View previous topic :: View next topic |
Author |
Message |
|
Teriyaki Terrier
Joined: 26 Mar 2008
Posts: 5689
|
Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 3:48 pm
|
|
|
Redlinks wrote: | Ugh, do not like Section23 due to their lack of dubs. I prefer having both language options on my dvds. Eh, I guess it's a good thing it will get some attention here in America. |
My thoughts exactly. I've given up (not by choice mind you, but by sheer reality) that Sentai will ever dub Gintama or even Your Under Arrest, so I really don't care for Sentai much at all.
I know the reasons why they won't be dubbed, so let's not even bother going there. But despite all the talking and what have you, that still doesn't change the reality of the situation at all.
I can't help Sentai, if Sentai can't help me. But whatever, Funimation and Viz Media are more than willing to help,so that is good enough.
|
Back to top |
|
|
dragonrider_cody
Joined: 14 Jun 2008
Posts: 2541
|
Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 4:03 pm
|
|
|
Wow, I'm going to type what I have to say and try quite hard not to offend anyone, but it will be difficult...
First of all, it amazes me how many anime fans are completely out of touch with reality. Do you really think Sentai is not dubbing select series because they don't want to sell more or because they want to anger fans?
NO! They are not dubbing several of their shows for the same reason Funimation or Viz passed many of them over. They don't believe the shows will sell the 5-10K copies they need to just cover the cost of the license and dubbing.
If Sentai could dub every show it licenses and not loose their shirt they would do it. When anime was still going strong in North America ADV dubbed almost everything they got, with the exception of shows they couldn't get separate audio tracks to. In fact, that was their policy.
Of course, back then you had MusicLand, Transworld, Best Buy, Target, and even Walmart at times stocking anime regularly. But times change. MusicLand is gone. FYE/Transworld is on their way to bankruptcy. Target dropped anime. Walmart only carries mainstream shows with TV airings, and Best Buy has cut their selection back drastically (with more cuts on the way). Once again, the selections aren't being cut back out of a sense of malice, it's being done because the sales aren't there.
Many Best Buy stores have cut their movie selection in half. Their testing a new store concept in a couple markets that has a media department that's even smaller. With their limited shelf space, what do you think they are going to sell: the latest summer blockbuster from Paramount or Warner that will sell 60-70 copies per store in the first week, or the latest show from Funimation or Sentai that may sell 4 copies during it's entire lifetime? Why do you think more and more anime series each month are online only?
Anime sales have been sliding for years. It's not because less shows are being dubbed. Less shows are being dubbed because sales are in the toilet. You can't afford to dub a show that's only going to move two or three thousand copies, especially if you don't have a big cash cow like Bleach, Naruto or DragonBall.
Lower prices aren't going to fix anything, because prices are lower than ever and sales still aren't rising. You can get complete series from Sentai, Funimation and Media Blasters for $20-$30, yet it's not helping.
Do we really need to turn every solicitation of a sub-only title into a sub-dub debate? Arguing on a board about the inclusion of a dub isn't going to change anything. They know there are many fans that want dubs. They want to dub the shows. But if the sales aren't there, it isn't going to matter. The only thing that can change that is higher sales, an improved market place, or the support of an international partner in the dubbing. Without any of that, a show isn't going to get dubbed by Sentai. They hate it as much as we do, but it's the reality of the situation.
|
Back to top |
|
|
hissatsu01
Joined: 08 May 2006
Posts: 963
Location: NYC
|
Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 4:12 pm
|
|
|
Good point. However, allow me to make a reasoned rebuttal from the standpoint of the usual no-dub no-sale suspects:
WWWWAAAAAHHHHHH!!!!
|
Back to top |
|
|
dragonrider_cody
Joined: 14 Jun 2008
Posts: 2541
|
Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 4:13 pm
|
|
|
Takeyo wrote: |
Blood- wrote: |
Zalis116 wrote: |
Blood- wrote: | I fansubbed Nyan Koi! when it first came out and basically enjoyed it, |
Silly nitpick, I know. But to me, that says you did some sort of translation, editing, timing, or other fansubbing work with one of the groups that subbed it. Or is that actually the case? |
Ha ha, funny you should pick up on that - I had actually considered changing my wording to avoid confusion but in a fit of laziness, didn't. No, I meant I experienced Nyan Koi! through a fansub, not that I did the fansubbing myself. |
Off topic, but I'm equally bothered by dub proponents who refer to themselves as "dubbers." You know who you are, people.
