Forum - View topicNEWS: Manga UK Confirms No DVD for Honey & Clover, 3 Others
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jsyxx
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Do you have the option of releasing something "Not Rated"? Because other wise it is censorship. And "illegal content" in a film is a joke. I know for a fact that a lot of horror films can't make it past the chopping block on DVD over there. Like I said, invest in the freedom of expression maybe. And I disagree with the first guy. Sasami Magical Girls Club is a good show. First Tenchi show with out of the closet yuri as well. |
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Teriyaki Terrier
Posts: 5689 |
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Like I said, it's been several years since I heard any news. Since Viz Media had to lay off tons of people, I am not at all surprized publishing and translating manga takes more time. There is a upside to this though. At least the series wasn't dropped and will be completed some day. |
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Shiroi Hane
Encyclopedia Editor
Posts: 7580 Location: Wales |
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I'm no expert and I'm not about to spend the time becoming one right this moment.
"The British Board of Film Classification is an independent, non-governmental body, which has classified cinema films since it was set up in 1912, and videos since the passing of the Video Recordings Act in 1984 [...] subject to certain exemptions, video recordings offered for sale or hire commercially in the UK must be classified by an authority designated by the Secretary of State" - http://www.bbfc.co.uk/about/ DVDs on sale here must carry a BBFC sticker (Gundam Unicorn has not been BBFC rated and is due to go on sale tomorrow from an online store Beez are setting up. I assume they will be shipping from outside the UK). Ignoring Hentai, there are usually no problems - you get a rating (e.g. PG, 15, 18) you slap it on, you release. Two things can go wrong here: You either get a higher rating than you want in which case you have the option to remove something to get a lower rating. An example of this was a volume of Angelic Layer - it was rated 12 due to "derogatory language referring to physical disability" (i.e. Monica Rial referred to herself as a "retard" in a commentary track). ADV wanted a PG rating to increase potential sales so they beeped her out or something (no actual cuts were made to the episode). Back in the old days Manga would actually do the opposite and intentionally include gratuitous bad language in the script in order to get a higher rating ("fifteening"). There are also mandatory cuts. Examples of this being an episode of Paranoia Agent ("This work was cut. The cut(s) were Compulsory. To obtain this category cuts of 1m 20s were required. [...] Cuts required (on potential harm grounds) to the sight of a child attempting to hang herself, and accompanying subtitles. Cuts in accordance with the Video Recordings Act 1984") and, more recently, an episode of Code Geass (see http://www.mania.com/aodvb/showthread.php?t=100339 for details) It is also possible for a work to be rejected completely, but AFAIK this has only ever been a problem with hentai, e.g. LA Blue Girl (according to the stories, Manga's offices were inspected to make sure their copy of this was securely locked in a safe). Hentai is rare here since even if cuts are not compulsory, the highest rating, R18, means the video can only be sold in licensed sex shops and the market just isn't there. LA Blue Girl Returns for example had both compusory cuts and further cuts to reduce the rating from R18 to 18.
Yes, it is censorship. The country you come from has a different history and different laws. We had Mary Whitehouse. You're probably a lot more likely to be shot while walking down the street. Invest in some gun control laws maybe. |
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Mohawk52
Posts: 8202 Location: England, UK |
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Onizuka666
Posts: 266 Location: U.K |
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Interesting news.
I think that this is really about Manga being perhaps scared to release these titles, in the wake of that new stupid law imagined character-cp law. Ichigo 100% might not pass the BBFC test now (the show is very ecchi anyway), but back when Manga acquired the license, it might have been more viable. Not the kind of anime we should be waving a flag for maybe but some fans love it, and perhaps Manga think it would be a waste of money now. Besides that, I guess any harem show, with even mild sexual themes or jokes is a potential target too. Perhaps going online is a smarter move, where Manga can stream these shows, without any cuts, just the way fans like it, and sticking two fingers up at the BBFC. How they'll turn that into money or physical product is another thing I can't answer though. |
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Shiroi Hane
Encyclopedia Editor
Posts: 7580 Location: Wales |
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The C&JA is new and these titles are so old I'd forgotten they were even announced so that is a non-issue and it comes down to them being unlikely to turn a profit here on DVD. ADV UK tried DTO for a few titles in the same boat including Air Gear.
All four were announced as part of partnership deals (the former two with Viz, the latter two with FUNimation). Jerome has already confirmed that they passed on the FUNimation titles. Neither of the two Viz titles have a dub, which also limits sales (see numerous recent tweets from MangaUK on this topic). [edit]Correction: Ichigo 100% doesn't have a dub but H&C does. I listened to Jerome without double checking[/edit] |
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Reaper gI
Posts: 299 Location: UK |
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Sounded more like lack of dub was the issue. Manga are afraid they won't sell enough to recoup costs. C&J act shouldn't do anything to anything non hentai; it's suposed to be to do with posession of stuff that customs should have stopped. The "contains one of the acts listed in section" *whaterver it was* bit required the image to show masterbation, clear shot of genitals, or a sex act. Also it would require the work as a whole to be obscene and porn (you're not going to change that with a 1s cut) It's the much older and far more vague (well, as it was writen vauge) law about actual CP that they used to cut Geass (we assume, C&J isn't used in their clasification rules at all). CP has to contain indecent rather than obscene content and doesn't need to be pornographic. That fact it had absolutely no context is probably the main reason it was cut, BBFC rules don't like out of context fanservice anyway. |
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Zin5ki
Posts: 6680 Location: London, UK |
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If the anime has a Sterling value of up to £18, the prices are somewhat agreeable. (Provided one's payment method isn't subject to high currency transaction fees, that is.) Tax and holding fees are applied beyond that, increasing the costs very significantly. One of the largest sellers in America allegedly ships international orders in such a way as to (illegally) minimise the chances of taxes being applied, but their shipping rates aren't as competitive as rival stockists. ___ As for the matter of our gratifying and wholly purposeful friends at the BBFC, I am informed that the equally gratifying and purposeful picture format conversion process has a higher effect on local production costs that said board's mandatory censoring process. spoiler[From listening to their publicly-addressed comments in person, I found the stances of our local distribution companies to be far more in favour of casual fansub usage than some of their R1 equivalents. It is not difficult to see why.] |
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Sam Murai
Posts: 1051 |
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I suppose it was only a matter of time until someone decided to eschew a DVD release and go digital-only, but the circumstances here seem to fall under different reasons aside from potential sales. I can understand doing so because of manufacturing costs and such, and perhaps their wanting to test the digital distro-only pool, but I have mixed feelings, as I wonder what their full budget and costs are like to drive them to this point and why they are only doing it with these shows.
