Forum - View topicNEWS: Handley to Be Sentenced for 'Obscene' Manga in January
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Zin5ki
 Posts: 6680 Location: London, UK |
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The article you sent me primarily focusses on acts involving pairs of agents, though it does briefly mention how self-objectification is in violation of the Second Formulation. However, I must state that I find the Categorical Imperative to be too strong to criminalise solely the perpetrators of the acts in question. To a presumably similar degree it would prohibit a vast multitude of typically excusable activities. To abstain from that which renders oneself a mere means to an end would permit few transient pursuits of pleasure, unless they can be demonstrated as being ends unto themselves. As mentioned by others already, violent video games are one of the several examples of these. A more general point I would make is this: I would first need to accept the metaphysics of Transcendental Idealism —plus other relevant principles from the first Critique— before I could adhere to any moral systems resting upon it. |
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Human_Instrumentality
 Posts: 32 Location: Ontario, Canada |
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And nowadays if they kid can buy the game because of the rating, they'll just go home and download it. But I agree with the M/AO thing. The GTA games are rated M because of the violence and language. Leisure Suit Larry games are rated M as well... yet both games have very obvious sexual undertones (well in LSL it really isnt an 'undertone' lol). The only games I see getting AO ratings are Hentai games or straight out Porn sims, which seems silly considering the vast majority of them are sold online so you need a credit card to buy them anyway. I think the problem is that lawmakers and whatnot can't keep up with how quickly technology is moving forward, and how much more 'modern' games are becoming; where they don't hold back on language, they no longer 'imply' violence, etc. I mean I remember when seeing "damn" in a game was a big deal, LoL. Kids are just exposed to much more, much earlier nowadays, and companies are cashing in on it. The funny thing is it's always the same games that stir the waters; GTA, Call Of Duty, etc when other games are guilty of the same thing. I mean there was a big deal in San Andreas about the 'nude scene' (or picking up prostitutes in general), yet no one made a big deal about the open toplessness (and obvious off camera sex) in God Of War. |
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Jedi Master
 Posts: 400 |
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Regardless of what the artist's intent was, how we react to art is a reflection upon ourselves and helps us to know ourselves better. The problem with censorship, obscenity laws, and other attempts to prohibit art is that it robs us of this chance to define our own sense of individuality. In doing so, such prohibitions rob us of the experience of being human.
I think that preventing mature adults from freely choosing whether or not to view the art and judge it for themselves does more to objectify people.
This attitude of punishing others simply for not being how they "should be" objectifies people. They are not cattle to be herded as some moralist sees fit. People have free will. To deny them that is to deny them their humanity. ---  ---
Okay, Human_Instrumentality caught me. I originally posted the below text then deleted it thinking it might be off topic with the intent to replace it with the section above.
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Human_Instrumentality
Posts: 32 Location: Ontario, Canada |
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Jedi Master
Posts: 400 |
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Naw, it's cool. This'll remind me to be sure before I post. 
Your reply had some good points too. |
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CCSYueh
 Posts: 2707 Location: San Diego, CA |
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My daughter was happy to hit 17, was it?-so I didn't have to accompany her to buy her games. Game Stop asked age all the time. It's the old issue of cash in the register vs holding to the limit. The local news reports busts every 6 months or so when the task force goes out to catch retailers selling cigarettes to minors. THe ones who get cited are the retailers who put money over the law. On games, I see a lot of retailers sticking to it because otherwise they have an irate mom or dad in the store yelling the store sold their precious darling an inappropriate game. I've been in stores to witness the irate parent. It's not pretty. I actually used to see more theaters not care who they sold R-rated tickets to, but now moer of them check. I hate the ratings systems anyway. I frankly never look at them. I took my daughter to the Matrix & Halloween H2O when she was 8. I knew the Halloween franchise was less about sex then violence & The Matrix also looked ok. I was also there with her so we could leave, but I respected her intelligence to handle the material because I taught her to understand things. I told her if she was frightened we'd leave & if she wanted to know how they did any of the special effects, I could explain it to her, but that the movies were all fake & the actors (with few exceptions) live to make other movies. Same with fictional stories. Fictional stories made up out of someone's head aren't real & no real people are harmed in the making of them so where's the damage? |
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wanime4me
Posts: 1 |
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Hello I'm new here. But not to this CH situation. I've been debating it on a different forum.