Slightly more on topic: So S23 is limiting its BD releases to dubs? Bummer. I'm guessing this is due to the higher cost of BD production vs. the lower profit margin on sub-only releases, is that right? |
Actually, since sub-only sets have a lower cost of production, they should have a higher profit margin. If doing sub-only in fact raised costs, everything would be dubbed.
It's probably due to the fact that sub-only blurays are relatively untested in the anime market, with the exception of the failed and over-priced releases from Bandai Visual. Not to mention that Blurays are still only a small fraction of the home video market. As they become more commonplace and finally overtake DVDs, the cost of production should come down and you will probably start to see sub-only sets.
|
Back to top |
|
|
dragonrider_cody
Joined: 14 Jun 2008
Posts: 2541
|
Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 4:14 pm
|
|
|
hissatsu01 wrote: | Good point. However, allow me to make a reasoned rebuttal from the standpoint of the usual no-dub no-sale suspects:
WWWWAAAAAHHHHHH!!!! |
Alright, I have to admit that made me laugh. Thank you brightening my dad just a bit.
|
Back to top |
|
|
GrilledEelHamatsu
Joined: 02 Sep 2009
Posts: 703
|
Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 4:36 pm
|
|
|
Teriyaki Terrier wrote: |
My thoughts exactly. I've given up (not by choice mind you, but by sheer reality) that Sentai will ever dub Gintama or even Your Under Arrest, so I really don't care for Sentai much at all.
I know the reasons why they won't be dubbed, so let's not even bother going there. But despite all the talking and what have you, that still doesn't change the reality of the situation at all.
I can't help Sentai, if Sentai can't help me. But whatever, Funimation and Viz Media are more than willing to help,so that is good enough. |
I ALREADY told you, that they DO dub! It's just that they have to test the waters with shows that have a smaller audience and smaller budget. As you can see, Harem titles make up most of that genre.
Also, as for YUA, First of all, ADV NEVER dubbed YUA movie, and mini specials. They contracted Costal Carolina for its ADR production. They would have to do the same thing again in order for Full Throttle and YUA 2000 to be dubbed.
Why don't you just start to play the guessing game with Section23 instead of expressing your Funimation-fanboy bias? Like I said, Section23 doesn't tell people what they're dubbing, and all ADR production at Seraphrim is done in secret. You don't know if Gintama isn't ever going be dubbed? In fact it could already have been dubbed.
Bottom line: Please get off your "I dislike Sentai because they won't dub everything" soapbox because you have no idea what you arec talking about.
Last edited by GrilledEelHamatsu on Thu Sep 23, 2010 12:35 am; edited 1 time in total
|
Back to top |
|
|
Takeyo
Joined: 25 Mar 2008
Posts: 736
|
Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 5:42 pm
|
|
|
dragonrider_cody wrote: |
Takeyo wrote: | Slightly more on topic: So S23 is limiting its BD releases to dubs? Bummer. I'm guessing this is due to the higher cost of BD production vs. the lower profit margin on sub-only releases, is that right? |
Actually, since sub-only sets have a lower cost of production, they should have a higher profit margin. If doing sub-only in fact raised costs, everything would be dubbed.
It's probably due to the fact that sub-only blurays are relatively untested in the anime market, with the exception of the failed and over-priced releases from Bandai Visual. Not to mention that Blurays are still only a small fraction of the home video market. As they become more commonplace and finally overtake DVDs, the cost of production should come down and you will probably start to see sub-only sets. |
Just to clarify, I was referring to the higher cost of producing physical BDs as opposed to DVDs. Since the usual explanation for a sub-only release (which doesn't bother me at all -- I can't stand watching most dubs) is to reduce production costs for a title with low anticipated sales numbers, my assumption is that the added BD production costs would cut even further into whatever profit would be produced from such a title. Though I haven't made the switch to BD yet (primarily due to not owning an HDTV), I do plan to at some point, so this would ultimately be disappointing for a consumer like me who tends to gravitate towards less popular series.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Blood-
Bargain Hunter
Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Posts: 24099
|
Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 6:38 pm
|
|
|
asimpson2006 wrote: |
Blood- wrote: |
Considering Media Blasters is involved, I'd be more likely to blame their incompetence than blame the show. Gee, take forever to release your title in the outmoded single volume method, then delay the releases continuously all the while never communicating with your customer base as for to why the delays are happening ('coz that's just not "cool" right?) and then scratch your head over poor sales - its the Media Blasters way! |
I wasn't saying it's all of the shows fault. I don't care for Media Blasters way of doing things either. Maybe someone purchase Media Blasters and reform them, but that of course is being optimistic. |
Actually, my preferred scenario is that Media Blasters finally goes down the drain instead of endlessly circling it; Funi and Sentai rescue various titles; and, whomever is responsible for making MB the steaming load of fetid incompetence it is never gets to work in anime distribution again. A win for all concerned, I'd say.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Teriyaki Terrier
Joined: 26 Mar 2008
Posts: 5689
|
Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 7:04 pm
|
|
|
GrilledEelHamatsu wrote: |
Teriyaki Terrier wrote: |
My thoughts exactly. I've given up (not by choice mind you, but by sheer reality) that Sentai will ever dub Gintama or even Your Under Arrest, so I really don't care for Sentai much at all.
