the most that I got out of the show. That and attempted suicide is really easy to get over {Raise palm, slap over face...now}.

I'm skipping over the dub as there wasn't much going for it in the original language.

Un-Go I'm watching, I'm two episodes into it and confused to all hell. The first episode was one of the "well, that makes sense no one noticed that" mystery variety {The thing I was focusing on was more along the lines of "OK, who's our main characters?" I was more wrong there, sad to say}" but the second one...

Half of it was a mix of "wait, didn't you know that so and so was this important person that did this or had this habit?" and "of course you know what that fictional event was, don't pretend that you didn't", well, I can't call them clues as it barely passes the classification of Relevant Information, factoids and the other half?

Duh-ductions. Yes, yes, I recognized the voice fifteen minutes before our detective went "a-Ha!". Yes, yes, it's all a conspiracy, wasn't that obvious from the start? I mean, "War" was mentioned more than a few times, in regards to a Pop Idol group {Really, Japan?}...

As for the whole Demon truth thing, I thought it was kinkier when Wonder Woman did it with her lasso. And she got off on it more to boot. I mean, she got more out of it...

I'll continue watching it but it's not much of a mystery series for me right from the start. If it gets worse... I have no clue what that could mean.

Fafner's on my watch list and I'll get around to sooner than later. Then the movie, maybe.

Psycho 101 wrote:

Characters like this feel like filler characters in a sense. It's like they're simply just "there" for lack of a better word. (...) The problem with this character type is you don't really have ti put much effort into them and you can get away with it, If they're bland or pointless or lack depth it's fine as that fits the character type.

Yea, I think I see what you mean. I suppose a character who's a neet somehow has a higher risk of becoming boring and unremarkable. But overall it's maybe more a problem with the writing in general. A good writer can make any kind of character engaging ... for example Tsukimi in Princess Jellyfish probably qualifies as a neet, but I wouldn't call her a filler ^^

She is not a NEET, she is a hikkomori, and I dont she what is so hard to grasp about that. A hikkomori is someone who basically shuts themselves away in their room away from the world, generally out of some fears or confidence issues. However, that does not mean they dont necessarily do anything.

On the flip side a NEET can walk about Tokyo and mingle with people just fine. Now one can in theory be both, but that is not always the case. I would say the main girl is just a hikkomori, although arguably a couple of the guys like Sarge could be construed to be NEETs.

I dont get the rating on UN Go, so because the show could have been great but was only good, its only a rental. Half the shows you have in shelf worthy section are merely good not great. Heaven's memo pad certainly isnt a masterpiece. It seems like you are going out of your way to punish Un Go because it didn't not meet some of your expectation.

CrownKlown wrote:

She is not a NEET, she is a hikkomori, and I don't she what is so hard to grasp about that. A hikkomori is someone who basically shuts themselves away in their room away from the world, generally out of some fears or confidence issues. However, that does not mean they don't necessarily do anything.

The way I see it, most hikkomori are a sub-group of NEET. Some hikkomori might have jobs that they can do online (such as website design and maintenance), but generally they are not in work or education and therefore fit the NEET definition.

Sago wrote:

stardf29 wrote:

Okay, I have to ask this: Is Steven Foster really this really bad dub director that makes mediocre or bad dubs 90% of the time like everyone seems to make him out to be, or are people just hard on him because he made a handful of really, really bad dubs?

His most infamous work was the complete rewrite of Ghost Stories into a crazy parody (whether it's funny or not depends on who you ask) and, while none of his other dubs ever got to *that* extreme, it's a nice "signalizer" of how he rolls.