I've been bashed, face palmed even claim I'm spewing fear and propaganda regarding this case ...even by mods. They also truly believe that anime/manga already published in the US is protected by the 1st Amd. That I have nothing to worry about it after this case is over. I was hoping to get a fresh perspective from you guys if its alright please. I can't prove my opinion with facts because lets face it this is history in the making. I've had a true concern with anime/manga's future as of late. I'm a fan and enjoy the art style anime/manga provides. I even enjoy drawing anime like characters. But I'm definitely against child porn of all forms. Real or fake. I've enjoyed all kinds of legal anime and ever since I learned of this case last December I've been questioning it. Everyone on the forum I visit has already concluded that this man is a child pedo. What really disturbs me is how this whole story is being kept under the radar. More importantly the manga titles that got him thrown in jail. They don't say what they are. Shouldn't it be important to inform the public of what they are or at least the authors? If we're gonna put a guy away lets make sure it is what it is. I'm not comfortable with the "obscene" definition and more importantly a jury deciding it by the Miller Test because they may not like/not certain if it should be classifies as.."art". Anime/manga has all kinds of controversial content. Some that people who don't know what it is not art at all. First CH. Then the stories of adult h-games in japan having content limited to appease a certain group that could soon go as far as geting hentai itself in japan be banned . And now recently the Dragon Ball story that didn't happen long ago. I thought it was the right call to pull it only because of the school it got pulled from..yet I read an article where Mark Thompson, president of the county school board clearly considered some of the scenes in it to be child porn. That kind of mind set really concerns me. Especially with the content shown in anime and hentai . What I fear the most that could come out of this case is the following consequences: 1. More US government control over freedom of speech/expression when it comes to fictional fake material. 2. Potential censorships in anime/manga. 3. Stereotyping anime/manga to being nothing but a bad label. 4. Government possibly shutting down or limiting what can be appropriate to sell when it comes to anime/manga. 5. More potential anime/manga fans paying the price and going to jail just because someone finds an image "obscene". I just don't want to see the wrong people get put in jail over perhaps mistaken content. What do you'll think? Am I going about this whole thing the wrong way or do I have a real reason to feel/think the way I do? |
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GATSU
Posts: 15306 |
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Could be worse. You could get the slammer because some career prosecutor convinced children to lie on the stand.
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CCSYueh
Posts: 2707 Location: San Diego, CA |
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God, he's just going?
This is my complaint on all of these things--people like that DA who are protecting no one. Could anyone believe the crap these kids were saying back then? We had one (The Akiki case) where the kids said the workers killed a giraffe & buried it on the church property. Because one can put one's hands on a giraffe as easily as a dog & no one would notice a freshly dug grave that large & call the cops. Those twins in Canada-the one was deemed low risk, yet they nailed him anyway. That other guy who was nailed for his own stories that he never tried to publish-basically just recording his ideas on a computer. What good does it do hanging crimes like these around the necks of people like Handley or David when there are real threats out there that should be in jail and aren't because the parole officers can't be bothered to search the back yard of a known molester. Why are they creating criminals when they can't even manage the real perverts and predators? All you people who agree with this prosecution: Does protecting the children justify thought police? It's ok to put someone in custody for a fantasy that will never be acted upon? I mean when I'm at the top of an overpass I've been known to wonder "what if there were an earthquake & I were thrown from here?" or "What if a tire blows?" I don't think that makes me suicidal or a murderer if someone is in the car with me. |
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