I know the reasons why they won't be dubbed, so let's not even bother going there. But despite all the talking and what have you, that still doesn't change the reality of the situation at all.
I can't help Sentai, if Sentai can't help me. But whatever, Funimation and Viz Media are more than willing to help,so that is good enough. |
I ALREADY told you, that they DO dub! It's just that they have to test the waters with shows that have a smaller audience and smaller budget. As you can see, Harem titles make up most of that genre.
Also, as for YUA, First of all, ADV NEVER dubbed YUA movie, and mini specials. They contracted Costal Carolina for its ADR production. They would have to do the same thing again in order for Full Throttle and YUA 2000 to be dubbed.
Why don't you just start to play the guessing game with Section23 instead of expressing your Funimation-fanboy bias? Like I said, Section23 doesn't tell people what they're dubbing, and all ADR production at Seraphrim is done in secret. You don't know if Gintama isn't ever going be dubbed? In fact it could already have been dubbed.
Bottom line: Please get off your "I dislike Sentai because they won't dub everything" soapbox because you have |
Whoa there cowboy, I never said they didn't dub. Somehow, I should have expected this, but of course this being the internet, people like to skip over plain details.
I never ONCE and I mean ONCE said Sentai DOESN'T dub anime. I said they didn't dub Gintama or Your Under Arrest. How in Sam hill does that even remotely translate to Sentai not dubbing anime?
And no I quote on quote "dislike" Sentai because they didn't dub Gintama. And at this time, nothing else. I know that Sentai dubs anime, I never once denied that. However, they don't dub everything. I repeat I know that Sentai dubs anime.
As for Your Under Arrest, I only said it's not dubbed. Do I wish were, yes, but reality is you can't have everything in life just because you want it. But did I ever say ADV dubbed Your Under Arrest? No, in fact I know that Anime Eigo did many years ago.
I know why Sentai doesn't dub everything and like it or not, I've learned to accept that. I don't know if dub series in secret and frankly, it's none of my business to know or even want to know. If Gintama is dubbed, that would be great news, but if not, that is fine as well.
In the history of knowing about Sentai (which is less than a year) I never once said that they didn't dub anime. If anything, I've said they didn't dub a certain series. It's irrational to even think that Sentai doesn't dub anime since there is evidence that they do.
And that is that. By the way, you spoke to the other guy first, not me. This is the first time, I've even written anything to you.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Lord Geo
Joined: 18 Sep 2005
Posts: 2648
Location: North Brunswick, New Jersey
|
Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 7:55 pm
|
|
|
Blood- wrote: | Actually, my preferred scenario is that Media Blasters finally goes down the drain instead of endlessly circling it; Funi and Sentai rescue various titles; and, whomever is responsible for making MB the steaming load of fetid incompetence it is never gets to work in anime distribution again. A win for all concerned, I'd say. |
... Wow. Just wow.
Is this what anime fandom has come to now? Are we really at the point now where people actually want to see anime distributors just die out and disappear, not to mention that they're starting to make it personal and attacking specific people from these companies.
I guess most people on this board don't know that Media Blasters have had distribution issues lately and have only recently started moving their warehouse duties to Right Stuf, much like how Section23 does it now. Of course, Erin's little comments in the past about MB haven't helped out either, comments which John Sirabella himself took offense to,but that's another thing entirely.
Anyway, I weep for fandom if it's truly come to this now...
|
Back to top |
|
|
The Count
Joined: 22 Dec 2008
Posts: 303
Location: Milwaukee,WI
|
Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 8:26 pm
|
|
|
Blood- wrote: | Actually, my preferred scenario is that Media Blasters finally goes down the drain instead of endlessly circling it; Funi and Sentai rescue various titles; and, whomever is responsible for making MB the steaming load of fetid incompetence it is never gets to work in anime distribution again. A win for all concerned, I'd say. |
Hey now I can't have MB disappearing just yet. Who else would licenses Charger Girl Ju-den Chan(and yes I'm serious).