I guess they're in this hole since they seem more like a "hand-me-down" distributor that lacks direct contacts with Japanese companies. I also wonder if they got those licenses due to bundle deals or if they genuine thought they would sell well when they got them. Regardless, much of this points to the need of anime distributors to expand the audience/awareness of their titles. Only attracting the same people (and potential customers) can only get you so far. Though such things can be easier said than done with some of the budgets those companies possess. Better spending doesn't hurt, either. |
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Shiroi Hane
Encyclopedia Editor
Posts: 7580 Location: Wales |
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ADV beat them to it by three years:
--edit--
Only for Viz and FUNi titles and not all of those; FMA: Brotherhood was licensed directly from Aniplex in Japan.
For these four titles it is FUNimation and Viz who actually hold the UK licenses. I'm not sure how the distribution/sub-licensing works or whether it is the same for both companies, but we know they were given an option on Sasami and Mamotte and chose not to exercise it. It is probably they haven't yet put any of their own cash on the line for the Viz titles either. Last edited by Shiroi Hane on Sun Jun 20, 2010 6:14 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Ranma87
Posts: 170 |
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The cost of converting NTSC to PAL? Are they serious?
I could convert an episode in about 10 minutes using easily available commercial software. They must be pretty helpless or just plain stupid. |
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Moomintroll
Posts: 1600 Location: Nottingham (UK) |
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Films can be shown without classification in members clubs or private residences (which is why it's perfectly legal to import DVDs from overseas but not to sell them on once they're here). Films can also be shown at public cinemas without classification but only with the approval of the local council (which isn't required if the film is rated).
All countries have legal limits on what can be shown. Including the USA. Incidentally, there are some films that are available uncut in Britain that were either cut or never released at all in the USA because while a BBFC rating ensures that the studio / distributor / retailer / consumer cannot be tried on grounds of obscenity, US releases have no such protection as recent events have demonstrated. In any case, it's only a very small proportion of films that are ever cut (excepting those voluntarily cut by the studios to get a lower age rating) and 99 times out of 100 it's for sexual violence*. The BBFC is a lot less strict regarding nudity, sex, language, drug references and so on than the MPAA is (though, as one might expect, it tends to rate higher for violence than its American counterpart). *: And even then it's contextual - a film dealing seriously with a subject like rape would be highly unlikely to be cut even if it was quite graphic.
The BBFC has consistently moved with the times and its decisions aren't set in stone - pretty well all of the "video nasties" that were famously banned in the 1980s (Driller Killer, Texas Chainsaw Massacre, I Spit On Your Grave, Cannibal Holocaust and so on) have since been re-submitted and are now legally available to buy.
I don't think very many of my fellow countrymen feel terribly oppressed by the BBFC - most of us have better things to do than play utopian libertarian of the wild frontier vs the big bad New World Order. The BBFC has made some bad decisions over the years (most of which have since been reversed) but it gets more flak from the press for being too lenient than it does for being too constrictive, and it has a far lighter touch then the regulators of many other Western nations, particularly with regard to art house stuff. Last edited by Moomintroll on Sun Jun 20, 2010 6:13 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Ranma87
Posts: 170 |
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DVD releases in the United States are not required by law to be rated by anyone, some publishers even make up their own ratings. The only thing they really have to fear is breaking the law with pedo content.
A rating is only required for tv broadcast or theatrical showings, ratings on DVD's are only common on big hollywood releases. Last edited by Ranma87 on Sun Jun 20, 2010 6:30 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Reaper gI
Posts: 299 Location: UK |
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The dubs, and often DVD masters, are hand me downs even if the licence itself isn't. There's a recnt manga coment saying FMA:B is a straight licence off aniplex, but the streaming their doing of it is using FUNi digital copies. Source here: http://www.uk-anime.net/articles/UKATV_Manga_Interview_London_Expo_May_2010/4 Hence we get some stuff licenced first but potentialy have to wait years for a US dub to be made and released before it comes out here. Think I got word on MVM having to wait on a few due to US versions getting delayed (e.g. some of the Media Blasters stuff like Moribito) |
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Shiroi Hane
Encyclopedia Editor
Posts: 7580 Location: Wales |
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Local Councils can also overturn the BBFCs decisions if they have been rated:
--edit--
Summer Wars was delayed pending dub and while Eva 2.x is licensed here, it won't see release until it is licensed and dubbed in the US. --edit-- PS: Some of the links seem to be incorrect in the article; I believe this is where they should point:
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