I actually heard somewhere that was a request of the Japanese licensor, but I don't really have anything to back that up so make of that what you will.
Personally I refuse to watch anything directed by him any more after watching High School of the Dead of all things. The actors are fine, but the changes to the script completely change the motivations and attitudes some of the characters have. Plus he ommitted the "I'm Wet!!" dialogue.
As for Heaven's Memo Pad I really liked it, although episode 1 and episodes 10-12 were much better due to the more serious subject matter.

give saw both un-go & memo pad yet dub are ok to watch.

in un-go with neves as inga oh my really she been chew the dub so much yea so hammy to hear it besides really after hearing her on
Majikoi is one thing while un-go now that different story.

give recall she did 4 mamiko noto's dub characters yea really she expand more in these days.

while on memo pad yep Hilary Haag did it again give saw some time ago the dub was ok sure of sorts.

yea those 2 worth a dub watch.

Lynx Amali wrote:

sainta wrote:

Man the character designer from Fafner needs to change a bit. For a second I saw Kira greeting Shinn Laughing

Welcome to Hirai. Enjoy your stay.

But seriously. Guy was great in the 90s/ Early 2000s and then SEED happened. I think the character designs just got lazy around then. Space Prince does look it might still retain some same-face but does look different enough from SEED.

Also;

Quote:

Fafner -
2004-07-04 to 2004-12-26

Quote:

SEED Destiny -
2004-10-09 to 2005-10-01

Fafner came first. So technically, Shinn is from Fafner.

They used to be friends (Fafner). They later become enemies and finally end as friends (Destiny). It's kind of like Clamp whose characters resemble (Lelouch and Kamui, Syaoran and Suzaku)

DifferentD wrote:

He can't be completely bad at directing dubs because he directed the dub for Clannad.. and the Clannad dub is very good (at least in my opinion).

only the first half of season 1. the second half, the movie and After Story was a different director

Thanks Bamboo, I love reading your work every week. I just ordered Heavens Memo Pad from amazon after reading your review Very Happy

Sago wrote:

stardf29 wrote:

Okay, I have to ask this: Is Steven Foster really this really bad dub director that makes mediocre or bad dubs 90% of the time like everyone seems to make him out to be, or are people just hard on him because he made a handful of really, really bad dubs?

The latter, mostly. He's famous for being a bit too... liberal on his scripts; not like Funimation, who slightly reorganizes how information is given for the sake of naturality, but just making up lines that have nothing to do with what was said in the original. His most infamous work was the complete rewrite of Ghost Stories into a crazy parody (whether it's funny or not depends on who you ask) and, while none of his other dubs ever got to *that* extreme, it's a nice "signalizer" of how he rolls.

People are harsh on him because his bad scripts *really* stand out; unlike other ADR Directors/Writers who might produce a bad script, but at least you can see they tried to make it good. Though I think people blow it out of proportion, as he did some genuinely good dubs -- Clannad was pretty solid (despite some questionable casting choices and pronunciation issues -- neither of which have anything to do with Foster), and Le Chevalier D'Eon was probably one of ADV's best dubs, period. So, yeah. He's infamous, but he can do good when he puts his mind to it.

At least with Ghost Stories, everyone was upfront about it being a rewrite/parody dub. Same with the more localized dub version of Super Milk-chan. No, the cause for the Foster hate stems from older shows that people reasonably expected straight dubs out of, but got "Fosterized." Shows like Orphen (and though Foster didn't direct Revenge, its scripts were written in the same vein), Generator Gawl, the second half of Sorcerer Hunters, eps 7-12 of Those Who Hunt Elves, Saiyuki, and likely others. More recent dubs have either followed those trends of heavy rewrites (Guin Saga), or been lazy "subtitle script read" rushjobs aimed solely at making a dub exist and placating the "no dub no buy" crowds (Demon King Demon King).

In general, the Foster dislike comes from the heavy/liberal rewrites, the lack of caring about name pronunciations, and possibly a dismissive "let's get this POS out the door" attitude. As JesuOtaku put it in another thread, he can do "pure serious" shows like Chevalier or pure comedy/over-the-top shows like Ghost Stories and High School of the Dead, but dubs for shows in the middle of the spectrum (Angel Beats, This Ugly yet Beautiful World) turn into a mess.

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