The delays, and the use of the singles system for DVD's is a bit of an annoyance, but they've got a special place in my heart. Now Bandai on the other hand, at this point if they were to...... wait I won't do this.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Blood-
Bargain Hunter
Joined: 07 Mar 2009
Posts: 24099
|
Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 11:20 pm
|
|
|
Lord Geo wrote: |
Blood- wrote: | Actually, my preferred scenario is that Media Blasters finally goes down the drain instead of endlessly circling it; Funi and Sentai rescue various titles; and, whomever is responsible for making MB the steaming load of fetid incompetence it is never gets to work in anime distribution again. A win for all concerned, I'd say. |
... Wow. Just wow.
Is this what anime fandom has come to now? Are we really at the point now where people actually want to see anime distributors just die out and disappear, not to mention that they're starting to make it personal and attacking specific people from these companies.
I guess most people on this board don't know that Media Blasters have had distribution issues lately and have only recently started moving their warehouse duties to Right Stuf, much like how Section23 does it now. Of course, Erin's little comments in the past about MB haven't helped out either, comments which John Sirabella himself took offense to,but that's another thing entirely.
Anyway, I weep for fandom if it's truly come to this now... |
Are you really surprised? Do you think a distributor can consistently screw-up, refuse to communicate with its customers and people are just going to shrug their shoulders and be okay with it? I weep for fandom if the passive bootlickers ever become the norm.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Jozoiscute
Joined: 25 Oct 2007
Posts: 252
|
Posted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 11:23 pm
|
|
|
OK....now I'm REALLY confused........
I thought most otaku HATED dubs.....and yet....a LOT of people here are saying they won't buy a series UNLESS it's dubbed?
WHAAAAAA????
Will you guys make up your mind? LOL! I personally don't mind dubs OR subs....I do believe, however, that if you've illegally seen an entire show already, you should at least TRY to support the industry by buying said series when it's finally licensed here......
|
Back to top |
|
|
GrilledEelHamatsu
Joined: 02 Sep 2009
Posts: 703
|
Posted: Thu Sep 23, 2010 1:15 am
|
|
|
Lord Geo wrote: |
Blood- wrote: | Actually, my preferred scenario is that Media Blasters finally goes down the drain instead of endlessly circling it; Funi and Sentai rescue various titles; and, whomever is responsible for making MB the steaming load of fetid incompetence it is never gets to work in anime distribution again. A win for all concerned, I'd say. |
... Wow. Just wow.
Is this what anime fandom has come to now? Are we really at the point now where people actually want to see anime distributors just die out and disappear, not to mention that they're starting to make it personal and attacking specific people from these companies.
I guess most people on this board don't know that Media Blasters have had distribution issues lately and have only recently started moving their warehouse duties to Right Stuf, much like how Section23 does it now. Of course, Erin's little comments in the past about MB haven't helped out either, comments which John Sirabella himself took offense to,but that's another thing entirely.
Anyway, I weep for fandom if it's truly come to this now... |
I don't want MB to die, but I would like John S to make better business decisions, for starters: Move your HQ out of Manhattan,NY. The property value is way to high out there. Move the HQ to Orange,NJ or newark or something. At least arcoss the bay so that employers will only have to drive 2 hours to the office.
Second , stop distributing singles and switch to complete half seasons like Sentai.
3rd, dub only what you think will sell. Kanokon did not need a dub.
|
Back to top |
|
|
Lord Geo
Joined: 18 Sep 2005
Posts: 2648
Location: North Brunswick, New Jersey
|
Posted: Thu Sep 23, 2010 6:07 am
|
|
|
GrilledEelHamatsu wrote: | I don't want MB to die, but I would like John S to make better business decisions, for starters: Move your HQ out of Manhattan,NY. The property value is way to high out there. Move the HQ to Orange,NJ or newark or something. At least arcoss the bay so that employers will only have to drive 2 hours to the office. |
More than likely, it might be more cost-effective to stay where they are right now instead of moving somewhere else and having to adjust to the new place, potentially causing more delays.
Quote: | Second , stop distributing singles and switch to complete half seasons like Sentai. |
Sirabella has already said that Kanokon would be the last show the be done via singles; in fact, Kanokon's disappearance from the schedule might mean that the show will just transfer over the sets before finishing up as singles.
Quote: | 3rd, dub only what you think will sell. Kanokon did not need a dub. |
You have to take a chance and think that something might sell enough to warrant a dub. They thought that Kanokon would sell but it apparently didn't work out. Hindsight is always 20/20.
|
Back to top |
|
|
|